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Pc goes off

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tmmy34
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2021/12/27 09:28:06 (permalink)
Hi my pc: 10850K stock 4800mhz

2x16 GB DDR4 GSKILL 3000mhz XMP

Seasonic Tx-850 Ultra Titanium

Gigabyte Rtx 3090 Gaming OC

Aorus Z490 Pro Gaming

1 TB SSD

I bought machine and plugged in march 2021. No single issue,no reboots,no shutdowns. I played all games for many hours,no issues. Today...........i launched Metro Exodus and after cinematic part pc just shutdown<goes off>. I rebooted again and its fine again. My question is. It was psu issue or maybe other hardware?

I go to neighbourhood and ask about power ,but they had power in this time. So propably not power outage for 1 sec?
 
I remember that when pc goes off ,case lights flickered once and monitor flickered. That not happens when i shutting down manually.

Running now Battlefield 5 no shutdowns.
post edited by tmmy34 - 2021/12/27 09:46:45

Pc:
9900K 5ghz ( llc level 5 idle 1.34-1.35v,load 1.313-323v)
2x16GB DDR4 GSKILL 3000mhz
Asus Prime Z390-A
Corsair 850RmX
Rtx 2080 Ti Aorus
#1

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    yaymz
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/27 10:09:38 (permalink)
    The 3090's are power hogs, but I doubt the cinematic would crash the card from not having enough power (850w should be plenty given the specs). Could really be any of a number of things.  Hard to diagnose without repeatable errors.
     

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    tmmy34
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/27 10:16:27 (permalink)
    i am running now game and no shutdowns. Happened today once. Also i have pc until march 2021 and thats never happened.

    Pc:
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    #3
    Fennario
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/27 10:25:39 (permalink)
    Update your driver
    Update OS
    Update PX1/Afterburner
    Reset card to factory defaults (no over/underclock)
    Check integrity of game files
    Purchase quality 1500va UPS from APC (eg: https://www.apc.com/shop/us/en/products/APC-Back-UPS-Pro-1500VA-for-Gaming-120V-Pure-Sinewave-LCD-Black-3-USB-charging-ports-10-NEMA-outlets-4-surge-/P-BGM1500B)
     
    post edited by Fennario - 2021/12/27 10:28:01
    #4
    tmmy34
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/27 10:41:23 (permalink)
    gpu is on stock

    Pc:
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    Derren001
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/27 11:37:23 (permalink)
    Fennario
    Update your driver
    Update OS
    Update PX1/Afterburner
    Reset card to factory defaults (no over/underclock)
    Check integrity of game files
    Purchase quality 1500va UPS from APC (eg: https://www.apc.com/shop/us/en/products/APC-Back-UPS-Pro-1500VA-for-Gaming-120V-Pure-Sinewave-LCD-Black-3-USB-charging-ports-10-NEMA-outlets-4-surge-/P-BGM1500B)

     
    ah yes, a UPS for gamers...
     

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    #6
    tmmy34
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/27 11:42:09 (permalink)
    Happened when gpu load change from 0% to 99%.

    Pc:
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    #7
    nomoss
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/27 11:45:07 (permalink)
    You should look at the Windows Event Viewer to see what errors are associated with the crash.
    I'm not particularly impressed with the current Seasonic PSUs, or for that matter, Gigabyte's GPUs.  I

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    tmmy34
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/27 11:51:12 (permalink)
    Only kernel 41

    Pc:
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    2x16GB DDR4 GSKILL 3000mhz
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    HeavyHemi
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/27 12:16:35 (permalink)
    tmmy34
    Only kernel 41


    Has this only happened once? If so, I wouldn't worry about it. Kernel 41 errors can happen for any number of reasons, including a random flipped bit.

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    tmmy34
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/27 12:29:08 (permalink)
    Yes once just. Happened when i click press button E and gpu usage jump from 0% to 99% and pc turned off.

