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XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3

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Talon2020
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/04 09:18:45 (permalink)
fugly16
Just found this thread after a little reading, I'll be replacing my 3080 FE with the 3080 xc3 ultra hybrid.  Kind of was wondering if there would ever be a bios update to increase the power limit now that we have these hybrid cards?  




Thats a really bad move, you're going to likely go down in performance since the FE has a higher power limit than the XC3 or at least a wash with the lower temps. The XC3 is severely limited at 320w and causes low clocks under heavy loads. My XC3 Ultra would throttle below 1755Mhz which is the 'stock' boost clock. Totally unacceptable for a 4K gaming card. My 3080 FTW3 Ultra however has no issue holding 2100Mhz under the same conditions because it has 450w of power available. The price difference really makes the XC3 a terrible buy and you won't see a power increase judging by past GPU generations. 

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KingEngineRevUp
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/04 09:46:15 (permalink)
Talon2020
fugly16
Just found this thread after a little reading, I'll be replacing my 3080 FE with the 3080 xc3 ultra hybrid.  Kind of was wondering if there would ever be a bios update to increase the power limit now that we have these hybrid cards?  




Thats a really bad move, you're going to likely go down in performance since the FE has a higher power limit than the XC3 or at least a wash with the lower temps. The XC3 is severely limited at 320w and causes low clocks under heavy loads. My XC3 Ultra would throttle below 1755Mhz which is the 'stock' boost clock. Totally unacceptable for a 4K gaming card. My 3080 FTW3 Ultra however has no issue holding 2100Mhz under the same conditions because it has 450w of power available. The price difference really makes the XC3 a terrible buy and you won't see a power increase judging by past GPU generations. 




I wouldn't say it's a "really bad" move... Performance difference would be like a few percent... And with a hybrid, it'll be 30-40C lower than the FE meaning higher boost clocks to make up for it. 
 
A really bad move would be like if he stepped down to a 3070 or something. A few percent isn't that big of a deal and he might have reasons for it (fan noise, etc). 
 

 
Observe, as you can see the cooler the card, the more it will boost. The FE runs at 75-78C with stock fans. The FTW3 Hyrbid runs  at around 52-55C with 400W, the XC3 should be running in the 45ishC range. It'll run 30 MHz or higher just from being cooled.
post edited by KingEngineRevUp - 2020/12/04 09:50:16

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ID000001
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/04 09:48:10 (permalink)
KingEngineRevUp
 
I wouldn't say it's a "really bad" move... Performance difference would be like a few percent... And with a hybrid, it'll be 30-40C lower than the FE meaning higher boost clocks to make up for it. 
 
A really bad move would be like if he stepped down to a 3070 or something. A few percent isn't that big of a deal and he might have reasons for it (fan noise, etc). 


How is the boost clock going to make up for it? XC3 are limited to 330W sustained. There is no way XC3 can boost much over 1900mhz and stay stable with so little power allowance.
 
 
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KingEngineRevUp
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/04 09:56:32 (permalink)
ID000001
KingEngineRevUp
 
I wouldn't say it's a "really bad" move... Performance difference would be like a few percent... And with a hybrid, it'll be 30-40C lower than the FE meaning higher boost clocks to make up for it. 
 
A really bad move would be like if he stepped down to a 3070 or something. A few percent isn't that big of a deal and he might have reasons for it (fan noise, etc). 


How is the boost clock going to make up for it? XC3 are limited to 330W sustained. There is no way XC3 can boost much over 1900mhz and stay stable with so little power allowance.
 
 




We can't say for certain without testing. But what I can say for certain is that when cooled to below 60C, you get an additional 30-45 extra MHz if we reference a 3080 FE running at 75-78C. See my post above. So the performance difference isn't "really bad" like the other user said. It would be a few unnoticeable percent. 
 
But the 3080 is good at undervolting + OC, I guarantee being under water would allow it to run equally to a 3080 FE. I've undervolted 3 different 3080s and all benched above a stock 3080 FE. 
 
EDIT: Here's the Zotac Trinity with a 320W bios benchmarked against a 3080 FE... Come on now, you're going to agree with the other user that his is really bad? It's just a few percent different. 
 

 
 
post edited by KingEngineRevUp - 2020/12/04 10:01:35

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fugly16
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/04 12:03:18 (permalink)
KingEngineRevUp
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KingEngineRevUp
 
I wouldn't say it's a "really bad" move... Performance difference would be like a few percent... And with a hybrid, it'll be 30-40C lower than the FE meaning higher boost clocks to make up for it. 
 
