thebc2
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 15:25:09
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So far I have tried the following and have not been able to get my power draw above 450w in Port Royal, Time Spy Extreme and 4K DLSS enabled Avengers.
1) installed new OC Bios, rebooted, confirmed new power limits in gpu-z and X1.
2) installed new “normal” Bios, rebooted, confirmed new power limits in gpu-z and X1.
3) Re-installed X1
Regardless of what I do my FTW3 Ultra performs identically to the way it did pre-XOC bios. My temps are in the mid-60s regardless of which bios I am running. If we can’t push the aforementioned 500w this card isn’t worth it for watercooling.
@jacob can you get over 450w in either timespy extreme or port royal?
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Milo66
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 15:28:35
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arcky
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 15:31:54
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I mean the fact that folks with MSI cards are able to flash theses EVGA bios and get 497w in TimeSpy ( https://www.overclock.net/threads/official-nvidia-rtx-3090-owners-club.1753930/post-28655352) while we with actual EVGA 3090 FTW3 Ultras can't get over 450w with the same bios, says without a doubt that something is either wrong with the bios implementation on the FTW3 cards, or with the FTW3 cards themselves. There's no other possible explanation. @Jacob it'd be nice to have some acknowledgment that there is a problem and the team is looking into it, rather than some one-off screenshots of Quake 2. Happy to be patient considering it's a beta and all, but up until this point the reaction has sounded more like denial of a problem and pointing to other limitations which I don't think is going to lead to an adequate solution. Thank you, as always, for everything, and of all the problems to have, this is certainly a problem I'm happy to have (so long as it's eventually fixed ;)
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Chamidorix
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 15:39:16
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thebc2
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 15:41:59
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arcky
I mean the fact that folks with MSI cards are able to flash theses EVGA bios and get 497w in TimeSpy () while we with actual EVGA 3090 FTW3 Ultras can't get over 450w with the same bios, says without a doubt that something is either wrong with the bios implementation on the FTW3 cards, or with the FTW3 cards themselves. There's no other possible explanation. @Jacob it'd be nice to have some acknowledgment that there is a problem and the team is looking into it, rather than some one-off screenshots of Quake 2. Happy to be patient considering it's a beta and all, but up until this point the reaction has sounded more like denial of a problem and pointing to other limitations which I don't think is going to lead to an adequate solution. Thank you, as always, for everything, and of all the problems to have, this is certainly a problem I'm happy to have (so long as it's eventually fixed ;)
100% this.
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EVGANewMember2719
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 15:45:17
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arcky
I mean the fact that folks with MSI cards are able to flash theses EVGA bios and get 497w in TimeSpy (https://www.overclock.net/threads/official-nvidia-rtx-3090-owners-club.1753930/post-28655352) while we with actual EVGA 3090 FTW3 Ultras can't get over 450w with the same bios, says without a doubt that something is either wrong with the bios implementation on the FTW3 cards, or with the FTW3 cards themselves. There's no other possible explanation. @Jacob it'd be nice to have some acknowledgment that there is a problem and the team is looking into it, rather than some one-off screenshots of Quake 2. Happy to be patient considering it's a beta and all, but up until this point the reaction has sounded more like denial of a problem and pointing to other limitations which I don't think is going to lead to an adequate solution. Thank you, as always, for everything, and of all the problems to have, this is certainly a problem I'm happy to have (so long as it's eventually fixed ;)
I can hit 500w with FTW ultra with this bios. Peaks at 500 usually around 490's.
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arcky
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 15:48:14
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EVGANewMember2719
arcky
I mean the fact that folks with MSI cards are able to flash theses EVGA bios and get 497w in TimeSpy (https://www.overclock.net/threads/official-nvidia-rtx-3090-owners-club.1753930/post-28655352) while we with actual EVGA 3090 FTW3 Ultras can't get over 450w with the same bios, says without a doubt that something is either wrong with the bios implementation on the FTW3 cards, or with the FTW3 cards themselves. There's no other possible explanation. @Jacob it'd be nice to have some acknowledgment that there is a problem and the team is looking into it, rather than some one-off screenshots of Quake 2. Happy to be patient considering it's a beta and all, but up until this point the reaction has sounded more like denial of a problem and pointing to other limitations which I don't think is going to lead to an adequate solution. Thank you, as always, for everything, and of all the problems to have, this is certainly a problem I'm happy to have (so long as it's eventually fixed ;)
I can hit 500w with FTW ultra with this bios.
What was your update process? Which bios on which switch? Which nvidia driver? which version of precision? can you link your precision settings? and can you link a gpuz showing the 500w hit with ideally a running graph of the power consumption so we can see how long you hit it during your benchmark?
