boballee
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2012/05/02 11:36:46
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Ok. Not to belabor the point too much – but I’ve had this nagging feeling around the fans and static pressure. I’m having a very hard time trying to figure out what a “good static pressure” is for my set up. I understand the ‘higher the better,’ but since I’m just cooling (for now) my CPU I don’t know that I really need to go too far over the top (yet). Once I get my GPU’s added in to the set up, higher will definitely be needed since the Black Ice rad I have is a bit more dense. So, after doing some digging, I was able to finally (I think) come up with the product sheets for the Scythe fans. Comparison below: Cooler Master High Performance SickleFlow Scythe Gentle Typhoon AP-15 Scythe Gentle Typhoon AP-29 *Note: The prices are from Performance-PCs
In comparing the Cooler Master fans I have with the Scythe AP-15’s, it would appear that the static pressure is better on the Cooler Master fans – not to mention they run a bit quieter as well and less than half the cost. They will be hooked up to a Lamptron 4-channel (30 W/channel) fan controller. Obviously being very new to the world of water cooling – I would appreciate any feedback as to any flaws in my thinking.
post edited by boballee - 2012/05/02 11:43:17
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TECH_DaveB
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2012/05/02 11:44:25
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Hmm, I did some quick checks, and found sub 1mmH2O for the CM fan which is why I recommended against it, however, if this info is accurate they should be fine, personally I would recommend the AP29, but im nitpicky about my cooling :)
If that is accurate you should be fine.
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feniks
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2012/05/02 11:58:35
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there is only one drawback of CM fans, they use Sleeve bearings ... those things don't last too long ... and they die out silently (just like Scythe Slipstream fans do) ... while AP-15's have double ball bearings, very durable!
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TECH_DaveB
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2012/05/02 11:59:58
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When possible, FDB's are great, same longevity but quieter
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boballee
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2012/05/02 12:02:43
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EVGATech_DaveB
Hmm, I did some quick checks, and found sub 1mmH2O for the CM fan which is why I recommended against it, however, if this info is accurate they should be fine, personally I would recommend the AP29, but im nitpicky about my cooling :)
If that is accurate you should be fine.
Good deal - feeling a little less stressed about this now.  I'm going for the red and black look to match the Z68 FTW board (which was one of the reasons I went with the CM fans). Plus, I already have them sitting in the office.  I will upgrade the fans to something like the AP-29's when I get more components on the loop.
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boballee
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2012/05/02 12:06:03
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feniks
there is only one drawback of CM fans, they use Sleeve bearings ... those things don't last too long ... and they die out silently (just like Scythe Slipstream fans do) ... while AP-15's have double ball bearings, very durable!
Good point. Hopefully I'll be able to 'finish' the water cooling in the next year and upgrade to the Scythe fans.
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feniks
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2012/05/02 12:11:01
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boballee
feniks
there is only one drawback of CM fans, they use Sleeve bearings ... those things don't last too long ... and they die out silently (just like Scythe Slipstream fans do) ... while AP-15's have double ball bearings, very durable!
Good point. Hopefully I'll be able to 'finish' the water cooling in the next year and upgrade to the Scythe fans.
if there is not much dust in your computer room then it should last a year maybe. I had terrible experience with Scyethe Slipstream (1900rpm @ 110CFM) case fans I used, lasted 6 months tops, the worst one failed in as little as 3 months ... they just silently stall one day. however my system has been running 24/7 for a few years  , I don't usually turn it off unless I leave home for a week or two ... I was buying Scythe S-Flex 1900rpm (S-FDB) only since then...
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hatchetrunner
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2012/05/02 15:02:29
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boballee
EVGATech_DaveB
Hmm, I did some quick checks, and found sub 1mmH2O for the CM fan which is why I recommended against it, however, if this info is accurate they should be fine, personally I would recommend the AP29, but im nitpicky about my cooling :)
If that is accurate you should be fine.
Good deal - feeling a little less stressed about this now. I'm going for the red and black look to match the Z68 FTW board (which was one of the reasons I went with the CM fans). Plus, I already have them sitting in the office. I will upgrade the fans to something like the AP-29's when I get more components on the loop.
