grayarty
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/08/24 16:47:48
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Thanks for the reply..I've overclocked my Ryzen 1600 to 3.95 @ 1.375 V and at load in it reaches around 64 C..not too happy with that.. hoping to do better..I'm gonna try and change the cables to follow yours and hope it makes a difference..thanks again
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Shapsuo
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/08/24 18:56:43
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TomSawyer2112
For what it's worth, here is where I've landed with the CLC 280/Flow Control on my new rig build:
Quick specs rundown:
Asus X370 Strix
Ryzen 1700x @ 3.9 (very slight voltage bump)
G.Skill Trident Z 3200
1080 Ti FTW3 Hybrid
Phanteks Enthoo Pro M
850 P2 PSU
At this point, I have abandoned trying to use Flow Control to manage my fan speeds. Due to the fact that the current version (2.0.3) does not read CPU temp on Ryzen, it causes hangs/crashes when you try to do anything related to CPU temp in the app (change LED color based on temp for example). While the fans are interesting design wise, I found them to be really loud when allowing flow control to manage the speed. Even when dropped down to the minimum in the software, they were much louder than I prefer and the 'sound signature' I found to be unpleasant (subjective, of course).
In the end, I removed the fans and went with a pull config using two Noctua industrial NF-A14's and am allowing the motherboard to manage the fans via the CPU Fan and Opt Fan headers (they are synced which is nice). I still have Flow Control running since it does show the coolant temp and pump speed, and the coolant sticks around 28 C idle and the setup is very quiet.
I can mostly control the LED with FC, however syncing with graphics card has never worked (Running Precision XOC 6.1.14) so I just set it to red for now.
I am hopeful that EVGA will work out the kinks in FC, it is a software package in its infancy and as a software engineer I certainly understand that working out the kinks takes time. I do like the idea of allowing the CLC to manage all aspects of the CPU 'cooling system'; makes a lot of sense and I greatly prefer the interface of Flow Control/Precision to Asus's "Dual Intelligent Processors 5".
Thanks, TomSawyer2112, for the response! I do appreciate it :) I'm using an i7-6700K, so I don't have the same Ryzen issue as you, but I'm considering uninstalling the Flow Control Software completely and seeing if that helps. I might get a pair of Corsair ML 140s and use those instead. My Quick Specs: Quick specs rundown: MSI Z170A M5 Motherboard i7-6700k @ 4.5 (1.305 Volts) -- using IC Diamond paste 4x 8 GB ADATA XPGZ DDR4 2400 Memory (32 gb total) EVGA GTX 980 ACX 2.0 Thermaltake Chaser MK-1 Corsair RM1000 Edit: For those wondering, after uninstalling the Flow Control Application with Revo Uninstaller Pro and cleaning up any remains with CCleaner/Disk Cleanup, the fans do sound a bit quieter-- but not silent.
post edited by Shapsuo - 2017/08/24 20:33:21
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Nikej81
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/08/27 17:24:46
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What screw size do I need to add 2 120mm fans on the other side of the CLC 240? I will have fans on both sides of the radiator. The screws will have to be long enough to mount the entire unit to the front of my case. Thanks.
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MrEWhite
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/08/28 02:55:56
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Colors on the water block don't stay synced for more than 10 seconds to the graphics card.
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yokhoe
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/08/28 11:59:50
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Hi all, I have the CLC 280 installed on an Asus Z270e board. I noticed while running Prime95, the fan never goes above 1200rpm despite what is set in the fan curve. The fans do speed up if I use the vertical slider, but again, it doesn't respect the fan curve. Considering the locked 100% fan speed at 60c, the fans should've been going full rpm and loud during P95 stress test. Just to note, I have the CLC plugged in to a connector labeled AIO_PUMP on the motherboard. Any suggestions is appreciated.  Here's a shot of Flow Control during P95 stress test: 
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miklet
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/09/01 07:50:16
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Installed a 120 with two corsair fans in a push-pull intake configuration. All fit well into the Rosewell Stealth case and MSI X370 Gaming Pro Carbon motherboard. The cooler has lowered temps under every circumstance so far. I am absolutely delighted. Now to play with the Flow Control Software.