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kring
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 16:00:12
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Some info to share: First, Port Royal and Timespy won't drive up the power draw... I can't get it to happen... I got 1 second peaks in 450, but it never actually drew the power consistently, spent most time between 420 & 440. I flashed the bios again just to be certain, then did full power down for 1 min, and reboot.. making sure it was a clean start. Doom Eternal, runs a constant 460+ draw and spend considerable time in the 470w range. Here's my 20 minute run in Doom Eternal, the average was 452 and that factored in some low draw to start and exit the game and grab a screenshot. the in-game play average was in the 460's. for this run too, I kept everything at default clocks, no OC'ing.  Update: did a second run with +100/+250 overclock... BTW on both it was set to 119%. this was ~10 min if running. 
post edited by kring - 2020/10/21 16:23:08
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Chamidorix
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 16:03:03
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Upon further research I think it might actually be the individual chip power limit that is being hit. Let me explain: The card has many power limits: total board draw (500W), 3 8 pins (150W each), pci-e (75W), and THEN a power limit for each of the 3 primary rails: Core 1, Core 2 (uncore/cache) and Memory. Very little work has been done to find out what these individual rail power limits are, but intrepid testing at overclock.net seems to show the main chip is around 300W. Additionally, we know there are limiters in place due to all the 5 milliohm shunts. The 3080FTW has 10 5MO shunts (7 big and 3 small), for example. There seem to be 2 shunts each for 8 pins, 1 shunt for pci-e, and then a small 5MO shunt for each of the 3 main power rails.
So, I'm assuming the majority of workloads are reaching this individual Core1 power limit, which is likely tuned for 450W board power consumption at 200-300W. Some workloads may push memory(vram) or cache(uncore) harder and therefore can make use of the additional board power headroom and push overall consumption above 450.
I'm assuming MSI Trio, Asus Strix, and GB aorus boards have higher Core1 rail power limits than the FTW3, which is why they make use of the 500W total board limit so much easier with TimeSpy Extreme, etc.
We have exactly one guy, frame chasers, who has shunted every single resistor on an EVGA card, and he has no problem pulling 600+W on a XC3 3080.
So basically, to narrow this down, we need to figure out exactly which 5MO shunt connects to the pci-e and which connects to the Core1 rail. Then individually shunt each one and see which allows us to pull more power. It is possible that they are all linked, like on the Founders edition with its fully digital voltage regulator, and so you have to shunt every single resistor.
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ehabash1
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 16:44:16
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 Helped me beat my old score but i need to do some power draw testing
post edited by ehabash1 - 2020/10/21 19:11:06
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LordGurciullo
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 16:45:14
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Unfortunately guys. This has done - literally nothing. My max power draw is still 426 on 3 port royal runs. In fact my scores have decreased by 1-2 percent. Really disappointing. Whats going on here? Any ideas? Feels like its a bug where it says it does something but actually does nothing...
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ehabash1
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 16:48:27
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https://www.3dmark.com/3dm/51968949? Not Entirely sure its working. I have some more stability at a slightly higher clock speed. I cant complain as its technically a record score for me but i was expecting a lil bit more
post edited by ehabash1 - 2020/10/21 19:10:18
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arcky
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 16:50:01
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What nvidia drivers are you on? What were your memory and voltage offsets in precision?
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kring
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 16:54:18
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LordGurciullo
Unfortunately guys. This has done - literally nothing. My max power draw is still 426 on 3 port royal runs. In fact my scores have decreased by 1-2 percent. Really disappointing. Whats going on here? Any ideas? Feels like its a bug where it says it does something but actually does nothing...
Don't use Port Royal or Timespy - Run a game to see if it's working.
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vexorian87
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 17:21:42
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ehabash1
very satisfied with the new bios. excellent 
my core is peaking at 2,220 MHz! check it out
https://www.3dmark.com/3dm/51968949?
I'm going to push it more and see if i can do 14,850-14,900. But im close to topping out as this is on air. Cant wait until my optimus water block comes!! THEN this thing will really shine
Damn, that’s a sick chip! Best I could get was 13965. Are you using the hot fix driver?
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LordGurciullo
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 17:47:11
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Getting worse performance for sure. Repeatable benchmarks were higher prior to this bios. Power draw never goes over 440 anywhere (including in game). This is really disappointing. I am using 119/91 100 voltage and a custom curve and 450 on the mem and getting worse results. Nvidia driver is 465.55.
We should try to figure out why some people like vexorian have this working and for others like myself it has literally done nothing if not actually lost 1-2 percent performance..
Any ideas? Do I need to reinstall something?
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arcky
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 17:51:13
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I rolled back to 456.71 as the 456.98 was listed as beta in gpuz and my 3dmarks weren’t getting verified as a result. Cant remember if this only happened after the bios update but now with .71 that beta issue is gone. I achieved a single spike of 480w in Firestrike ultra with a relatively low OC, one time, but since then I’ve never seen anything over 420/430w. It’s extremely strange. In general some of my best overclocks are not stable anymore and I’ve lost a couple percent with the new bios across the board. I’m at a loss
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cadbane
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 17:52:47
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LordGurciullo
Getting worse performance for sure. Repeatable benchmarks were higher prior to this bios. Power draw never goes over 440 anywhere (including in game). This is really disappointing. I am using 119/91 100 voltage and a custom curve and 450 on the mem and getting worse results. Nvidia driver is 465.55.
