talon951

evensen007
..

Might work if the heatsink is big enough. It would eliminate one thermal interface. Part of the problem is that we have 2 interfaces with the backplate. You'll probably need airflow over the heatsinks though for it to be very effective.

For example in my setup, I saw 88C with nothing on the backplate, 84C with just the heatsink with heatsink compound, but 74-76C with the 60mm Noctua on the heatsink. Those were all at a somewhat reduced hashrate of 105-110 mh/s. I've got it running now at 115 mh and 78C.

evensen007

talon951

evensen007
..

Might work if the heatsink is big enough. It would eliminate one thermal interface. Part of the problem is that we have 2 interfaces with the backplate. You'll probably need airflow over the heatsinks though for it to be very effective.

For example in my setup, I saw 88C with nothing on the backplate, 84C with just the heatsink with heatsink compound, but 74-76C with the 60mm Noctua on the heatsink. Those were all at a somewhat reduced hashrate of 105-110 mh/s. I've got it running now at 115 mh and 78C.

I'm hoping those radiator fans at the bottom of the case that are blowing up towards the card will help act to remove the heat from the copper heatsinks. 

evensen007

DZelmer

evensen007

talon951

evensen007
..

Might work if the heatsink is big enough. It would eliminate one thermal interface. Part of the problem is that we have 2 interfaces with the backplate. You'll probably need airflow over the heatsinks though for it to be very effective.

For example in my setup, I saw 88C with nothing on the backplate, 84C with just the heatsink with heatsink compound, but 74-76C with the 60mm Noctua on the heatsink. Those were all at a somewhat reduced hashrate of 105-110 mh/s. I've got it running now at 115 mh and 78C.

I'm hoping those radiator fans at the bottom of the case that are blowing up towards the card will help act to remove the heat from the copper heatsinks. 

use as big of heat sinks as possible you will be very suppressed how much heat comes off of them! I have 2 large sinks on mine and it heats my case with the side on I'm working on a solid copper back plate like one of the other guys did and water cool it just need to get my buddy that has the cnc machine to have some free time got the drawing done just need to get the tool path down and cut it! A good test is let it run for a while and touch it. If it still feels hot you can go bigger and get it a lot cooler my low temps are on the sink that are only on a couple chips and is cool to the touch the other one even with a 2000 rpm fan on it is hot to the touch. I'm also running no backplate at the moment. Straight rigged right now. 

Thanks guys. Since it's water-cooled, I don't really want to pull this thing apart twice, so here's what I'm thinking:
1. Use the new Gelid pads on both sides of the PCB (I bought 1mm, 2mm, and 3mm).
2. Use the backplate from alphacool to get pressure on the pads on the back. 
3. Attach the thin copper heat sinks to the back of the backplate with either the adhesive it comes with or the adhesive PLUS extra Gelid pads.
4. Squeeze a really thin Noctua 90mm fan behind the card blowing air directly at the backplate. I can't attach it to the backplate or heatsinks as the space between the backplate and connector hardware is too slim. I will have to jerry rig a fan kinda just sitting behind there loosely. 
 
Does this sound like the best path for a one and done? Like I said; tearing this loop down is a pain and I'd rather only do it once. 
 
Thanks!
 
 

Dabadger84
The real problem is Intel has been on the "same" process/technology, pretty much, from the 8700K to now.  So almost 5 years on rehashes of the same CPU process.  We went from 6 to 8 to 10 and now back to 8 cores, but the improvement from one to the next, per core, while the supposed IPC improvement has been big, has not been that impressive.  Is it worth upgrading from a 8700K or 9900K to an 10900K or 11900K? Not really, or just barely, especially if your primary focus is gaming.  
Where as if you look at the generation on generation improvements on AMD's side... much more Wowee:
  
The jump from the 2700x to the 3700x is notable, then again, the 3700x to either the 5800x or 5900x is big as well.  And that's just one game as an example, but it shows in most titles.  Whereas Intel:
 
Not directly comparable numbers because the settings are different, but you can see there... 8700K to 10900K is a gain, yes, but considering those parts are FOUR YEARS apart, that's pretty damn pathetic in comparison to what AMD has done from the 2000-series to 5000-series in terms of improvements.

