Treesong
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Hello, just got my new gtx 1080ti ftw yesterday and all looked fine at first. I could play Guild Wars 2 on high settings, no problems, temps normal. Then today, my comp all of a sudden starts shutting down as soon as I am a few minutes in the game. Just shuts down, and I have to completely turn off my PSU before I can start it up again. (draining power?). I then installed Precision X (which I had not done before), because at first I figured GPU temps might be too high, since I noticed that the fans were barely spinning and the card felt hot. After reading up a bit more on how this card works and fiddling with the fan speeds myself I now know that the temps and fans are just fine. However still shutting down every single time after a few minutes into GW2, even with temps of like 39 celcius. So I started to look at voltages and indeed noticed big spikes on the Precision X monitor: as soon as it spiked to 1025 Watt it immediately shut down. So I am thinking this is a PSU/voltage problem. Mind you, yesterday all ran fine. Only thing different with today is that I upgraded the drivers to the newest nvidia drivers. My Psu is an Enermax Galaxy 850 watt, so not a cheapo PSU. I have plugged in two cables: one cable coming from the big bundle coming out of the PSU(labeled PCiE), that has two 6pin connectors, going into a extentsion cable that makes it into one 8pin connector(sorry, do not really understand the names for these). Then another 2x 6-pin cables that are both plugged into the two slots in the psu that sais PCiE, again combining into an 8pin plug through an extension. What could be wrong here? I keep reading about single and double rails, not sure what that means though. I still do not understand why I could play for hours yesterday, but not anymore. Thanks for any help. :)
post edited by Treesong - 2017/10/26 07:59:22
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Censore
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Re: 1080ti ftw computer shutting down, powerspikes?
2017/10/26 08:02:19
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☄ Helpfulby Treesong 2017/10/26 09:15:25
Yes, is the PSU. Change PSU with one with more Watts (or change it with another 850W PSU ) and your PC doesn't shut-down any more for a long time.
post edited by Censore - 2017/10/26 08:05:39
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ty_ger07
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Re: 1080ti ftw computer shutting down, powerspikes?
2017/10/26 08:29:30
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☄ Helpfulby Treesong 2017/10/26 09:15:13
Yup, it sounds like a prime example of a power supply issue. It appears that the PSU you referred to could be up to 10 years old. As PSUs age, their maximum output wattage decreases. Yours may have reached the point that it no longer is able to deliver the required output power. When under relatively constant relatively high load conditions, you should only expect that PSU to deliver high output power for the duration of its warranty period (3 years). A power supply may be able to deliver 50% of its rated output power for 8 to 10 years (or more), but you should not expect it to be able to deliver its full rated power for that length of time.
post edited by ty_ger07 - 2017/10/26 08:33:33
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Treesong
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Re: 1080ti ftw computer shutting down, powerspikes?
2017/10/26 08:45:22
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But, but... I could play for hours yesterday! Or did that finally push this PSU over the edge? I am also curious how a PSU can degrade over time: isn't a PSU(or most electronics) failing an all or nothing thing? So one day it works, and then the next day you hear something fizzle and spark and you see smoke and then its gone. :)
I will try to revert to the old drivers and see if that helps. Probably not, but better try a few things before I fork out more money for a new PSU.
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Cool GTX
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Re: 1080ti ftw computer shutting down, powerspikes?
2017/10/26 08:45:35
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☄ Helpfulby Treesong 2017/10/26 09:10:06
ENERMAX Galaxy EGX850EWL 850W ? "World’s FIRST FIVE 12V rails 2007 EPS12V specification for next-generation systems." Output: +3.3V@30A,+5V@30A,+12V1@24A,+12V2@24A,+12V3@24A,+12V4@24A,+12V5@24A,-12V@0.6A,+5VSB@6A (Rail1 = +12V1 ---> Rail 5 = +12V5) Review ENERMAX Galaxy EGX850EWL 850W If your PSU is Not a "Single Rail" then you the end user Must "balance the load" Each +12V rail has a limit less than the 850 W in your case. In example PSU above: 24 Amp limit per +12V Rail = 288 Watts per +12V Rail The power draw of all items connected should be split between the rails to make sure no one rail is overloaded. Most (all?) Newer high quality PSU have gone single rail to make it easier, just connect your items and run. Based on the tech details in that review I linked above, time to go Shopping  https://www.evga.com/power-meter/
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ty_ger07
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Re: 1080ti ftw computer shutting down, powerspikes?