For the fans it will depend on the rad. rx 360 you can use gentle typhoons 1850rpm fans or the xspc 1650rpm fans Cooler Master tends to overrate their fans
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boballee
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2012/05/02 19:14:02
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Hatchetrunner - thanks. I'll keep that in mind. Now, this may be a dumb question (remember I'm still a noob), when going to a push/pull set up, do the fans on both side of the rad have to be the same?
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hatchetrunner
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2012/05/02 20:41:39
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boballee
Hatchetrunner - thanks. I'll keep that in mind. Now, this may be a dumb question (remember I'm still a noob), when going to a push/pull set up, do the fans on both side of the rad have to be the same?
basically have the fans facing the same way on both sides of the rad here is an example Video I made
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ki11joy92
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2012/05/02 22:07:35
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Why isn't this a sticky yet? :D
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feniks
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2012/05/02 22:08:46
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^I am asking myself the same question ... tons of useful info here!
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hatchetrunner
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2012/05/02 22:37:04
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ki11joy92
Why isn't this a sticky yet? :D
I am not sure. I am just glad I am able to help people out:)
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boballee
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2012/05/03 06:29:08
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hatchetrunner
boballee
Hatchetrunner - thanks. I'll keep that in mind. Now, this may be a dumb question (remember I'm still a noob), when going to a push/pull set up, do the fans on both side of the rad have to be the same?
basically have the fans facing the same way on both sides of the rad here is an example
Video I made
Thanks. I guess to clarify, do the fans have to be identical (like Gentle Typhoon AP-15') in both the push and pull sides? Or, can you have a fan with higher speed and/or static pressure on one side versus the other. I'm going to stay with the CM fans (for now) since I'm just cooling the CPU. However, when I finally get around to the GPU's as well, I'm going to want/need something a bit more stout - including a push/pull set up. When I do upgrade, will/should I get 6 identical fans - or just 3 for the other side of the rad (even if they are different from the initial ones)? Note: being somewhat anal, I'll probably get 6 identical for symmetry - but more curious about the question. I'd imagine that, assuming they are close to having the same specs it shouldn't matter too much. Too far on either end of the spectrum (i.e. - a 900 RPM fan and a Delta on the other side) may pose a bit of a problem. Anyway - I appreciate all of the help, insight, tips and suggestions. Great stuff and I can't wait to get started!
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TECH_DaveB
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2012/05/03 08:28:08
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You can run dissimular fans, however depending on HOW dissimular they are, it could negatively impact cooling, not by alot, and also REALLY increase the noise coming from them.
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boballee
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2012/05/03 11:24:35
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EVGATech_DaveB
You can run dissimular fans, however depending on HOW dissimular they are, it could negatively impact cooling, not by alot, and also REALLY increase the noise coming from them.
Thanks. Pretty much what I figured. when I do move to a push/pull set up, I'll probably just get 6 of the same and call it a day.
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seedless strawberry
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2012/05/09 21:27:52
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Just wondering if i would be able to do a gpu and cpu off a 240 rad....? I currently have a H100 with a push pull, and it bareeeeeeeeely fits in the case, it's because i have a p67 ftw mobo and the heatsinks on the chipset are huge. So it means i would have to use a thinner radiator, similar thickness to a h100 rad. If i could do the chipset, cpu, gpu then i'm pretty sure a thicker radiator would fit, but i'm not even sure if they make blocks to fit the p67 ftw chipset? The only way i would be able to do this is if a thinner 240 rad would work for a gpu, cpu, or if i could find a block for the chipset and then throw in a thicker 240 that would fit.
Thoughts....?
