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EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card

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aberkae
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/21 20:18:54 (permalink)
New World menu patched with fps cap to prevent gpu from bricking.


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squall-leonhart
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/21 20:21:09 (permalink)
Intoxicus
deathlessdd
Class action Lawsuit incoming? Game kills 100s of 3090s for unknown reasons...



Do people not realize that part of the EULA/ToS is a section where you agreed they're not liable for these kinds of things?
It's super duper standard to include clauses like that.


Those clauses are not enforceable.

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kevinc313
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/21 20:21:24 (permalink)
If you put a PSU into protect mode, you'll get a single quick flash of all three lights, then no power.  Have to unplug the PSU to reset.  Just an FYI, before anyone has a heart attack.
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/21 20:26:46 (permalink)
Chasteeny
From all I've read, it isn't a temp related failure. Seems like a load ramping failure, from transient voltage fluctuations. Possible this game in particular is going from very low load environment to very high load back and forth, likely not aided by the boosting algo. Who can say for certain though without a statement from EVGA or a dissecting a board themselves, all else is speculation, I'm certainly no expert. 
 
Also possible Kev is right, we need to get a paste change every 10,000 frames, may as well rotate your pads while you got the hood up. And be sure to swap output ports from time to time to keep the wear balanced.




I lol'd.  Recently had a problem with a 3080 Ti FTW3 putting a 1300w Seasonic Prime into protect power off, one of the times was ramping into Control at 4K total max settings, full power OC.  From cutscene, a half second into gameplay *poof*. So clearly the PSU thinks it's going into a dead short or something when it sees a transition like that.  No permanent damage.
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/21 20:29:54 (permalink)
ChaseRandall


I just changed my gear out to a new case, and plugged all 3 power cables in, and when I booted up one of them had a red light over them and wouldn't start up. I switched the cables around a bit and it started up just fine. What do you think?




Bad connection or multi rail PSU causing problems.
Sajin
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/21 20:31:57 (permalink)
squall-leonhart
Sajin
If you want to play with vsync off then you should be able to with the card being able to handle it. If the card can’t handle it then it isn’t designed correctly.



I'm glad to see you on the right side of this Sajin.



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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/21 20:36:36 (permalink)
I'll just throw this at the wall and hope it helps in anyone's troubleshooting or exploration of the issue.
Just finished playing NW for the night, had GPU-Z recording for the session (about 2.5 hrs). Here's some of what I encountered.
 
3090 FTW3 Ultra (+1000 mem, +55 clock, Target and voltage maxed, fan curve 100% @ 65C)
8700K @ 5.2Ghz
3200Mhz mem
RMx1000 PSU
I have vsync and gsync enabled in Nvidia CP. Capped at monitor 60hz refresh.
4K resolution using the "Very High" preset with little else changed from that. (vsync disabled in game)
 
Board Power Draw
Max: 497.2W (PCIE 80.6W, 8-pin #1 146.5W, #2 139.3 W, #3 118.4W)
Average: 397.3W
 
GPU Voltage
Max: 1.1v (Occurred for multiple readings at various power draws between 225w - 430w)
Average: 1.056v
 
Temperatures
GPU Max: 73.4C
Memory Max: 84C
GPU Average: 65.9C
Memory Average: 77.5C
 
Seeing these numbers, there may be some merit to Jay's thesis about using the rabbit ear'd cables and PSU's rated towards the recommended minimum coupled with an OC'd CPU and GPU. New World seems to tax both the GPU and CPU more than any recent game I know of. (CPU average temp for me was 61.3C, typically I see the 40-50's for most games)
Using rabbit ear'd PCIE cables would most certainly go over the 150w design spec. Two 8-pins rabbit-ear'd could easily approach 280-300W on a single PCIE 8-pin cable during game play.
I'm no electrical engineer but noisy power from a maxed out PSU to a GPU running full tilt sounds like a plausible cause.
 
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/21 20:44:25 (permalink)
gsrcrxsi


if FPS is believed to be a factor in the death of these cards, you might have a better chance of killing your card if you drop the resolution to 1080/1440p and lower some detail settings to really crank up the FPS.
 
cranking the settings all the way up just results in lower FPS, although maybe more stressful for the GPU core itself.
 
