arthurz21

NereusHixon

arthurz21

TRIPLE-AAA-
So I have one myself and I was just wondering if anyone has the same issue where you can't use the M2 screws it comes with to actually fasten it to the card? There's not even any holes for those screws to go into even though the instructions say to do so. Currently I just have the M3 screw attached but I don't know if that's really OK because the instructions say to only use that screw with a backplate with a compatible screw hole but doesn't state which backplates are compatible? Nothing wrong with the Powerlink 41s as a whole just seems kinda strange to me. Works perfectly otherwise just very confusing to me.

My hybrid does not have those screw holes as well. I am also using the M3 alone. 

You sure? For my hybrid I am able to screw in the smaller M2 screws but not the bigger one M3 which is in the center.

https://imgur.com/a/H5I4Gfq
I am pretty sure I can only screw in with M3. There are no holes on either side of that M3 screw hole. 

That's really strange. Look at mine. I have screwed in the first and the last one. The middle one had no where to go. Maybe they changed the design of the backplate later ? When did you get your card ? I got mine in May.
 
https://imgur.com/a/iYjOFqo
 
It would be interesting to know if anyone was able to use all 3 screws on the backplate.

arthurz21

NereusHixon

arthurz21

NereusHixon

arthurz21

TRIPLE-AAA-
So I have one myself and I was just wondering if anyone has the same issue where you can't use the M2 screws it comes with to actually fasten it to the card? There's not even any holes for those screws to go into even though the instructions say to do so. Currently I just have the M3 screw attached but I don't know if that's really OK because the instructions say to only use that screw with a backplate with a compatible screw hole but doesn't state which backplates are compatible? Nothing wrong with the Powerlink 41s as a whole just seems kinda strange to me. Works perfectly otherwise just very confusing to me.

My hybrid does not have those screw holes as well. I am also using the M3 alone. 

You sure? For my hybrid I am able to screw in the smaller M2 screws but not the bigger one M3 which is in the center.

https://imgur.com/a/H5I4Gfq
I am pretty sure I can only screw in with M3. There are no holes on either side of that M3 screw hole. 

That's really strange. Look at mine. I have screwed in the first and the last one. The middle one had no where to go. Maybe they changed the design of the backplate later ? When did you get your card ? I got mine in May.
 
https://imgur.com/a/iYjOFqo
 
It would be interesting to know if anyone was able to use all 3 screws on the backplate.

I just received this card yesterday. Maybe they did change the backplate design then. 

Looks like it. But now I am curious to know the reason for the design change.

This is an interesting article that is somewhat related. Makes the use of that adapter more justified possibly.

https://wccftech.com/atx-...pter-confirms-pci-sig/

talon951
This is an interesting article that is somewhat related. Makes the use of that adapter more justified possibly.

https://wccftech.com/atx-...pter-confirms-pci-sig/

That article is terrible, and beyond that it is wrong. The "specs" they listed were wrong. The way the current is handled is wrong, and their conclusions about which connectors failed or had problems was wrong.

talon951

B0baganoosh

talon951
This is an interesting article that is somewhat related. Makes the use of that adapter more justified possibly.

https://wccftech.com/atx-...pter-confirms-pci-sig/

That article is terrible, and beyond that it is wrong. The "specs" they listed were wrong. The way the current is handled is wrong, and their conclusions about which connectors failed or had problems was wrong.

Well why don't you educate us then?

I agree there are a lot of issues with this article, along with the understanding of PCIe specs.  You don't even need to go further than the author's assumption that an 8pin PCIe power connector is designed to only provide 150W, which drives most of the "concern" about using current power supplies on next-gen cards.  This is a myth that keeps getting repeated, but it's not technically correct.

talon951

B0baganoosh

talon951
This is an interesting article that is somewhat related. Makes the use of that adapter more justified possibly.

https://wccftech.com/atx-...pter-confirms-pci-sig/

That article is terrible, and beyond that it is wrong. The "specs" they listed were wrong. The way the current is handled is wrong, and their conclusions about which connectors failed or had problems was wrong.

Well why don't you educate us then?

First of all, no offense was intended to you, whatsoever. I just wanted to be abundantly clear that the article was wrong. Lee pointed out the biggest issue, which drives their entire assumption and a lot of the bad results, which is that the 8-pin connectors are not rated for 150W. The sockets in the connectors are rated 7-9A depending on how many are driving power in the connector at a time. In the 8-pin PCIe connectors, 6 pins are power and two pins are sense. So if you assume 6 pins are power, 3 of them +12V and 3 of them ground, you can have up to 24A (8-each) on one of those connectors...continuous. That would be 288W ((8Ax3)x12V) (assuming power factor of 1 but lets not get into that). If they were using all 8 pins for power, they'd be 6A each, which results in the same 288W ((6Ax4)x12V). So a card running at 450W split over two 8-pins should split that to be around 60W on the slot and ~195W to each 8-pin cable. If the card load balances correctly (which...I know...isn't always the case), it shouldn't be a problem. Personally, I'd still prefer a 3x 8-pin splitter, where you're only throwing about ~130W at each one, but that's just me. Are there cards out there that don't split their power evenly? Sure. Do I blame the connectors for that? nope. Maybe there are some crappy adapters out there that don't use adequate sockets or wiring (the current numbers I gave are for 16 or 18AWG, but if you used 20AWG or smaller those numbers drop), but the article said that power supplies without the new connectors are bad or dangerous to use with adaptors in general and that's just not the case.

talon951
So what does the power balance look like using a 3x8pin adapter then? That was the only interesting assertion from the article. If it isn't well balanced then it's not great even if it works.