A really bad move would be like if he stepped down to a 3070 or something. A few percent isn't that big of a deal and he might have reasons for it (fan noise, etc). 


How is the boost clock going to make up for it? XC3 are limited to 330W sustained. There is no way XC3 can boost much over 1900mhz and stay stable with so little power allowance.
 
 




We can't say for certain without testing. But what I can say for certain is that when cooled to below 60C, you get an additional 30-45 extra MHz if we reference a 3080 FE running at 75-78C. See my post above. So the performance difference isn't "really bad" like the other user said. It would be a few unnoticeable percent. 
 
But the 3080 is good at undervolting + OC, I guarantee being under water would allow it to run equally to a 3080 FE. I've undervolted 3 different 3080s and all benched above a stock 3080 FE. 
 
EDIT: Here's the Zotac Trinity with a 320W bios benchmarked against a 3080 FE... Come on now, you're going to agree with the other user that his is really bad? It's just a few percent different. 
 

 
 




So I used to have a 1070 FE with an EVGA hybrid kit and LOVED it.  It would stay at a 2100mhz clock very easily.  I just guessed that a hybrid 3080 would be able to perform similarly.   

3080 FTW3 Ultra Hybrid 
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ID000001
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/04 12:05:30 (permalink)
Getting a hybrid version just to do as good as FE is kinda disappointing if you ask me.
 
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Manujito
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/04 12:08:18 (permalink)
Talon2020
 
Thats a really bad move, you're going to likely go down in performance since the FE has a higher power limit than the XC3 or at least a wash with the lower temps. The XC3 is severely limited at 320w and causes low clocks under heavy loads. My XC3 Ultra would throttle below 1755Mhz which is the 'stock' boost clock. Totally unacceptable for a 4K gaming card. My 3080 FTW3 Ultra however has no issue holding 2100Mhz under the same conditions because it has 450w of power available. The price difference really makes the XC3 a terrible buy and you won't see a power increase judging by past GPU generations. 

I'm sorry in what situation does your card drop below 1755? I've been using mine with a mild overclock for about a week and it hovers around 1925-2100 depending on the game and load. Only time I've seen it drop below 1900 was during Time Spy, but even then, it was like 1885 or something.
I would love an increase in power limit but it's not a bad card by any means.
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fugly16
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/04 12:10:22 (permalink)
Manujito
Talon2020
 
Thats a really bad move, you're going to likely go down in performance since the FE has a higher power limit than the XC3 or at least a wash with the lower temps. The XC3 is severely limited at 320w and causes low clocks under heavy loads. My XC3 Ultra would throttle below 1755Mhz which is the 'stock' boost clock. Totally unacceptable for a 4K gaming card. My 3080 FTW3 Ultra however has no issue holding 2100Mhz under the same conditions because it has 450w of power available. The price difference really makes the XC3 a terrible buy and you won't see a power increase judging by past GPU generations. 

I'm sorry in what situation does your card drop below 1755? I've been using mine with a mild overclock for about a week and it hovers around 1925-2100 depending on the game and load. Only time I've seen it drop below 1900 was during Time Spy, but even then, it was like 1885 or something.
I would love an increase in power limit but it's not a bad card by any means.




The best my 3080 FE hit was 2100mhz but the average was 1970mhz in timespy.  This is with like 80% fan on the card I think.

3080 FTW3 Ultra Hybrid 
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KingEngineRevUp
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/04 12:11:31 (permalink)
ID000001
Getting a hybrid version just to do as good as FE is kinda disappointing if you ask me.
 




Yeah, but the OC headroom of the 30 series is kinda disappointing to many also. Draw 450W just for 2-3% extra performance? Know what I mean? Of course I'm just playing devils advocate here or a voice of reason. I'm running a 450W bios on my EVGA FTW3 and will be getting a hybrid kit for it. 
 
I'm just saying, these cards are very hard to get and if fugly16 scored a card and already sold his FE, he shouldn't feel to bad because there's not much we can do to these cards to make a noticeable performance difference. 
 
My 2080 Ti hybrid was able to perform +12-15%, OC, that was totally worth it. The 3080s, probably +5% average. I'm still going to do it because that's what I like to do. But for others that just want to game and not tinker, probably not "really bad" if you know what I mean. 
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fugly16
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/04 12:16:36 (permalink)
KingEngineRevUp
ID000001
Getting a hybrid version just to do as good as FE is kinda disappointing if you ask me.
 