I think it's some power delivery component that's failing though, not the GPU core. if a power stage fails, the card wont turn on and will appear "bricked", even if the GPU core itself is more or less functional, provided the stage failure didnt allow 12V to get into the GPU core.




Partly agree with this.  For example, in Furmark it always rides the power limit.  If you run 0x MSAA you get very high frame rates, but very low clock speeds and low vcore, indicating a very high load.  As you increase MSAA, core clock and vcore comes up quite a lot, indicating a lighter load, while FPS drops like a rock.
 
It would be interesting to know how each of the the 3090 8-pins tie into the power stages and how (if) they power various parts of the board.
 
https://www.overclock.net...3/page-2#post-28822402
kevinc313
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/21 20:51:10 (permalink)
novacane111
I'll just throw this at the wall and hope it helps in anyone's troubleshooting or exploration of the issue.
Just finished playing NW for the night, had GPU-Z recording for the session (about 2.5 hrs). Here's some of what I encountered.
 
3090 FTW3 Ultra (+1000 mem, +55 clock, Target and voltage maxed, fan curve 100% @ 65C)
8700K @ 5.2Ghz
3200Mhz mem
RMx1000 PSU
I have vsync and gsync enabled in Nvidia CP. Capped at monitor 60hz refresh.
4K resolution using the "Very High" preset with little else changed from that. (vsync disabled in game)
 
Board Power Draw
Max: 497.2W (PCIE 80.6W, 8-pin #1 146.5W, #2 139.3 W, #3 118.4W)
Average: 397.3W
 
GPU Voltage
Max: 1.1v (Occurred for multiple readings at various power draws between 225w - 430w)
Average: 1.056v
 
Temperatures
GPU Max: 73.4C
Memory Max: 84C
GPU Average: 65.9C
Memory Average: 77.5C
 
Seeing these numbers, there may be some merit to Jay's thesis about using the rabbit ear'd cables and PSU's rated towards the recommended minimum coupled with an OC'd CPU and GPU. New World seems to tax both the GPU and CPU more than any recent game I know of. (CPU average temp for me was 61.3C, typically I see the 40-50's for most games)
Using rabbit ear'd PCIE cables would most certainly go over the 150w design spec. Two 8-pins rabbit-ear'd could easily approach 280-300W on a single PCIE 8-pin cable during game play.
I'm no electrical engineer but noisy power from a maxed out PSU to a GPU running full tilt sounds like a plausible cause.
 




Awesome numbers!  Are those your vram junction temps from HWiNFO, not the ICX numbers? Seems like typical readings, if for a very heavy load.
squall-leonhart
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/21 21:02:59 (permalink)
I'm no electrical engineer.

 
This much is obvious, because
 
novacane111
Using rabbit ear'd PCIE cables would most certainly go over the 150w design spec. Two 8-pins rabbit-ear'd could easily approach 280-300W on a single PCIE 8-pin cable during game play.



There is no 150w design spec for the cables
8pin cables must provide a minimum of 150w as the 8pin Input on the card has the capability of drawing up to 150w per socket.
 
But most of the cables are specced for up to 280w(or higher as cable grade and insulation increases), hence why the official stance for daisy chaining is that its ok to run #2 and #3 on one cable with a quality, brand name unit (that isn't from the cheaper end, which usually ship with 8pin-8pin only peg cables) - and in normal cases, the 3 8pins balance 130w each and draw only about 65-70 on the slot.
 
Your card is a timebomb waiting to go off, pin #3 is too low and slot draw is exceeding spec.
 
post edited by squall-leonhart - 2021/07/21 21:11:21

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moomeacow
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/21 21:06:31 (permalink)
novacane111
I'll just throw this at the wall and hope it helps in anyone's troubleshooting or exploration of the issue.
Just finished playing NW for the night, had GPU-Z recording for the session (about 2.5 hrs). Here's some of what I encountered.
 