Keep in mind that I'm not saying I think the article is accurate, but an interesting thing to at least test.

The problem with discussing balance on a 3090 Ti and next-gen cards is essentially describing two very different use cases.  We can only speculate how much power next-gen will use and how the power will be balanced, with and without an adapter.  The 3090 Ti did not use the additional 4pins, whereas next-gen, presumably, will.  How much of a difference will that make?  We don't really know yet.
 
But there's also an assumption by the author that the balance between the cables is an issue (or, in fact, the issue).  The card and power draw may be operating within spec, even if it doesn't look as pretty as a single cable.  For example, the EVGA PerFE12 cable is a single cable that plugs into two PCIe ports on the PSU.  In doing my own tests with a 3090 Ti (around launch), neither the 3x 8pin adapter or PerFe cable gets warm under load (and that's with a 750 G3, technically under-specc'd).
 
The whole centerpiece of this article is about PCI-SIG's concern that some implementations of the next-gen cables/assemblies allow for the cables to get too hot, which definitely is a safety issue.  The screencapped portion of the PCI-SIG email did not mention anything about current-gen power supplies, nor specifically adapters designed to allow ATX 2.XX power supplies to work with devices that use the 12VHPWR connectors.  Instead, the author threw a whole bunch of power supplies into this issue, which may be completely unrelated to this email.  This is likely more about OEM issues of the cables/connectors that are being produced for next-gen power supplies and/or next-gen cards.  Poorly-made adapters/cables will cause all kinds of issues, but this warning from PCI-SIG does not specify which kinds of cables are testing poorly based on what is shown.
 
More to the point, nothing connects the analysis by the author to the prime concern of connectors/wiring overheating.  There's a rather basic conclusion that if one connector has a higher power draw than others, then it's going to get warmer than the other cables.  Ok, but even if that's accurate, the author didn't measure how hot the cable was getting, nor whether the temperature on the cable was out of spec. 
 

talon951
I agree that the 150w spec is much lower than what the cables/connectors can handle, but if a 4090 should happen to pull 600w total and power balance is poor, you would be well above 150w which can be a problem with the right circumstances.

I've been running a 2x8pin 3090 on the KP 1kw bios for almost 2 years now without issue, but 18 gauge cables and low airflow will result in connectors/cables that are quite warm at 250w each. Not what you really want everyone doing. I never leave mine running unattended and inspect it occasionally too. Fortunately I have 16 gauge cables now (couldn't get a psu with them during the pandemic).

Anyway the only thing I'm interested in is what power balance those adapters actually have. If I get a 4090 and am still using my current PSU, I'll measure it myself and actually provide some useful data.

The problem is that term - "right circumstances".  Good quality power supplies, and nearly everything on the market 80PLUS Gold-rated these days are good power supplies, should have little trouble so long as it meets the VGA manufacturer's minimum power requirements.  Some exceptions?  Sure, but the floor on power supplies these days is significantly higher than it used to be.  This means that unless the adapters or direct cable designs are insufficient, you won't see problems.
 
The PCI-SIG letter seems to be about the 12VHPWR connector/cable, and not something on the 8pin side.  Just about all of our power supplies use 18AWG cables on the PCIe, and I can assure you that we don't see issues for that reason.  So long as the 12VHPWR cables/connectors are designed and manufactured properly (and there's no reason to believe that the majority are lacking), then this article really only whipped up a frenzy over nothing.
 
I think the best way to illustrate that you don't have to worry about 8pin cables/connectors is to show some of the measurements TiN (former EVGA engineer for K|NGP|N/Classified/DARK products) took on the 1080 Ti K|NGPIN under LN/2 load:  https://xdevs.com/guide/1080ti_kpe/#plim
 
Or, the TL:DR version - 112A / 1344W peak over two 8pin connectors - not including the rest of the system.

zippytek
Assume there will not be one of these for the kingpin ?

PowerLink 52U,.. the products page is borked or I would provide a link. 
 

 

EVGATech_LeeM
 
 
Here's the link to the product page:
https://www.evga.com/products/product.aspx?pn=600-PL-1658-LR

Will we ever get an in depth description on what it does since NO reviewer is going to tackle it this late in the game? The only thing it has done for me is cooled off my PCIe cables. The filtering thing is like ummm ok but I already have a good psu. Transient Spikes during boost clock yeah 4x should be better than 3x. Does it actually force the psu to supply power evenly over 4x pcie cables to the unit then to the card?

So nothing for those that own a 3090 Kingpin?

I have a PowerLink 41s & I picked up my 3090Ti FTW3 Ultra hybrid today
 
I'll test it this weekend

Can this power link41 be compatible with other cards( let's say like rog 3090ti or rog 4090) thanks

First post question.
 
Bought my 3090 Ti FTW3 Ultra directly from EVGA right before they dropped NVIDIA.  Came with the 3x8 to 12 Y and for some reason they also threw in a 2x8 to 12 Y (I don't know why).  So...what is the actual use conclusion using the 41s?  On the wait list, but is it worth it? 
 
Thanks. 

I just prefer avoiding pigtails.  Already covered "clean" power with the Corsair.  4x8 is nice though...so long as nothing gets cooked.  This GPU was the single most expensive piece of my build in progress.  pcpartpicker.com/list/zCn2Bj