Yeah, but the OC headroom of the 30 series is kinda disappointing to many also. Draw 450W just for 2-3% extra performance? Know what I mean? Of course I'm just playing devils advocate here or a voice of reason. I'm running a 450W bios on my EVGA FTW3 and will be getting a hybrid kit for it. 
 
I'm just saying, these cards are very hard to get and if fugly16 scored a card and already sold his FE, he shouldn't feel to bad because there's not much we can do to these cards to make a noticeable performance difference. 
 
My 2080 Ti hybrid was able to perform +12-15%, OC, that was totally worth it. The 3080s, probably +5% average. I'm still going to do it because that's what I like to do. But for others that just want to game and not tinker, probably not "really bad" if you know what I mean. 




So far I've promised my 3080 FE to my co-worker for cost.  Pending results on if it'll fix my 280x case, which I think it will.  Potential fitment problem as I have a H100i AIO rad/fans at the top already.  Damn, would have really loved to go with the ftw3 hybrid but with the card being already 5.5" and the tubes adding another 1", no way I'd be able to fit my side panel on.

3080 FTW3 Ultra Hybrid 
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ID000001
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/04 12:24:18 (permalink)
KingEngineRevUp
 
Yeah, but the OC headroom of the 30 series is kinda disappointing to many also. Draw 450W just for 2-3% extra performance? Know what I mean? Of course I'm just playing devils advocate here or a voice of reason. I'm running a 450W bios on my EVGA FTW3 and will be getting a hybrid kit for it. 
 

 
2-3% compare to what? a 2100 mhz vs a 1890mhz is like 9% clock speed increase. That shouldn't be just 2-3% extra performance. Closer to 5% at worst. I understand it is not a huge improvement but at this tier we are not looking for efficiency, we are looking for getting as much out of the card as possible. 
 
Think of it this way, if the performance is 5%, that is half way to a 3090 already. which cost double on average only get 10% improvement over a 3080. So you are getting a free $300 with just 5% of extra performance. Why would anyone not want that? 
 
I would totally pay $100 more to get that. 
 
 
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Thorissr
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/04 13:10:38 (permalink)
My 3080 XC3 Ultra without an OC and custom fan curve applied runs at 1905Mhz-1935Mhz when gaming as long as my temps are 63c or lower. The only OC that I found to be stable in stress tests/benchmarks/games is 100 core 500 memory, and it runs at 1995Mhz - 2010Mhz max when gaming and temps stay within the 60c-70c range. I can OC it with 150+core 250+memory and score in the 18000 range in timespy but this overclock proves to make games freeze/crash. From stock to a stable overclock correlates in real world usage in games anywhere from 6 -20 FPS, depending on which games I play.
 
Since I’m already running my games past my monitor‘s refresh rate at ultra settings, 1440p/144mhz on stock clocks, I’ve decided to forego the overclocking route. If a game arrives where I feel that I need that extra juice to reach a certain FPS level, I will revisit overclocking my card. These cards are very sensitive to overclocking and do not yield the results I’m accustomed to with the Turing architect.
 
 
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KingEngineRevUp
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/04 13:11:42 (permalink)
ID000001
KingEngineRevUp
 
Yeah, but the OC headroom of the 30 series is kinda disappointing to many also. Draw 450W just for 2-3% extra performance? Know what I mean? Of course I'm just playing devils advocate here or a voice of reason. I'm running a 450W bios on my EVGA FTW3 and will be getting a hybrid kit for it. 
 

 
2-3% compare to what? a 2100 mhz vs a 1890mhz is like 9% clock speed increase. That shouldn't be just 2-3% extra performance. Closer to 5% at worst. I understand it is not a huge improvement but at this tier we are not looking for efficiency, we are looking for getting as much out of the card as possible. 
 
Think of it this way, if the performance is 5%, that is half way to a 3090 already. which cost double on average only get 10% improvement over a 3080. So you are getting a free $300 with just 5% of extra performance. Why would anyone not want that? 
 
I would totally pay $100 more to get that. 
 
 




I don't disagree with you here, but my point is, not a lot of people have these luxuries. Some people truly need a card right now. Would you tell someone that got a 3080 XC3 hybrid to return or cancel their order because it will perform within 0%-3%? 0% because it might have better boost. 
 
The difference between the FE and XC3 Hybrid would be probably negligible and convenience might be the deciding factor here, having a card now vs later. 
 