EVGA, thank you for the cool new toy!
Need to update my signature line....
Corsair 750D Case MSI X470 Gaming M7 AC mobo AMD Ryzen 7 2700X auto settings BIOS E7B77AMS.180Windows 10 1903 18362.145EVGA AIO CLC 280 intake w/four EVGA 140mm fans in push-pull 120mm fan bottom intake / 3x 140mm fans top intake / 140mm fan rear exhaust Corsair LED Vengeance 4x 8GB 3200Mhz using XMP1 2933Mhz for stabilityEVGA GTX1080 FTW GAMING ACX 3.0 auto settingEVGA 850W G3 PSU
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Cool GTX
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zoglog
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/09/05 22:50:24
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Man it's been forever since the last update on this software and it never feels like it's left beta.... Kind of sad to see this level of support
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TomSawyer2112
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/09/06 03:52:21
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Yeah I'm trying to be patient, always a challenge. I really feel like once they get the CPU temp monitoring working for Ryzen (in my case) all will be well. Time will tell... I feel like I've had to compromise on both of my EVGA products lately and come up with workarounds... my 1080 Ti FTW3 Hybrid ended up being (in my option) lackluster in regards to the fan and how it is controlled by the GPU. I guess it's not the end of the world just using Asus to control it all, but would have liked to see the cooling part on both of these products a little more robust.
post edited by TomSawyer2112 - 2017/09/06 03:55:46
Asus ROG Strix Z390-E | Intel 9900K @ 5 Ghz | 32Gb Corsair LPX 3200 (4x8Gb) | NVMe Storage EVGA P2 850W PSU | Fractal Design Case/Cooler | EVGA 1080 Ti FTW3
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miklet
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/09/06 04:21:55
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Tom, thank you for the post and feedback. You have a n awesome system listed in your signature. Great planning on the design.
Corsair 750D Case MSI X470 Gaming M7 AC mobo AMD Ryzen 7 2700X auto settings BIOS E7B77AMS.180Windows 10 1903 18362.145EVGA AIO CLC 280 intake w/four EVGA 140mm fans in push-pull 120mm fan bottom intake / 3x 140mm fans top intake / 140mm fan rear exhaust Corsair LED Vengeance 4x 8GB 3200Mhz using XMP1 2933Mhz for stabilityEVGA GTX1080 FTW GAMING ACX 3.0 auto settingEVGA 850W G3 PSU
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miklet
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/09/06 04:27:58
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Question for AM4 motherboard users with an EVGA liquid cooler and Flow Control installed
Does the Flow Control show your CPU temperature?
Corsair 750D Case MSI X470 Gaming M7 AC mobo AMD Ryzen 7 2700X auto settings BIOS E7B77AMS.180Windows 10 1903 18362.145EVGA AIO CLC 280 intake w/four EVGA 140mm fans in push-pull 120mm fan bottom intake / 3x 140mm fans top intake / 140mm fan rear exhaust Corsair LED Vengeance 4x 8GB 3200Mhz using XMP1 2933Mhz for stabilityEVGA GTX1080 FTW GAMING ACX 3.0 auto settingEVGA 850W G3 PSU
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TomSawyer2112
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/09/06 04:35:05
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Asus ROG Strix Z390-E | Intel 9900K @ 5 Ghz | 32Gb Corsair LPX 3200 (4x8Gb) | NVMe Storage EVGA P2 850W PSU | Fractal Design Case/Cooler | EVGA 1080 Ti FTW3
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miklet
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/09/06 08:43:42
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TomSawyer2112,
HAH, the Rush connection to your EVGA handle just sunk it. Wonderful flashback to a hot summer day at a Rush concert held East Troy, Wisconsin. It was a great day, but, that's all I cab remember. hahahah!
Thank you for posting pictures of the build. The equipment is phenomenal, and the cable/hose routing is clean and does not obscure the visibility of the components. Well done todays Tom Sawyer!