the_Scarlet_one

Dabadger84
The real problem is Intel has been on the "same" process/technology, pretty much, from the 8700K to now.  So almost 5 years on rehashes of the same CPU process.  We went from 6 to 8 to 10 and now back to 8 cores, but the improvement from one to the next, per core, while the supposed IPC improvement has been big, has not been that impressive.  Is it worth upgrading from a 8700K or 9900K to an 10900K or 11900K? Not really, or just barely, especially if your primary focus is gaming.  
Where as if you look at the generation on generation improvements on AMD's side... much more Wowee:
  
The jump from the 2700x to the 3700x is notable, then again, the 3700x to either the 5800x or 5900x is big as well.  And that's just one game as an example, but it shows in most titles.  Whereas Intel:
 
Not directly comparable numbers because the settings are different, but you can see there... 8700K to 10900K is a gain, yes, but considering those parts are FOUR YEARS apart, that's pretty damn pathetic in comparison to what AMD has done from the 2000-series to 5000-series in terms of improvements.

Going to shamelessly hop in with a minor tweak... the 14nm process started with the 6700k, not the 8700k, and Intel has been “refining” it since then. The 6700k was released in Q3 2015, so well over 5 years now.

The 6700k and 7700k were also 4 core parts, so it went 4 cores (6700k), 4 cores (7700k), 6 cores (8700k), 8 cores (9900k), 10 cores (10900k), back to 8 cores (11900k) all on the 14nm process.

bradsour

Dabadger84 
I got most of my storage in now:
 

 
Say hallo to over $1k in storage drives. lol  Got the 4TB installed already, going to pre-transfer everything from my current SSDs to that one so that the transition between systems is easier... I'm not sure if the 2TB will even work in the current system so I can pre-transfer the current Game M.2 to it, I'll fiddle with that later (because I HATE dealing with the M.2 screws and I'm not awake yet).
 
Also got an update on the Asus Crosshair VIII Hero, it shipped TODAY, so it will be here next week... which means I need to make a decision & order a processor pronto.

I'd be interested to know what your total system cost is. I feel like with everything I've seen you posting about that you could be driving a small car by now. And I don't mean a virtual one.

Clovis559
Omg we're going to be so identical! I found a scalper at $200 over, I went with it. It should be here Saturday. Same motherboard, should be here tomorrow. We both have the same 4tb.
I have an Optimus Block already, but there also is this that peaks my curiosity: https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-quantum-momentum-rog-crosshair-viii-hero-d-rgb-plexi
Available for Pre-order o.O At some point I'd like to test it, because if I do put my computer in the minifridge for ambient, that would cover the heat coming off the vrms.
 
Same Kingpin o.O, **** if you got G.skill ram you should do an ancestry.com, see if were related...

Dabadger84

bradsour

Dabadger84 
I got most of my storage in now:
 

 
Say hallo to over $1k in storage drives. lol  Got the 4TB installed already, going to pre-transfer everything from my current SSDs to that one so that the transition between systems is easier... I'm not sure if the 2TB will even work in the current system so I can pre-transfer the current Game M.2 to it, I'll fiddle with that later (because I HATE dealing with the M.2 screws and I'm not awake yet).
 
Also got an update on the Asus Crosshair VIII Hero, it shipped TODAY, so it will be here next week... which means I need to make a decision & order a processor pronto.

I'd be interested to know what your total system cost is. I feel like with everything I've seen you posting about that you could be driving a small car by now. And I don't mean a virtual one.

Indeed.  Once I'm on the 5900x/X570 setup it'll be at least $4k total value.  Probably $5k, with the loop, case (which is still $400+) and fans.  GPU is $2k, processor will be $549, motherboard was a touch under $400, total storage cost is in the $1300 range after taxes ($214 for the HDD, $479 before the 10% off on the 4TB SSD, $349 on the 2TB M.2, $196 on the 1TB M.2), and if you factor in the monitor, which still sells in the 1199-1399 range... lol
 
This will be the most high-end my system has been since back when I had a QX9650 setup (which was a $999 processor at the time) and 3-way SLi.
 
The storage will be the last time I buy storage for at least the next 2 builds (4 years or so), so I wanted to go as high end as possible and have plenty of high speed & regular storage so I don't run out.
 

Clovis559
Omg we're going to be so identical! I found a scalper at $200 over, I went with it. It should be here Saturday. Same motherboard, should be here tomorrow. We both have the same 4tb.
I have an Optimus Block already, but there also is this that peaks my curiosity: https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-quantum-momentum-rog-crosshair-viii-hero-d-rgb-plexi
Available for Pre-order o.O At some point I'd like to test it, because if I do put my computer in the minifridge for ambient, that would cover the heat coming off the vrms.
 