2017/10/26 09:01:50
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☄ Helpfulby Treesong 2017/10/26 09:12:34
Good point Cool GTX! If the PSU has multiple 12v rails (as it appears it may ... but I am not sure since he didn't provide a model number), ensuring that the video card is on a different PSU 12v rail than the CPU is and ensuring that both 8-pin connectors of the video card are on different rails of the PSU (if possible), can make a big difference. http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php?name=NDReviews&op=Story&reid=59 Why do PSUs age? Why does there output power decrease? Why don't they just fail? The most common reason and the most simple answer is that capacitors age due to heat and use and there capacitance decreases as they age. The modern PSUs use switch-mode power design which is essentially a BUC converter operating at high frequency PWM which increases efficiency and decreases the size of the inductors/transformers needed. As capacitor capacitance decreases, output current capability decreases because the LC balance of the inductors versus capacitors is pushed out of their designed tolerances. The inductors saturate more quickly and the output current capability decreases until the point that the PSU can't maintain voltage output within a specific design windows. Then, the PSU just shuts off because it can't maintain stable voltage and doesn't want to ruin the rest of your computer. It will still work fine at lower output power, but a PSU's output power capability is ALWAYS decreasing slowly from the moment you first turn it on.
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Treesong
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Re: 1080ti ftw computer shutting down, powerspikes?
2017/10/26 09:14:39
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Awesome, guys, thanks. Learned something too! I can go forward now, and most likely all the way to the shop. :)
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Sajin
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Re: 1080ti ftw computer shutting down, powerspikes?
2017/10/26 10:38:46
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Precision x doesn't record watts. 1025 was most likely the voltage on the card. Your issue could be a faulty graphics card as well. Hope and pray the new psu fixes the problem.
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Treesong
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Re: 1080ti ftw computer shutting down, powerspikes?
2017/10/26 12:24:55
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I found the documentation from my Enermax EGA850EWL PSU, here are the two most important sheets in one picture:  I tried to rotate the picture in the post but it kept being upside down no matter what I did with it before I linked it. Looks like the 5 rails can give a total of 68A or 816 Watt. Rails 3,4 and 5 are the ones that supply the Harddisks and the Videocard, rails 1 and 2 are for the Motherboard and CPU. 34 A for rail 1 and 2, and 34 A for rails 3,4 and 5. That looks to be about 136 Watt per rail. That looks to be a little meagre. So is the vidcard asking too much from this pool? And Sajin, on the monitor it indeed sais "Voltage" above that number. When idling it sais 600, but as soon as I start up Guild Wars 2, it starts to jump all over the place, ending up in the high numbers: last time it stood on 1069 for a while before the computer shut down again. Aren't those numbers too high to be a true voltage? Now you have me worrying again that my card is faulty. :(
post edited by Treesong - 2017/10/26 12:29:28
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Sajin
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Re: 1080ti ftw computer shutting down, powerspikes?
2017/10/26 12:28:33
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Nope, those are in the normal range.
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Cool GTX
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Re: 1080ti ftw computer shutting down, powerspikes?
2017/10/26 13:11:26
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☄ Helpfulby Treesong 2017/10/27 01:04:20
Your PSU is 17 Amps per ---> on V3, V4 & V5 ---> with a combined Max of 34 Amps 17 Amps X 12V = 204 Watts 34 Amps X 12V = 408 Watts  (1).jpg)
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bob16314
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Re: 1080ti ftw computer shutting down, powerspikes?