Question: do you think the MSI Gaming Program/MSI Command Center/Corsair Link, which all have fan controls, may conflict or hamper the performance of the EVGA Flow Control program when all are active?
Wondering is any AM4 boards work with Flow Control, not just our two examples.
Enjoy your awesome equipment and everyday above ground!
Corsair 750D Case MSI X470 Gaming M7 AC mobo AMD Ryzen 7 2700X auto settings BIOS E7B77AMS.180Windows 10 1903 18362.145EVGA AIO CLC 280 intake w/four EVGA 140mm fans in push-pull 120mm fan bottom intake / 3x 140mm fans top intake / 140mm fan rear exhaust Corsair LED Vengeance 4x 8GB 3200Mhz using XMP1 2933Mhz for stabilityEVGA GTX1080 FTW GAMING ACX 3.0 auto settingEVGA 850W G3 PSU
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AdmiralDonut
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/09/06 11:10:16
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I've completely given up using the flow control software on any AM4 platform. I've tested it on a Strix B350-F, an X370-F, and just today I hooked it to my Crosshair VI Hero. No CPU temps, no fan speed control, nothing. On any of the boards. It is terrible. The cooler itself is fantastic though, keeps things nice and frosty. But for god sake please, please hire someone to fix that abysmal software.
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TomSawyer2112
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/09/06 11:20:26
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 I've enjoyed many a Rush concert, that's for sure. Thanks! This has definitely been my favorite build of the many, many builds that I've had since my first PC, a Pentium 75 on a janky biostar motherboard. Yes that dates me, but being an Amiga Head before that really does the trick! I am still flirting with the idea of trying a custom loop, but the CLC's do offer a nice peace of mind element. Hearkening back to the days of only having 4 MB of memory, I've always been of the mind to have as little running in the background as possible. Silly with 8 cores, 16 threads and 16 Gb of memory, but still... at the least I would think they run risk of interfering with each other as they are all polling the sensor interface at one time more or less. With them all offering fan control I'm sure it would cause issues if two apps were trying to control the same fan/device at the same time. Good question... my guess is that FC is looking specifically for a standard package or core temp reading from the CPU and that would be presented/passed through on any board. I'm sure FC just needs to be updated to be 'Ryzen aware' and look at the right value (compensating for the offset temp of course). You too, and nice rig in your signature as well! I was so close to picking up the Carbon but decided to stick with Asus (my son has a Z97 MSI board and it is great).
Asus ROG Strix Z390-E | Intel 9900K @ 5 Ghz | 32Gb Corsair LPX 3200 (4x8Gb) | NVMe Storage EVGA P2 850W PSU | Fractal Design Case/Cooler | EVGA 1080 Ti FTW3
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clocked970
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/09/18 20:14:32
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Flow control software is in serious need of updating EVGA. Get your act together! I am a huge advocate for evga products and the program in its current state (buggy and not very functional,) is not acceptable. You need to become the first company with a great software solution for your liquid cooling products and everyone will flock to your products. Love: a loyal customer.
post edited by Sajin - 2017/09/19 15:44:25
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Asgar_55
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/09/19 05:05:09
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Cool GTX
yokhoe
Hi all,
I have the CLC 280 installed on an Asus Z270e board. I noticed while running Prime95, the fan never goes above 1200rpm despite what is set in the fan curve. The fans do speed up if I use the vertical slider, but again, it doesn't respect the fan curve. Considering the locked 100% fan speed at 60c, the fans should've been going full rpm and loud during P95 stress test. Just to note, I have the CLC plugged in to a connector labeled AIO_PUMP on the motherboard. Any suggestions is appreciated.