3090 FTW3 Ultra (+1000 mem, +55 clock, Target and voltage maxed, fan curve 100% @ 65C)
8700K @ 5.2Ghz
3200Mhz mem
RMx1000 PSU
I have vsync and gsync enabled in Nvidia CP. Capped at monitor 60hz refresh.
4K resolution using the "Very High" preset with little else changed from that. (vsync disabled in game)
 
Board Power Draw
Max: 497.2W (PCIE 80.6W, 8-pin #1 146.5W, #2 139.3 W, #3 118.4W)
Average: 397.3W
 
GPU Voltage
Max: 1.1v (Occurred for multiple readings at various power draws between 225w - 430w)
Average: 1.056v
 
Temperatures
GPU Max: 73.4C
Memory Max: 84C
GPU Average: 65.9C
Memory Average: 77.5C
 
Seeing these numbers, there may be some merit to Jay's thesis about using the rabbit ear'd cables and PSU's rated towards the recommended minimum coupled with an OC'd CPU and GPU. New World seems to tax both the GPU and CPU more than any recent game I know of. (CPU average temp for me was 61.3C, typically I see the 40-50's for most games)
Using rabbit ear'd PCIE cables would most certainly go over the 150w design spec. Two 8-pins rabbit-ear'd could easily approach 280-300W on a single PCIE 8-pin cable during game play.
I'm no electrical engineer but noisy power from a maxed out PSU to a GPU running full tilt sounds like a plausible cause.
 


who the hell here is running a 3090 and daisy chaining their pcie cables??
kevinc313
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/21 21:25:38 (permalink)
moomeacow
who the hell here is running a 3090 and daisy chaining their pcie cables??




Random people on Reddit.  Purely by coincidence and in no way possibly related or due to user error, there are also random people on Reddit with blown GPU's.
 
As a side note, here is a very good guide to the limits of PSU power cables, geared toward miners, the kings of daisychain PSU cables:
 
https://www.gpuminingresources.com/p/psu-cables.html
 
288w per cable.
 
While I've not been able to confirm it, I've seen indications that some PSU's have per port protect circuitry. YMMV.  I always run individual cables.
 
 
post edited by kevinc313 - 2021/07/21 21:31:44
moomeacow
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/21 21:33:05 (permalink)
kevinc313
moomeacow
who the hell here is running a 3090 and daisy chaining their pcie cables??




Random people on Reddit.  Purely by coincidence and in no way possibly related or due to user error, there are also random people on Reddit with blown GPU's.
 
As a side note, here is a very good guide to the limits of PSU power cables, geared toward miners, the kings of daisychain PSU cables:
 
https://www.gpuminingresources.com/p/psu-cables.html
 
288w per cable.
 
While I've not been able to confirm it, I've seen indications that some PSU's have per port protect circuitry. YMMV.  I always run individual cables.
 
 


i can't remember my evga instructions but its probably there but I know for a fact the 3080 FE explicitly says in the instructions don't daisy chain and use a separate pcie for each I guess people don't read lol


ausyenlowang
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/21 21:41:22 (permalink)
so far my experience in new world...
1440p max game settings, game ran in the menus at about 120 fps slight fluctuations... but it had a temp and power creep, total power draw was at about 420 watts.
 
i capped to 60 fps and got this state from the sources.. it sits at 63 fps.
https://imgur.com/a/vEG1OST

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lobstar
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/21 21:42:58 (permalink)
Well, I just bought the game.  I've got a Rev1.0 so I'm not expecting any issues.

 
squall-leonhart
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/21 21:59:43 (permalink)
Just to point out, of the 75w the pcie slot provides, only 66w is intended to be drawn over the 12v pins (5.5a total) and any device measuring higher than this is operating out of spec.
The measurement for the slot power is specifically the 12v pins and does not include the data pins.
 
at 80+w, evga can have their pcie certificate revoked.
 
"PCI-E"A full-sized ×16 graphics card[22] may draw up to 5.5 A at +12 V (66 W) and 75 W combined after initialization and software configuration as a "high power device".

 
moomeacow
i can't remember my evga instructions but its probably there but I know for a fact the 3080 FE explicitly says in the instructions don't daisy chain and use a separate pcie for each I guess people don't read lol






Thats because the 3080FE is taking 320w and is a 2 8pin device(adapted) device, 3x8pin cards are another matter.
post edited by squall-leonhart - 2021/07/21 22:02:27

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Elawarai
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/21 22:03:47 (permalink)
As I previously said, I played NW for a total of 8 hours since 2 days. 
 