2017/10/26 17:01:23
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☄ Helpfulby Treesong 2017/10/27 01:04:24
A PSU protection mechanism is being tripped and 'latching off' the unit..If the power supply latches into a shutdown state because of a fault condition on it's outputs, the power supply shall return to normal operation ONLY after the fault has been removed and the unit has been cycled OFF/ON with a minimum OFF time of one second..This explains why you need to cycle the unit OFF/ON to get it working again. The protections than can 'latch off' the unit are. 1. Over voltage protection 2. Over current protection 3. Short circuit protection 4. Over Temperature protection (optional) Intel Power Supply Design Guides (under external links) The over current protection tripping one of the rails is probably the issue either caused by a PSU (more likely) or a bad video card (less likely)..You should get a unit with a single +12V rail..A single +12V = More horsepower and less headaches. Use the OuterVision PSU Calculator or the EVGA Power Meter to estimate your system wattage need..If you use the EVGA Power Meter, you'll recieve a 10% off discount code in your email, good only in the EVGA US Shopping Cart.
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Treesong
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Re: 1080ti ftw computer shutting down, powerspikes?
2017/10/27 01:21:54
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Thanks guys. I am going to assume it is the PSU and not the graphics card so I am going to buy a new one. When I do the powermeter, I end up with a selection with prices varying from 50 bucks to 179 bucks. Maximum watt is 750: I guess this is due to the fact that I only use 1 vidcard, do not overclock and maybe have an older chipset and cpu? My chipset is x79(Gigabyte x79_UD3), my cpu is Intel core i7 3930K. I am not doing crazy stuff with my comp, I do not overclock. However, I do want to buy for the future, in case I ever upgrade my mobo and cpu. I never see myself doing anything with more then one vidcard though(did SLI once, too much hassle), nor overclocking. The powermeter gives me a list of PSUs that are no more then 62 A on the 12v rail. Should I just go higher, just to be sure? Willing to spend up to 300 dollars. If I do not care about energy rating, should I go Gold? Looks like you get more power for your bucks then. EVGA Supernova 1300 G2 looks like a good deal. (tried to link it, seems to go fine but does not show up in final post.). Thanks again, guys, this is very helpful. :)
post edited by Treesong - 2017/10/27 01:26:22
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bob16314
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Re: 1080ti ftw computer shutting down, powerspikes?
2017/10/27 03:17:47
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A 750W unit will be good..There's the fully modular Gold rated single +12V rail 750 G2 with a 10 year warranty and ECO Mode..ECO Mode turns off the fan during low load conditions for quiet operation..Everything is going energy efficient anyway, so future hardware may not need as much power..A 1300W G2 would be insanely overkill, completely and totally unnecessary.
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PietroBR
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Re: 1080ti ftw computer shutting down, powerspikes?
2017/10/27 03:38:35
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Treesong
Thanks guys. I am going to assume it is the PSU and not the graphics card so I am going to buy a new one. When I do the powermeter, I end up with a selection with prices varying from 50 bucks to 179 bucks. Maximum watt is 750: I guess this is due to the fact that I only use 1 vidcard, do not overclock and maybe have an older chipset and cpu?
My chipset is x79(Gigabyte x79_UD3), my cpu is Intel core i7 3930K. I am not doing crazy stuff with my comp, I do not overclock.
However, I do want to buy for the future, in case I ever upgrade my mobo and cpu. I never see myself doing anything with more then one vidcard though(did SLI once, too much hassle), nor overclocking. The powermeter gives me a list of PSUs that are no more then 62 A on the 12v rail. Should I just go higher, just to be sure? Willing to spend up to 300 dollars. If I do not care about energy rating, should I go Gold? Looks like you get more power for your bucks then. EVGA Supernova 1300 G2 looks like a good deal. (tried to link it, seems to go fine but does not show up in final post.). Thanks again, guys, this is very helpful. :)
For a 1080Ti, a 750w GOLD Rated PSU should be fine (I would go with nothing less then Gold rated PSU, or, take jonnyguru guides to chose one new PSU http://www.jonnyguru.com/). About the link, the forums only allow you to post links after you have 10 posts around here. 
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Treesong
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Re: 1080ti ftw computer shutting down, powerspikes?