We should try to figure out why some people like vexorian have this working and for others like myself it has literally done nothing if not actually lost 1-2 percent performance..
Any ideas? Do I need to reinstall something?
You might very well be pushing your memory too far. Unlike previous generations GDDR6X is Error correcting and will only get slower if exceeding what it is capable of as its correcting errors.
Former FAH Tracker Developer    ISD Rampage 
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arcky
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 17:54:57
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I believe someone who mentioned this earlier was on to something. The GPU chip power draw. 99% of my tests with the new bios, this is locked to 260w (as in the ss bel0w). However, during ONE of my firestrike ultra tests, I hit 480w, and lo and behold it was because the GPU chip power draw went to 299. So my average 445w went up to 485w just because of this, but I've yet to see if occur again 
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arestavo
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 17:55:41
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LordGurciullo
Getting worse performance for sure. Repeatable benchmarks were higher prior to this bios. Power draw never goes over 440 anywhere (including in game). This is really disappointing. I am using 119/91 100 voltage and a custom curve and 450 on the mem and getting worse results. Nvidia driver is 465.55.
We should try to figure out why some people like vexorian have this working and for others like myself it has literally done nothing if not actually lost 1-2 percent performance..
Any ideas? Do I need to reinstall something?
Try lowering your voltage slider to 0. Every time I pushed mine to 100 I got worse scores.
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LordGurciullo
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 18:06:35
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I've done hours and hours of testing prior to this bios change. Repeatable results.. These are definitely the results that Arcky is experiencing. At no time ever do I go over 430.. ever. and definite loss of 2 percent. Something is screwy here. Maybe Jacob can shed some light. It feels like the slider isn't actually doing anything and for me to get the same amount of power as what 107 used to be I have to put it to 119. Which essentially means it isn't actually changing the power. I feel like im on to something here. Must be a bug..
post edited by LordGurciullo - 2020/10/21 18:16:19
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aldur80
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 18:29:34
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LordGurciullo
I've done hours and hours of testing prior to this bios change. Repeatable results..
These are definitely the results that Arcky is experiencing. At no time ever do I go over 430.. ever. and definite loss of 2 percent.
Something is screwy here. Maybe Jacob can shed some light.
It feels like the slider isn't actually doing anything and for me to get the same amount of power as what 107 used to be I have to put it to 119. Which essentially means it isn't actually changing the power. I feel like im on to something here. Must be a bug..
Good point, maybe this is just a px1 bug where the power slider isn't working correctly. That would make sense as some ppl can get the higher power limit whereas others can't.
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arcky
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 18:56:54
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afterburner was showing the exact same new PL and offsets inputted into X1 when I was checking that earlier, so I doubt it's just a PX1 thing
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sirien
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 19:09:08
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arcky
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 19:16:40
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uhhhh...lol. so frame chasers says the only way to allow more power to the board is to shunt mod the pci slot resistor, as that's capping the full-board power draw as soon as it hits its 75-80w limit. so these 'xoc bios' are only viable with shunt modded boards?
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ehabash1
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 19:22:12
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So far it appears to be the case yes. Maybe evga can investigate the issue? I dont really want to shunt
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arcky
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 19:29:42
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And just for added salt in the wound, frame chasers is using a non-ultra FTW3, with flashed stock ultra bios which then allows the xoc installer to think it’s an ultra and unlock the 500w. Which is what the MSI users were doing as well. So EVGA just released a bios that helps users of their competitor’s cards, and helps users who didn’t pay for their top end SKU, and doesn’t work for users who paid top $ for the SKU the bios was designed for. Sick.
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komicaaa
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 19:30:39
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Maybe the there was a bug with px1 1.1.0.11 's slider test portal royal/TSE/FSU/RDR2 i can reach 467w with previous bios With the new xoc bios(119%), i only get 478w,and the power consumption is never above 107%(peak is 109%) About the power limit ,there are no difference between the 2 bios(D0/F8) but there are also some benefit, i can OC than 100mhz now and stable in 2.1G with boost lock function
post edited by komicaaa - 2020/10/21 20:27:45
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ehabash1
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 19:43:21
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arcky
And just for added salt in the wound, frame chasers is using a non-ultra FTW3, with flashed stock ultra bios which then allows the xoc installer to think it’s an ultra and unlock the 500w. Which is what the MSI users were doing as well. So EVGA just released a bios that helps users of their competitor’s cards, and helps users who didn’t pay for their top end SKU, and doesn’t work for users who paid top $ for the SKU the bios was designed for. Sick.
Lol i did the same thing I have the ftw3 gaming non ultra. Flashed the ultra bios then was able to install fake 500w bios. Is there any point to the ultra?
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originxt
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Re: EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 XOC BIOS BETA
2020/10/21 19:45:29
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It's just guaranteed out of the box boosts. Supposedly only difference is boost out of box is higher than normal. They say no binning of chips.
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