Here's a shot of Flow Control during P95 stress test:
Did you press the "Apply" button ? it looks like it is ready to be selected in your picture
Hi all, Same problem as this guy in a Maximus Hero VIII. I have a CLC280 for a few months. I'm happy with it, although the software is not perfect, does its job fine, until now... This Sunday I decided to update the bios and many drivers since they were complete obsolete. Since then, I can not get the fans RPM adjust to the temperature of the CPU. I've tried everything, apply button, new profile, select DC or PWM mode in bios, even old versions of Flow Control (2.01 and 2.02) it just seems that the program does not recognize the CPU temperature correctly. This morning I saw something in HWMonitor which has surprised me and may perhaps explain the failure, the CPUTIN(MB sensor) temperature (35ºC) is much lower than SYSTIN (CPU sensor, 59ºC) under stress test, as you can see in the screen capture  may be this value induce the system to not recognize the correct processor temperature? I do not know what else to try :( update: discarded that the CPUTIN value is the cause, the fans also do not respond to a graph adjusted to their temperatures. maybe a usb port problem? I do not know what else to do...
post edited by Asgar_55 - 2017/09/19 08:09:34
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TomSawyer2112
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/09/19 06:53:37
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Asgar_55
Cool GTX
yokhoe
Hi all,
I have the CLC 280 installed on an Asus Z270e board. I noticed while running Prime95, the fan never goes above 1200rpm despite what is set in the fan curve. The fans do speed up if I use the vertical slider, but again, it doesn't respect the fan curve. Considering the locked 100% fan speed at 60c, the fans should've been going full rpm and loud during P95 stress test. Just to note, I have the CLC plugged in to a connector labeled AIO_PUMP on the motherboard. Any suggestions is appreciated.
Here's a shot of Flow Control during P95 stress test:
Did you press the "Apply" button ? it looks like it is ready to be selected in your picture
Hi all,
Same problem as this guy in a Maximus Hero VIII. I have a CLC280 for a few months. I'm happy with it, although the software is not perfect, does its job fine, until now...
This Sunday I decided to update the bios and many drivers since they were complete obsolete. Since then, I can not get the fans RPM adjust to the temperature of the CPU. I've tried everything, apply button, new profile, select DC or PWM mode in bios, even old versions of Flow Control (2.01 and 2.02) it just seems that the program does not recognize the CPU temperature correctly.
This morning I saw something in HWMonitor which has surprised me and may perhaps explain the failure, the CPUTIN(MB sensor) temperature (35ºC) is much lower than SYSTIN (CPU sensor, 59ºC) under stress test, as you can see in the screen capture
may be this value induce the system to not recognize the correct processor temperature? I do not know what else to try :(
That's a shame; I can almost understand why it would be less than perfect on Ryzen platform/chipsets with it being still fairly new, but not working perfectly on an Intel setup tells me the software (or perhaps firmware of the unit) has issues to be worked out. As many others have stated, I have given up on FC doing anything with the unit other than showing pump RPM, coolant temperature and setting the color of the RGB LED. My fans are plugged into CPU and CPU_OPT and are controlled perfectly based on CPU temps via AI Suite 3.