    Pc:
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    #11
    yaymz
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/27 13:22:27 (permalink)
    I would start with a fresh install of the game and also a clean install of the most current nvidia driver.  Also make sure windows is fully up to date before you do the fresh driver install.
     
    If you are still experiencing issues, you could have a hardware issue / or it could be tied to a bad windows update install.. If you are willing and able, a fresh windows install may help.  Before you do that, you can always check/test the PSU, RAM, SSD..  Overheating can cause this as well, so make sure all fans/AIO coolers, etc are properly working.  .   I don't think it is the GPU, but you never know, but good luck.
     
     
     

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    jaredbyoung
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/27 15:07:32 (permalink)
    I would start with waiting for it to happen again. That's what I would start with.
     
    Be aware of what's going on and log data on hardware monitor or the like. If it happens again you should have even more info to go off of.
    post edited by jaredbyoung - 2021/12/27 15:08:59
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    kraade
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/27 15:25:20 (permalink)
    when the GPU usage goes up really fast it can cause a PSU OCP if your PSU is close to the edge, AN 850 T should have the head room not to do this but 3090s can spike crazy sometimes. 
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    nomoss
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/27 15:35:38 (permalink)
    The Gigabyte 3090 only has two 8-pin power connectors, meaning the card is drawing additional power through the PCIE slot. Sudden power spikes may be coming through that slot.
    Have you checked the Gigabyte and Seasonic forums to see if others with your components have experienced similar issues?

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    talon951
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/27 19:10:22 (permalink)
    OMG, no a card being 2x8pin does not mean it pulls more power from the slot. That has nothing to do with how the card may load balance.

    If the machine actually powered down that is PSU OCP. Some games cause higher power spikes than others. Some PSUs hit OCP more easily than others.

    If it doesn't do it anymore I wouldn't worry about it. If it does it again buy a new PSU. I've had good luck with my RM850x and RM1000x. Neither have hit OCP running a 1kw XOC bios, so they should easily handle a stock 3090. There are plenty of other good PSUs and there's a thread floating around this forum with people listing working PSUs with 30 series cards.
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    tmmy34
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/27 19:52:47 (permalink)
    Happened once during skipping cinematic in Metro Exodus,pc just shutdown.Not able to reproduce. I dont know if that psu or maybe brownout?
    But my laptop not turned off,laptop was plugged to second power cord.


    So after that i run again: 3dmark port royal,3dmark wild life,time spy extreme,battlefield 5,control,metro exodus Enhanced and no shutdown again. Pc runs fine again.
     
    This problem with seasonic occurs with only FE model cards. I dont have FE. I have Gigabyte Gaming 3090.2x8pin
     
    https://www.overclock.net/threads/seasonic-850-prime-ultra-titanium-power-cycles-ocp-with-3090.1794053/
     
    "It's not transient, not OCP, not OPP, it's not related to oneseasonic and the focus problem, it's a separate well-documented problem with the cards feeding the 12v sense line in the ATX 24-pin cable with noise, until the PSU mistakenly shuts down/restarts the pc.

    Cutting the 12v line or putting a coil to insulate it solves the problem. "
     
    post edited by tmmy34 - 2021/12/27 19:59:00

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    2x16GB DDR4 GSKILL 3000mhz
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    nomoss
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/27 20:12:15 (permalink)
    talon951
    OMG, no a card being 2x8pin does not mean it pulls more power from the slot. That has nothing to do with how the card may load balance.

    We've seen how well this gen load balances.  We've seen power spiking during a cutscene, too. 


    post edited by nomoss - 2021/12/27 20:14:21

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    tmmy34
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/27 20:18:32 (permalink)
    nomoss
    talon951
    OMG, no a card being 2x8pin does not mean it pulls more power from the slot. That has nothing to do with how the card may load balance.

    We've seen how well this gen load balances.  We've seen power spiking during a cutscene, too. 




    So this can happen with 2x8 pin too?