I started with uncapped FPS and met no particular issues with RTX 3090 FTW UG @stock. At start, I haven't monitored the GPU temperature and load but the graphic card was noisy and the room hot at the end of the gaming session. 
 
Yesterday, with the beginning of the NWgate, I capped to 60 fps and started to monitor. The temperature and load seem to be ok. 

 
My GPU specs are : 

Attached Image(s)

lobstar
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/21 22:51:34 (permalink)
So, my card was basically pegged between 475-500w running 3440x1440, very high settings, uncapped in game (177 cap in NCP), vsync on. I'm on an X34 'GS' which is Gsync compatible at 180hz. Everything was normal. Menus seem to run at around 62fps after the patch.

 
Nghtmare
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/21 22:52:23 (permalink)
Was this PCB revision only done to the 3090 or was it done to the 3080 as well? If it was done to both can someone tell me where I can find this on the card please? Thanks.
tyranus7
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/21 23:14:30 (permalink)
squall-leonhart
liud21
If a low quality PSU is tasked with the job, and it cant deliver whats asked, it shuts itself down...



Not entirely the case,  low end units can have significant ripple that affects the stability of modern graphics cards, even a low value within the 5% tolerances for 12v can be enough to crash a modern cpu or graphics card.
 
They can also just explode taking out multiple other components along with them.




If that were the case (which I don't think it is), shouldn't the GPU manufacturer state on their power requirements that the required PSU should have a ripple smaller than x%.? If the ripple could actually kill a GPU, EVGA should clearly state that as a hard requirement, which is not the case. Now let's take a look at the Asus Strix as an example, that card has tons of capacitors with high capacitance to filter the voltage coming from the PSU, that helps to reduce fluctuations on input voltage. Sadly EVGA doesn't include enough capacitor and that's also on their end. The only way a PSU would kill a video card is if by some reason the PSU had a huge voltage spike and at the same time the ability to deliver huge amount of current, which is also unlikely given that PSU also has fuses to prevent this. Bad quality PSUs will most likely just shut it self down because it's unable to sustain the required voltage at a required current, i.e. it can't deliver the promised power.
 
As I said before there is absolutely nothing that a software could do to burn a good electronically/vBIOS designed GPU. A GPU don't know that it's rendering a video game, a GPU don't know how many fps is delivering a GPU only do mathematics calculations and return bits to the CPU, that's all. If a GPU is burning that's on the hardware level not the software level.

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12G-P5-3967-KR     6/3/2021 7:48:19 AM PT    Yes (ordered/cancelled by EVGA)

12G-P5-3968-KR     6/3/2021 7:51:30 AM PT    No
12G-P5-3953-KR     6/30/2021 6:30:34 AM PT   Yes (skipped)

 
 
mikeinmissoula
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/21 23:15:12 (permalink)
So after reading this entire thread. You're telling me that League of Legends is going to brick my brand new 3090 FTWUG?? Because if thats the case, my 3090 FTWUG and 3080Ti FTWUG will be going on ebay today. I mainly play WoW, LoL, Doom, and planned on trying New World. I've spent $3400 on EVGA GPU's. I don't want them to die on me and have to do all this RMA nonsense. First time EVGA owner by the way. Always used ASUS cards before. But the elite sign up and price got me to go EVGA. I haven't built my new computers yet, so if the cards are a no go for the games I love. They are gone..... 

 
 

 
 
 
denny88
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/21 23:46:48 (permalink)
Looks like FTW3 poor design and cheap components are confirmed:
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dbCrNBpW-RQ
squall-leonhart
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/21 23:53:01 (permalink)
tyranus7
If that were the case (which I don't think it is), shouldn't the GPU manufacturer state on their power requirements that the required PSU should have a ripple smaller than x%.? If the ripple could actually kill a GPU, EVGA should clearly state that as a hard requirement, which is not the case. Now let's take a look at the Asus Strix as an example, that card has tons of capacitors with high capacitance to filter the voltage coming from the PSU, that helps to reduce fluctuations on input voltage. Sadly EVGA doesn't include enough capacitor and that's also on their end. The only way a PSU would kill a video card is if by some reason the PSU had a huge voltage spike and at the same time the ability to deliver huge amount of current, which is also unlikely given that PSU also has fuses to prevent this. Bad quality PSUs will most likely just shut it self down because it's unable to sustain the required voltage at a required current, i.e. it can't deliver the promised power.
 