Same Kingpin o.O, **** if you got G.skill ram you should do an ancestry.com, see if were related...

Current RAM kit is this one: https://www.newegg.com/g-skill-32gb-288-pin-ddr4-sdram/p/N82E16820232492?Item=N82E16820232492 (because my motherboard is T-Topology, 4x8GB is actually better especially for OCing, than 2x16, I tried both, since I built 2 systems at the same time, gave my dad the 2x16 kit I got because the 4x8GB was happier in my system)
 
If the Motherboard doesn't get along with it, I'll be swapping to these, which I think is pretty similar to what you have: https://www.newegg.com/g-skill-32gb-288-pin-ddr4-sdram/p/N82E16820374093?Item=N82E16820374093 

Clovis559

Dabadger84

Clovis559

Dabadger84
 
 
Current RAM kit is this one: https://www.newegg.com/g-skill-32gb-288-pin-ddr4-sdram/p/N82E16820232492?Item=N82E16820232492 (because my motherboard is T-Topology, 4x8GB is actually better especially for OCing, than 2x16, I tried both, since I built 2 systems at the same time, gave my dad the 2x16 kit I got because the 4x8GB was happier in my system)
 
If the Motherboard doesn't get along with it, I'll be swapping to these, which I think is pretty similar to what you have: https://www.newegg.com/g-skill-32gb-288-pin-ddr4-sdram/p/N82E16820374093?Item=N82E16820374093 

The crosshair is T-topology right? I'll have to get 2x16 when I get a 10900k.  Though I was eyeing the asus board, EKwb makes a monoblock for it too. I don't want to look at the coin in my machine :P

Pretty sure almost all X570 motherboards are Daisy-Chain meaning 2 sticks is best, I watched Buildzoid's PCB breakdown on the Crosshair VIII Hero last night & he said he wasn't sure if it was T-Topology or Daisy-Chain but assumed it was Daisy-Chain because almost all X570 motherboards are, he didn't actually have the motherboard in hand to verify though.  But I'm going to try the 4x8 setup anyway first.  I'm not looking to go bonkers, just wanna get a 1:1 DRAM to Infinity Fabric at 1800, so my current 3600MHz kit would be perfect, if the motherboard will play nice with it.

I've never played with infinity fabric so here's to learning. I'll likely have to downclock my ram. I'll likely be looking to build at the same time since I don't think my stuff will be buildable till Tues, I mean I can sat but I'll be jumping the gun to have to take apart later and clean out, which I'm growing to hate in my life.
 
 Also that's why I like dark boards, as they're not T-toplogy or daisy chain. Though I might buy an EKWB monoblock for the X570, compare my results, and that might sway me to an asus Z490... and if it doesn't sway me I'll end up on a Dark.

Clovis559

Dabadger84
@Clovis559 https://smile.amazon.com/ASUS-ROG-VIII-Motherboard-Integrated/dp/B07SYW3RT2/ only issue for you would be the shipping date being what it is... but, mine was slated to be in stock/shipping on April 7th, and it shipped today... so I dunno O_o You crazy for payin' $200 over MSRP for it mate.

Yah I didn't want to wait, $200 is not bad when you got everything else. That's a great price for the board. I got mine Newegg Business for $399. 
 
I hope this pans out, I saw this on Reddit:
 
He made it themself. I messaged the user and asked if they would be willing to make another, slightly different. They said they're upgrading some of their mills, so it would be two months eta, but if I was still interested then possibly. Pretty sure nobody is coming out with anything so yes... yes I'll still be interested... I wonder what they'll ask for $$$, but if it does happen, I'll let you know.
 

Clovis559PCIe drives are backwards compatible, it just runs at PCIe 3.0/etc speeds. Could you run a crystal mark on it while it's on your Z390? I'm curious about the Random read Q1T1 speed. In benchmarks the drive hit 82/Mb on PCIe 4.0, I'm wondering how much 3.0 will effect it since it's so far under the 3.0 bandwidth. 

DZelmer

Dabadger84

 
Can you tell which drive is the HDD that I'm still waiting on it's replacement to come in? lol
 

Clovis559

Dabadger84
@Clovis559 https://smile.amazon.com/ASUS-ROG-VIII-Motherboard-Integrated/dp/B07SYW3RT2/ only issue for you would be the shipping date being what it is... but, mine was slated to be in stock/shipping on April 7th, and it shipped today... so I dunno O_o You crazy for payin' $200 over MSRP for it mate.