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    Squall_Rinoa86
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/27 21:00:34 (permalink)
    850W with a 3090? In all honesty sense the 3090 CAN draw over 500W of power.. having only a 850W isn't that great of an idea. I am using a 3080 FTW3 with a 1300W... not saying go that high but should be at least a 1000w min to be safe. On top of that the the 10850K can draw nearly 300W by itself under Load. Add on fans, HD's, etc.. 

    Given the fact the computer shuts off, and the PSU's DO degrade over time, Feel very confident it's a PSU issue. 

    BTW, BF5 on a 3090, isn't taxing, which explains why the GPU isn't shutting off, as the game doesn't tax GPU's to 100%. What's your GPU usage hit?
    post edited by Squall_Rinoa86 - 2021/12/27 21:02:29




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    jaredbyoung
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/27 21:57:31 (permalink)
    Squall_Rinoa86
    850W with a 3090? In all honesty sense the 3090 CAN draw over 500W of power.. having only a 850W isn't that great of an idea. I am using a 3080 FTW3 with a 1300W... not saying go that high but should be at least a 1000w min to be safe. On top of that the the 10850K can draw nearly 300W by itself under Load. Add on fans, HD's, etc.. 

    Given the fact the computer shuts off, and the PSU's DO degrade over time, Feel very confident it's a PSU issue. 

    BTW, BF5 on a 3090, isn't taxing, which explains why the GPU isn't shutting off, as the game doesn't tax GPU's to 100%. What's your GPU usage hit?


    You said "computer shuts off" like this is a thing that has happened multiple times. The OP had an issue ONE TIME! ONE TIME!
     
    Let it happen at least one more time before you start replacing PSUs and nuking your windows install, OP.
     
     
    #21
    ty_ger07
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/27 22:06:09 (permalink)
    nomoss
    We've seen how well this gen load balances.

    This gen doesn't have problems load balancing. Some of EVGA's cards have a problem load balancing. This person has a Gigabyte card. It is not affected by "this gen's" supposed load balancing issues.
    post edited by ty_ger07 - 2021/12/28 09:31:55

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    nomoss
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/27 22:38:31 (permalink)
    ty_ger07
    This is not an EVGA card. Just because some of EVGA's cards load balance bad doesn't mean that all manufacturers have the same problem.

    Unless the issue itself is with the 3090 architecture.  3090 has power spike, overloads input, PSU shuts down.  This isn't new to the 3090 from any manufacturer but well done to Gigabyte for the card not popping.   Maybe the fact that it is limited to 375 watts saved it.
     
    Kernel 41 indicates power error.  Perhaps a new bigger PSU would help.  I love my SuperFlower Platinum SE 1200w since we're in a thread about a computer that has no EVGA parts.
    post edited by nomoss - 2021/12/27 22:39:46

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    tmmy34
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/27 23:44:08 (permalink)
    So rma psu or change psu if that happened once?
     
     
    ps:
    Maybe it was some kind of outage ? I repeated launching game maybe 50 times again and no shutdown.
    post edited by tmmy34 - 2021/12/28 02:18:39

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    2x16GB DDR4 GSKILL 3000mhz
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    ty_ger07
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/28 04:07:11 (permalink)
    tmmy34
    So rma psu or change psu if that happened once?

    I wouldn't do anything until it happens more often. There are too many possibilities to chase blindly. If it happens too infrequently, how will you know if you solved it?
    nomoss
    ty_ger07
    This is not an EVGA card. Just because some of EVGA's cards load balance bad doesn't mean that all manufacturers have the same problem.

    Unless the issue itself is with the 3090 architecture.  3090 has power spike, overloads input, PSU shuts down.