 
 
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ID000001
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/04 13:17:26 (permalink)
KingEngineRevUp
 
I don't disagree with you here, but my point is, not a lot of people have these luxuries. Some people truly need a card right now. Would you tell someone that got a 3080 XC3 hybrid to return or cancel their order because it will perform within 0%-3%? 0% because it might have better boost. 
 
The difference between the FE and XC3 Hybrid would be probably negligible and convenience might be the deciding factor here, having a card now vs later. 
 

 
I know you are just talking about that one specific guy trying to compare between FE and XC3, but the point of this thread is that It doesn't need to be like this.
 
All EVGA has to do is give us a better bios that can use that extra cooling. Heck, Even if they just make the card function as advertised: going up to 366W, it would be enough for many people. The problem is that the power slider is literally broken. It doesn't work. EVGA can fix it.
 
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KingEngineRevUp
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/04 13:18:39 (permalink)
ID000001
KingEngineRevUp
 
I don't disagree with you here, but my point is, not a lot of people have these luxuries. Some people truly need a card right now. Would you tell someone that got a 3080 XC3 hybrid to return or cancel their order because it will perform within 0%-3%? 0% because it might have better boost. 
 
The difference between the FE and XC3 Hybrid would be probably negligible and convenience might be the deciding factor here, having a card now vs later. 
 

 
I know you are just talking about that one specific guy trying to compare between FE and XC3, but the point of this thread is that It doesn't need to be like this.
 
All EVGA has to do is give us a better bios that can use that extra cooling. Heck, Even if they just make the card function as advertised: going up to 366W, it would be enough for many people. The problem is that the power slider is literally broken. It doesn't work. EVGA can fix it.
 


Agreed
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dreamer_cast
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/04 13:23:58 (permalink)
Hey guys so is it worth it/beneficial to apply the FTW 400w followed by the 450w update to the XC3?  I'm ready to do it but I keep hearing different things on both sides,
 
dreamer
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fugly16
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/04 13:25:29 (permalink)
dreamer_cast
Hey guys so is it worth it/beneficial to apply the FTW 400w followed by the 450w update to the XC3?  I'm ready to do it but I keep hearing different things on both sides,
 
dreamer




I know that frame chasers guy on youtube did but I don't think it's a good idea.  

3080 FTW3 Ultra Hybrid 
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ID000001
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/04 13:26:31 (permalink)
dreamer_cast
Hey guys so is it worth it/beneficial to apply the FTW 400w followed by the 450w update to the XC3?  I'm ready to do it but I keep hearing different things on both sides,
 
dreamer




I tried it on my XC3 and I don't see any performance differences. It is a bit "messy" because it duplicate one of the rail that you don't have and think you are using a lot more power than you actually do. So I just switched back and hope EVGA give us something to use for aftermarket cooling or their hybrid kit.
 
you can try it if you want, it is no big deal, you can always switch back long as you have another graphic card to put in if needed. 
 
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KingEngineRevUp
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/04 13:41:40 (permalink)
fugly16
dreamer_cast
Hey guys so is it worth it/beneficial to apply the FTW 400w followed by the 450w update to the XC3?  I'm ready to do it but I keep hearing different things on both sides,
 
dreamer




I know that frame chasers guy on youtube did but I don't think it's a good idea.  


He did it but his card is shunt modded so it negates the point. Overclock.net, I haven't checked in months but last time multiple people flashed every bios known to 2x 8-pins with no luck and got nothing. 
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KingEngineRevUp
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/04 13:43:02 (permalink)
ID000001
dreamer_cast
Hey guys so is it worth it/beneficial to apply the FTW 400w followed by the 450w update to the XC3?  I'm ready to do it but I keep hearing different things on both sides,
 
dreamer




I tried it on my XC3 and I don't see any performance differences. It is a bit "messy" because it duplicate one of the rail that you don't have and think you are using a lot more power than you actually do. So I just switched back and hope EVGA give us something to use for aftermarket cooling or their hybrid kit.
 
you can try it if you want, it is no big deal, you can always switch back long as you have another graphic card to put in if needed. 
 




It would be nice if someone who has a Corsair RMi or RMx PSU can do the test for you guys as it reports power usage of the system and even rails. Or someone with a wall watt meter from harbor freight for $15-20. 
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/04 14:13:54 (permalink)
OK guys thanks...guess I'll just put on the waterblock and wait and see if EVGA releases anything
 
dreamer
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pete748
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/07 06:46:14 (permalink)
So I don't ever really jump into forums and comment on stuff but I created an account just to comment on this thread. I have an XC3 ultra 3090 which cost me 1600GBP so that's about 1850USD give or take so I wouldn't class that as a 'budget' card which some people on this thread have said. I purchased this card because it was 280mm in length and I knew it would definitely fit my case and I didn't want to take the chance with the FTW not fitting and having to return it.
 