As I said before there is absolutely nothing that a software could do to burn a good electronically/vBIOS designed GPU. A GPU don't know that it's rendering a video game, a GPU don't know how many fps is delivering a GPU only do mathematics calculations and return bits to the CPU, that's all. If a GPU is burning that's on the hardware level not the software level.




i said crash, not kill.

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joshieecs
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/22 00:08:08 (permalink)
It should not be too surprising to see some reports of any particular card model bricking. Seems New World is basically working like a torture test, and it's exposing silently defective GPU's. If so, seeing a report of a 6900XT blowing is not too surprising to me. If it's just a handful of instances, that's even to be expected with a torture test. That's the point, shake out if you got a bum card.
 
There are surely some 6900XT cards that maybe have passed QC but still have some weak or defective component in them, and maybe that's why New World is breaking those specific specimens. If it's dozens and dozens of 6900XT's/6800XT's, maybe there is a bigger issue with the game or Windows or a common electronic supplier...
 
The same logic holds if there are a few 3080/3080Ti (or 3070,2060,1080, whatever!) cards that brick. If it's only a few of that model, and not a whole spate of them, it might just be some cards that were silently defective, and the New World torture test just revealed it. Reports about the EVGA 3090 FTW seems the most widespread, which makes me suspect some kind of systemic problem with some or all of that model.
 
It sucks to do an RMA, but I would rather have a dramatic failure up front, plenty of warranty left, than to trudge on with a silently defective card that may be failing on me bit by bit, possibly causing all sorts little niggling problems and instabilities over the life of my system where I can never quite suss out the culprit. (Assuming they don't send replacement(s) with the exact same defects!)
 
Someone should really archive this version of the game for the next time you need to do a burn-in torture test for a GPU.
charlesborner
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/22 00:10:48 (permalink)
squall-leonhart
Intoxicus
deathlessdd
Class action Lawsuit incoming? Game kills 100s of 3090s for unknown reasons...



Do people not realize that part of the EULA/ToS is a section where you agreed they're not liable for these kinds of things?
It's super duper standard to include clauses like that.


Those clauses are not enforceable.



Try to sue them over it.
Thems with the deepest pockets wins.

Also, there are reports of 6800XT cards dying as well.

I know people are pissed.

Let the RMA process do its job.

Let the AIBs get these cards back, and then do post-mortems to figure out the issue.

Basically ANYONE telling you it's X, Y or Z FOR CERTAIN right now has a wildly talkative butthole.
And we all know what emerges from buttholes...


 
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explorer232
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/22 00:20:09 (permalink)
There is some hw design problem (VRMs, caps, termal issuse ...) with these cards. Probably all cards dies ...
Meguas2
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/22 00:23:14 (permalink)
denny88
Looks like FTW3 poor design and cheap components are confirmed:
 



 
 
I think you need to rewatch the video because nowhere does he say it's specific to EVGA.  If anything it's nvidia as a whole not properly implementing OCP... and even that per buildzoid is speculation.
post edited by Meguas2 - 2021/07/22 00:27:19
safan80
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/22 00:53:04 (permalink)
aberkae
New World menu patched with fps cap to prevent gpu from bricking.



That really doesn't fix the problem as the hardware should not allow code to kill it.
jaredbyoung
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/22 00:56:25 (permalink)
lobstar
Well, I just bought the game.  I've got a Rev1.0 so I'm not expecting any issues.


I wish you fair winds and a following sea...
Brickokermis
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Re: EVGA 3090 owners - do NOT play New World game right now as it might kill the card 2021/07/22 01:01:21 (permalink)
the revision number is located next to the pcie on the bottom side (fan)
But better not to play it anyway

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post edited by Brickokermis - 2021/07/22 01:08:39
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