    You said load balance. We aren't talking about power spikes when talking about load balance. NVIDIA's power monitoring is too slow and based on averaging, and thus power spikes is a separate topic from power balancing. Better balancing should cause power spikes to be better distributed on average, sure (since one input isn't constantly near the upper edge compared to the others; just waiting to be pushed over the edge), but not necessarily certain.
    post edited by ty_ger07 - 2021/12/28 08:33:43

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    nomoss
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/28 09:10:23 (permalink)
    ty_ger07

    You said load balance. We aren't talking about power spikes when talking about load balance. NVIDIA's power monitoring is too slow and based on averaging, and thus power spikes is a separate topic from power balancing. Better balancing should cause power spikes to be better distributed on average, sure (since one input isn't constantly near the upper edge compared to the others; just waiting to be pushed over the edge), but not necessarily certain.

    Technically, talon said "load balance."  And then you just explained why load balancing could be a concern during power spikes.  
    150+150+75 on a 3090 - I'd be undervolting the heck out of that card.

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    Sajin
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/28 09:15:06 (permalink)
    Run the occt power supply test to see if your psu is at fault. https://www.ocbase.com/
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    ty_ger07
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/28 09:33:02 (permalink)
    nomoss
    Technically, talon said "load balance." 

    nomoss
    We've seen how well this gen load balances.

    This gen doesn't have problems load balancing. Some of EVGA's cards have a problem load balancing. This person has a Gigabyte card. It is not affected by "this gen's" supposed load balancing issues.
    nomoss
    And then you just explained why load balancing could be a concern during power spikes.  

    Yes. Load balancing can negatively affect the behavior during power spikes. If you have an affected EVGA card, it's not great. But this person doesn't have an EVGA card.

    This generation as a whole has a power spike issue; by design. Some cards it matters, some cards not so much.

    This generation as a whole doesn't have a load balance issue. Only certain cards (from EVGA, for example) have a load balance issue.

    If you can't make sense of it, draw a venn diagram. This user has a Gigabyte card which is not affected by the problem you said that it is affected by.
    post edited by ty_ger07 - 2021/12/28 10:23:07

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    aka_STEVE_b
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/28 11:23:52 (permalink)
    an 850 Titanium psu 'should' be ok with a 3090 card ... but as many can attest too ,the 30xx series cards have high transient power spikes which cause fault protections in psu's to trip.
     
    So you should consider getting a 1000W or better psu unit on it's way , sooner than later.

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    nomoss
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    Re: Pc goes off 2021/12/28 12:44:55 (permalink)
    ty_ger07
    nomoss
    Technically, talon said "load balance." 

    nomoss
    We've seen how well this gen load balances.

    This gen doesn't have problems load balancing. Some of EVGA's cards have a problem load balancing. This person has a Gigabyte card. It is not affected by "this gen's" supposed load balancing issues.
    nomoss
    And then you just explained why load balancing could be a concern during power spikes.  

    Yes. Load balancing can negatively affect the behavior during power spikes. If you have an affected EVGA card, it's not great. But this person doesn't have an EVGA card.

    This generation as a whole has a power spike issue; by design. Some cards it matters, some cards not so much.

    This generation as a whole doesn't have a load balance issue. Only certain cards (from EVGA, for example) have a load balance issue.

    If you can't make sense of it, draw a venn diagram. This user has a Gigabyte card which is not affected by the problem you said that it is affected by.

    Sigh - again - you said that’s the problem I was referring too. It’s also a problem that was reported on other cards (but EVGA got all the press.)
    I said it’s a design issue, which you agree with.
    I’m not sure what your point is, except to say that a Gigabyte card can’t have load leveling issues - which is a conjecture - just as my supposition that the spike could be causing his issue and could be because the spike is overwhelming the PCIE slot is a conjecture that draws some parallel from but not assertion that it is the same issue EVGA had. My conjecture draws from other info I’ve seen and issues I’ve had with Giagabyte products but not the specific ones in his build. Both of our conjectures would require testing to turn into a theory. How much effort do you really want to put into this? He should get a bigger power supply if it happens again is probably the right answer to his issue, if not a complete correction of the root cause.
    If the point is to win an argument that’s entirely based on a one time Kernel 41 error and shutdown with no repeat then - ok, you win?
    post edited by nomoss - 2021/12/28 12:53:02

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