2017/10/27 07:43:18
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Thanks guys. Last questions, honestly. The fact that I can run all tests on Passmark without problems (score 10850 for 3Dvideo) probably indicates that my card itself is fine, right? Ran it twice, no problems, temp stays below 70 on default fan routine, and below 59 on aggresive. The voltage as shown in Precision X hovered constantly around 1062. Does this mean the PSU can handle feeding the GPU just fine as long as it does not have to handle heavy load on the CPU too? CPU load never came above 23%, mostly between 10 and 15. I tried putting the Powertarget slider in Precision X all the way down to 44% , assuming this will throttle the amount of power the card asks from the PSU (could be wrong there). Then I started playing Guild Wars 2 again. This time I noticed the voltages hovering more around the 850 mark, so a lot lower overall. GW2 is known to be relying heavily on the CPU too so this hovered around 32%. I could play for a little longer now, but then it shut off again when I was in the middle of a fight with a LOT of NPC's and flashy stuff around me. I forgot to keep check on my CPU load, but I am guessing it spiked. Can I conclude that when GW2 (or any other game) starts asking more CPU power, the PSU can't deliver anymore, even with the GPU throttled? (if that is what I did with that slider). Sorry if I keep asking more questions, but this is pretty interesting and quit new to me. (I think I will buy the either the 750 or 850 G2 PSU as mentioned above. ) EDIT: I just played GW2 for a while with all settings on max, in a busy area, while running Passmark CPU benchmark at the same time, with CPU spiking to 100% constantly. I had put the powerslider in Precision X back to 100% too. Ran the benchmark twice while in GW2 for several minutes. Then I zone into another zone, walk 5 feet and bam, shut down(not running bench anymore). Very flaky results. I dont like that with hardware. Anyway, buying new PSU, fingers crossed. :)
post edited by Treesong - 2017/10/27 08:34:50
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Sajin
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Re: 1080ti ftw computer shutting down, powerspikes?
2017/10/27 09:02:04
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Hmm. Guess you'll just have to see if the new psu fixes the issue or not.
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Treesong
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Re: 1080ti ftw computer shutting down, powerspikes?
2017/10/31 09:53:52
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Just wanted to let you guys know that I received my new EVGA 850 G2 PSU and so far so good. Only played for like 15 minutes on ultra settings in GW2, but no crashes. Nice bonus: this PSU is a lot quieter then my old Enermax.
btw, after I had removed the Enermax it was chockfull of dust also on the inside, every coil was covered in a thick layer of dust. I removed the casing and completely cleaned it, looks brandnew now. Not sure what to do with it, it always worked fine with my Asus Radeon HD 7970 Direct CII, maybe I will put them together in one of my old cases and mine some cheap Altcoin with it. :) I hate throwing away stuff that still works somehow.
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AHowes
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Re: 1080ti ftw computer shutting down, powerspikes?
2017/10/31 09:55:26
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Always good to keep a spare psu around.
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Sajin
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Re: 1080ti ftw computer shutting down, powerspikes?
2017/10/31 10:06:24
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Treesong
Just wanted to let you guys know that I received my new EVGA 850 G2 PSU and so far so good. Only played for like 15 minutes on ultra settings in GW2, but no crashes. Nice bonus: this PSU is a lot quieter then my old Enermax.
btw, after I had removed the Enermax it was chockfull of dust also on the inside, every coil was covered in a thick layer of dust. I removed the casing and completely cleaned it, looks brandnew now. Not sure what to do with it, it always worked fine with my Asus Radeon HD 7970 Direct CII, maybe I will put them together in one of my old cases and mine some cheap Altcoin with it. :) I hate throwing away stuff that still works somehow.
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PietroBR
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Re: 1080ti ftw computer shutting down, powerspikes?
2017/10/31 16:55:55
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Treesong
Just wanted to let you guys know that I received my new EVGA 850 G2 PSU and so far so good. Only played for like 15 minutes on ultra settings in GW2, but no crashes. Nice bonus: this PSU is a lot quieter then my old Enermax.
btw, after I had removed the Enermax it was chockfull of dust also on the inside, every coil was covered in a thick layer of dust. I removed the casing and completely cleaned it, looks brandnew now. Not sure what to do with it, it always worked fine with my Asus Radeon HD 7970 Direct CII, maybe I will put them together in one of my old cases and mine some cheap Altcoin with it. :) I hate throwing away stuff that still works somehow.
Nice to hear it. Keep us posted if anything else happens.
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muthj1
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Re: 1080ti ftw computer shutting down, powerspikes?
2017/11/01 19:26:51
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I had a PSU cook itself once. Fried the whole PC. Fortunately, I wanted a new one anyways.
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