Now with the scene set onto the topic at hand, the bios and power limit. If I want to set my card on fire by pushing the power limit beyond EVGA's spec and recommendation I should be able to do that knowing the risks involved. If you really must put in an acknowledgment tick box so there is no come back on you or have people email support with an acknowledgment that they know the risks involved to get the bios, there are means and ways around the litigation issue.
 
I paid an extortionate amount of money for this card I should be able to do with it what I want.
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fugly16
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/07 07:27:27 (permalink)
pete748
So I don't ever really jump into forums and comment on stuff but I created an account just to comment on this thread. I have an XC3 ultra 3090 which cost me 1600GBP so that's about 1850USD give or take so I wouldn't class that as a 'budget' card which some people on this thread have said. I purchased this card because it was 280mm in length and I knew it would definitely fit my case and I didn't want to take the chance with the FTW not fitting and having to return it.
 
Now with the scene set onto the topic at hand, the bios and power limit. If I want to set my card on fire by pushing the power limit beyond EVGA's spec and recommendation I should be able to do that knowing the risks involved. If you really must put in an acknowledgment tick box so there is no come back on you or have people email support with an acknowledgment that they know the risks involved to get the bios, there are means and ways around the litigation issue.
 
I paid an extortionate amount of money for this card I should be able to do with it what I want.




I'm with you, the FTW3 hybrid will not fit my case so I went with the xc3 hybrid.  Hoping they reconsider and push out a new bios for this model with a higher power limit.

3080 FTW3 Ultra Hybrid 
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Solaries
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/08 09:45:49 (permalink)
Just another XC3 owner here hoping to get more than 330w out of their card some day. 
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Thorissr
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/08 17:30:00 (permalink)
There’s a tool within Geforce Experience that overclocks your card by finding a stable OC. When I first received my card early last month I recall monitoring the power draw while it was going through the lengthy process of finding a stable overclock, and my card was pulling in excess of 380 watts. However, when it found a stable clock all my games crashed...lol. I immediately uninstalled GFE and performed my own OC in MSI AB. Point is...the card is able to exceed 370ish however it won’t stick unless the XC3‘s firmware is updated to allow it. 
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fugly16
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/09 06:35:02 (permalink)
Thorissr
There’s a tool within Geforce Experience that overclocks your card by finding a stable OC. When I first received my card early last month I recall monitoring the power draw while it was going through the lengthy process of finding a stable overclock, and my card was pulling in excess of 380 watts. However, when it found a stable clock all my games crashed...lol. I immediately uninstalled GFE and performed my own OC in MSI AB. Point is...the card is able to exceed 370ish however it won’t stick unless the XC3‘s firmware is updated to allow it. 




Yeah playing some games to test out my xc3 hybrid and I'm seeing what you are seeing essentially.  The power limit on these is really a bummer.

3080 FTW3 Ultra Hybrid 
#86
convexion
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/09 11:55:47 (permalink)
Pretty sad state of affairs that EVGA sold the XC3 over the price of the Founder's Edition, but won't provide a BIOS update to address the crippled power delivery to at least maximize what two 8 pins are capable of. Probably the only hope for an update is to get this problem addressed by a site like Gamers Nexus considering the radio silence we're getting from EVGA.
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fugly16
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/09 12:01:57 (permalink)
convexion
Pretty sad state of affairs that EVGA sold the XC3 over the price of the Founder's Edition, but won't provide a BIOS update to address the crippled power delivery to at least maximize what two 8 pins are capable of. Probably the only hope for an update is to get this problem addressed by a site like Gamers Nexus considering the radio silence we're getting from EVGA.




I'm kind of surprised they weren't given one of the hybrids to test out and make a video on

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Morganessa
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/09 12:37:24 (permalink)
I just swapped my XC3 for a FTW3 because of this. Thanks EVGA, you win 
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fugly16
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Re: XC3 bios update? Show the same love you gave to FTW3 2020/12/17 08:17:59 (permalink)
So I want to be an optimist and assume that EVGA will release a special bios update for the XC3 ultra hybrids.  Right guys?  RIGHT?!?  
 
 

3080 FTW3 Ultra Hybrid 
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