Yah I didn't want to wait, $200 is not bad when you got everything else. That's a great price for the board. I got mine Newegg Business for $399. 
 
I hope this pans out, I saw this on Reddit:
 
He made it themself. I messaged the user and asked if they would be willing to make another, slightly different. They said they're upgrading some of their mills, so it would be two months eta, but if I was still interested then possibly. Pretty sure nobody is coming out with anything so yes... yes I'll still be interested... I wonder what they'll ask for $$$, but if it does happen, I'll let you know.
 

 
That is very nice looking, would be a tubing concern for me though, depending on how my GPU ends up being integrated in to the loop later.
 

Clovis559PCIe drives are backwards compatible, it just runs at PCIe 3.0/etc speeds. Could you run a crystal mark on it while it's on your Z390? I'm curious about the Random read Q1T1 speed. In benchmarks the drive hit 82/Mb on PCIe 4.0, I'm wondering how much 3.0 will effect it since it's so far under the 3.0 bandwidth. 

 
I've had NVMe drives make my system literally not boot up before, so I was slightly concerned even though it was a Samsung and what not.
During the transfer from NVMe to NVMe (the Sabrent Rocket 1TB to the Samsung 980 Pro) it capped out at 2200ish write speed, which sounds about right for PCIe Gen 3.
 
Here's the result ye asked for (I think, I'm not familiar with CrystalDisk, only used it to go "ooooooo" when I got the M.2s at their speedz) : 
 

 
So it's about 75% going from PCIe Gen 4 to Gen 3.

Thats Still SCREAMING FAST! Load times what load times!

Nike_7688

Dabadger84
 
 
The information in those charts is pretty much silly, tbh, look at the resolution they're using.  No one plays at 720p.  That's why I posted 1080p results... And then there's people like me that have a Super Ultrawide so I'm basically playing at 4K, where any game is going to be almost exclusively GPU limited unless it's an FPS snob title like CSGO.  
 
I get that they're trying to exacerbate CPU bottlenecking by lowering the resolution, but showing results at 720p is very pointless imo.  It's impractical.  The majority of gamers, if you believe Steam Hardware Survey, are still on 1080p though, which is why I don't mind people doing CPU testing at that resolution.
 
I've got terabytes of stuff to transfer so I'll be doing that for... however long it takes. lol

I totally get your sentiment there. If you were only concerned about current games, I would totally agree. I don't upgrade my CPU very often, so the 720p numbers actually are relevant. They show what happens when you remove the GPU bottleneck. The GPU is what dictates where all modern games will cap out when you're playing at higher resolutions (I play at 1440p currently). If you look at CPU charts at 1440p, they're all just about the same, so you might figure "what's the point?" 1080p isn't even always much better. That said, when you're considering making the CPU last more than 2-3 years and heading towards 5 years...you want to know which has the least CPU bottleneck now, because while it won't bottleneck you at 1440p+ today, it might in 3+ years. The low resolution tests take the GPU out of the equation and help give you a clue about that. Especially if AMD and Nvidia keep making GPU improvements like seen in the 5700xt to 6800xt and 2080 to 3080 jumps.

Clovis559
 
I game in 4k and shouldn't have needed an upgrade, but during Covid I also rediscovered I like to Overclock, so I'm hoping this CPU lasts me until the next one(s) comes out. I'm not very good at it, but it sure as hell is fun. It also gives me something exciting to wake up for every day besides what is normally going on...
 
The thing that drives me crazy is for overclockers, most of the reviews aren't as helpful. You get way more overclocking headroom on a 10900k then you do a 5000 series AMD... from what I read. But what I read usually involves an AIO, which is kinda ... a meh comparison for me. Seeing stock to stock benchmarks doesn't really work for me either, then trying to dig and find a site with benchmarks that are relevant ... Is ... rough. Trying to find someone who measured 5800/5900/5950 to 10900k on a water chiller is even... more impossible. When my GPU isn't clogged, hoping to fix that reoccurring problem Tuesday, I run some pretty nice overclocks for day to day gaming. 
 
I do like the review Hardware Asylum did, if you search for their Evga Z490 Dark review ... in the review they put a 10900k on Phase change at 5.45ghz. I liked seeing that, as it's super unlikely I'll reach that on water, so I know where to be expecting.  Super curious to see how far I can push an 5950x on 2c-8c coolant o.O