Asus ROG Strix Z390-E | Intel 9900K @ 5 Ghz | 32Gb Corsair LPX 3200 (4x8Gb) | NVMe Storage EVGA P2 850W PSU | Fractal Design Case/Cooler | EVGA 1080 Ti FTW3
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Phil2940
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/09/19 10:27:04
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Dear sir, 5 months after the installation of my CLC120 I am happy with these performances (57 ° C in full with a I7 4770k OC 4.3Ghz) but I am really very upset of softaware EGA FLOW CONTROL (V2.0.3.0). Let me explain:1)Every time I start the PC, I have to systematically click on the blue AutoFan button, otherwise the fan stays full or idle, which is very dangerous when the CPU rises. 2)The custom curve never run so I'm still on the curve by default = 1020rpm in idle and 1800rpm in full (very noisy)Only response from EVGA customer service: uninstall and reinstall the software which had no effect Even when creating profiles, as read on another forum, nothing does, the custom curve does not work Therefore, it would be urgent that the engineers of EVGA returns from vacancy and make an update of their software EVGA FLOW CONTROL V2.0.3.0 ASUS Z87 A (Fan Xpert 1.01.11)I7 4770KWINDOWS 8.1 cordiallyA customer very displeased Google traduction
post edited by Phil2940 - 2017/09/19 10:29:31
Attached Image(s) 
Asus Z87 A I7 4770 OC 4.3ghz : reveal information :57 °C on Flow control , 53°C on Asus AI suite III on full a the same time on burn ****  Corsair LED Vengeance 16GB rated 1600 EVGA AIO CPU Closed Loop Cooler CLC 120 GTX1060 ICHILL (60°C on full) IN WIN 805C 2x 120mm Corsair fans front intake2x 120mm Corsair on bottom intake1x 120mm In Win fans back side exhaust Windows 8.1 64
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EVGA_JacobF
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/09/19 13:55:36
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Phil2940
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/09/19 14:22:36
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Asus Z87 A I7 4770 OC 4.3ghz : reveal information :57 °C on Flow control , 53°C on Asus AI suite III on full a the same time on burn **** Corsair LED Vengeance 16GB rated 1600 EVGA AIO CPU Closed Loop Cooler CLC 120 GTX1060 ICHILL (60°C on full) IN WIN 805C 2x 120mm Corsair fans front intake2x 120mm Corsair on bottom intake1x 120mm In Win fans back side exhaust Windows 8.1 64
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TomSawyer2112
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/09/19 15:03:01
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No joy here, still no CPU temperature registered. Ryzen X370 chipset (board in sig), no other monitoring apps running (besides Precision for GFX).
Asus ROG Strix Z390-E | Intel 9900K @ 5 Ghz | 32Gb Corsair LPX 3200 (4x8Gb) | NVMe Storage EVGA P2 850W PSU | Fractal Design Case/Cooler | EVGA 1080 Ti FTW3
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Neal1386
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/09/19 22:38:53
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yokhoe
Hi all,
I have the CLC 280 installed on an Asus Z270e board. I noticed while running Prime95, the fan never goes above 1200rpm despite what is set in the fan curve. The fans do speed up if I use the vertical slider, but again, it doesn't respect the fan curve. Considering the locked 100% fan speed at 60c, the fans should've been going full rpm and loud during P95 stress test. Just to note, I have the CLC plugged in to a connector labeled AIO_PUMP on the motherboard. Any suggestions is appreciated.
Here's a shot of Flow Control during P95 stress test:
I have the same motherboard and cooler and am having issues with flow control seeing my fan speed. It doesn’t register at all. I currently have the usb 2 plugged in and the clc 280 plugged into the mobos main cpu fan header. I attempted plugging it into the aio specific header but then the mobile didn’t think I had a cpu fan. Do I need to plug into the AIO header on the z270e and then skip the Y adapter for the fans and plug those directly into the cpu header 1 and 2 spots on the z270e? Per your screenshots its working for you and so I bought I’d ask and find out. Any information you or others can provide would be greatly appreciated.
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coolmistry
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/09/20 11:23:57
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Same as above Neal and Tom!
Still no change for Fan speed too loud on Auto!! So I still use auto off running so quiet from version 2.0.0.1 to 2.0.0.4!!!!!
I don't understand the fan curve haven't change to 100% at 60c that we don't need 100% speed on 60c that because too loud fan like helicopter!!!! Can you change the fan speed 100% at maybe 85c or 90c then can help fan more quieter!!!
Windows 11 Home 64bits up to Dated i9 11900K 5,275 MHz (3,500 MHz) || EVGA Z590 FTW WIFI || 2 x Nvidia RTX 2080 Ti FE || 32Gb Dominator Platinum DDR3 3600mhz XMP OC 3800mhz || 500gb Samsung 980 Pro NVMe || 500gb Samsung 970 EVO and Sata M.2 (1 x SSD and 1xHHD) || EVGA CLCx 360 Cooler || EVGA Supernova 1300w X3 || EVGA Z10 Keyboard || EVGA TORQ X10 mouse ||EVGA DG 77 case || Acer Predator X35 35" 200Hz G-Sync || Logitech Z906 5.1 system sounds SPDIF|| Kaspersky Internet Security
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Phil2940
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/09/20 13:44:40
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Asus Z87 A I7 4770 OC 4.3ghz : reveal information :57 °C on Flow control , 53°C on Asus AI suite III on full a the same time on burn **** Corsair LED Vengeance 16GB rated 1600 EVGA AIO CPU Closed Loop Cooler CLC 120 GTX1060 ICHILL (60°C on full) IN WIN 805C 2x 120mm Corsair fans front intake2x 120mm Corsair on bottom intake1x 120mm In Win fans back side exhaust Windows 8.1 64
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TomSawyer2112
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/09/20 15:59:03
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Never know... but I'm not too upset about this, my MB is managing the fans fine and this motivates me to move forward on my custom loop build. 
Asus ROG Strix Z390-E | Intel 9900K @ 5 Ghz | 32Gb Corsair LPX 3200 (4x8Gb) | NVMe Storage EVGA P2 850W PSU | Fractal Design Case/Cooler | EVGA 1080 Ti FTW3
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Charleyjasonv7
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/09/23 09:11:58
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Hello Everyone,
I recently purchased the EVGA 280 CLC based off reviews I've seen via YouTube and posts made here on this forum. However, after installation yesterday and playing with configurations last night.. I'm having a few issues adjusting my fan speeds and pump speeds.
I have not installed the software as I haven't seen anyone having the best of luck on it either. So I'm trying the manual approach. I instead plugged the header labeled "Motherboard" into my CPU_PUMP and am using the Y-Splitter on the pump to plug the fans directly into.
After booting into BIOS, I can change the fans to PWM,DC,AUTO and create a custom curve, but they're limited to 7.2V and won't increase the RPM higher than 1600 at max limits here. And the Pump I believe is limited to the same Voltage and limits my speed below advertised speeds (posting from work so unable to verify currently). Is anyone else having these same issues? Or know how to fix both Fan and Pump Speed/Voltage?
I've considered disconnecting the fans from the Y-Splitter and plugging directly into my motherboards SYS_FAN 1-4 slots but they're out of the fans reach, so i'd need to get an extension. But how would that fix the Pump limit issue?
Specs:
MSI Z270 GAMING M7
INTEL 6700K OC 4.7Ghz 1.3V
EVGA GTX 1060 6GB SC
Crucial Ballistix Sport (2x8) 16GB RAM 2400
Corsair 750W Power Supply
EVGA CLC 280
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zip1212
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/09/24 22:03:17
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i am pissed off. ive had this computer built for months now and none of the software works.... i paid a premium price for the 280 clc and its thrown in your lap with (Deleted for Foul Language) instructions. then when you spend your time trying to figure it all out after installing all the crappy software there is no working solution. AND the gpu is NOT recognized in the bios either. this is UNACCEPTABLE. ryzen 7 1700 @40.5x = 4.05 ghz asus x370 prime evga 1080 ftw gskill 2x8g = 16g @3200 14-14-14-14-34 evga 280 clc bronze 1000w psu TT core x31 tg w/front panel for usb 3.0 + 3.1 support, sdhc/m card reader, esata... etc...
post edited by XrayMan - 2017/09/24 22:44:34
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project17
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/09/25 09:07:25
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i have just got the evga 120 clc and the fan speed is not showing in the software i have it plugged into the pump any one know why its not showing its working but cant see the speed all the rest is showing thanks
post edited by project17 - 2017/09/25 09:11:22
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sommersc
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Re: EVGA CLC 120/280 Liquid CPU Coolers
2017/09/25 09:59:31
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project17
i have just got the evga 120 clc and the fan speed is not showing in the software i have it plugged into the pump any one know why its not showing its working but cant see the speed all the rest is showing thanks
* Where do you have the pump plugged into on your motherboard? * Are you sure you plugged both fans into the Y splitter (if you don't, the fan speed won't register - easy to miss) * Do you have any other software running that is monitoring fan speed? Some can interfere/same for BIOS options
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