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feniks
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2012/05/09 22:29:43
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try EX240 rad, but you will need fast fans for it, since the rad is high density. general rule of a thumb is running 1 block per every 120mm of rad area, so cpu & gpu should be just fine with it. I'd recommend this water cooling setup for starters @ $229: http://www.performance-pc...&products_id=33662 and 4 fans running in a push pull setup (if possible) or at least 2 fans for pull setup. the kit comes with 2 fans and all components you need to make it work. you may need to add a t-line and a drain port or plug to it if you like. FYI, RX240 rad (low density) is much better but it's 1.5x thicker than EX240. if money is an issue, you could try the budget version of this it, but the radiator is weak (RS240, similar thickness as EX240), and pump is a bare minimum (adding more blocks in future will call for the pump upgrade), also the cpu block is weaker (still decent though) than newer Raystorm, like this @ $129: http://www.frozencpu.com/...ling_Kit_Hot_Item.html for running 4 blocks (CPU, chipset, mosfets and GPU) you may need strong 360 rad though.
post edited by feniks - 2012/05/09 22:33:41
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seedless strawberry
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2012/05/09 22:39:39
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feniks
try EX240 rad, but you will need fast fans for it, since the rad is high density. general rule of a thumb is running 1 block per every 120mm of rad area, so cpu & gpu should be just fine with it.
I'd recommend this water cooling setup for starters @ $229:
http://www.performance-pc...&products_id=33662
and 4 fans running in a push pull setup (if possible) or at least 2 fans for pull setup. the kit comes with 2 fans and all components you need to make it work. you may need to add a t-line and a drain port or plug to it if you like.
FYI, RX240 rad (low density) is much better but it's 1.5x thicker than EX240.
if money is an issue, you could try the budget version of this it, but the radiator is weak (RS240, similar thickness as EX240), and pump is a bare minimum (adding more blocks in future will call for the pump upgrade), also the cpu block is weaker (still decent though) than newer Raystorm, like this @ $129:
http://www.frozencpu.com/...ling_Kit_Hot_Item.html
for running 4 blocks (CPU, chipset, mosfets and GPU) you may need strong 360 rad though.
Thanks! I'll look into it! I was going to plan on using the corsair fans that came with the h100, i think they're pretty good?, and i have two gelid solutions fans right now, i think they have ~76CFM, is that pretty good flow? Appreciate the help!
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feniks
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2012/05/09 23:10:36
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CFM is meaningless as I learned recently and all depends on the construction of fan (e.g. shape of fan blades), bearing used (ball bearings or FDB are for longevity, sleeved ones die soon and go weak fast) and generally you are looking at static pressure parameter when considering fans for rads. most loved fans are Scythe Gentle Typhoon AP-15 @ 1850rpm as they live long, operate quiet and provide strong static pressure (while CFM is only @ 56), but they are expensive, anywhere from $15-20 a piece. hard to get, especially at decent price. EDIT2013: there are also Scythe Gentle Typhoon AP-45 models that are one step above golden AP-15's, AP-45 are 2,150rpm @ 68CFM, same looks and shape and connector as AP-15. sold nowdays by Frozencpu @ $14.99+s/h a piece. other options are Scythe S-Flex with awesome SONY FDB, either 1600rpm or 1900rpm versions, but they seem to be phased out now or hard to get anyways. or at least Yate Loon models. don't even bother with Scythe Slipstream, they die like flies. more fan info here: http://forums.evga.com/tm.aspx?m=592209
post edited by feniks - 2013/02/21 17:47:59
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hatchetrunner
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2013/02/21 17:41:20
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Posted new info CPU block comparison
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feniks
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2013/02/21 17:51:44
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thanks for the CPU block comparison Hatchetrunner, was looking for it recently and couldn't find it. wanted to compare my stock Raystorm vs Full Copper Raystorm vs Koolance CPU-380, but couldn't find graph including all 3 in one test, now I see hehe.
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chump7431
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2013/02/23 12:33:44
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Johnny_Utah
Just figured I would add something here. This is something that no water cooler should be without:
Plugs right into the wall and has a molex end to plug into your pump. Best 15 bucks spent in years:)
http://www.amazon.com/Coo...-Adapter/dp/B000MGG6SC
What is this used for? Leak testing? Instead of hard wiring your psu you plug this into your pump instead?
post edited by chump7431 - 2013/02/23 12:43:01
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TECH_DaveB
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2013/02/24 07:43:33
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Yes, when you are leak testing and bleeding the loop you want to run only the pump, so in most circumstances, you end up jumpering the pump via the 24 pin plug from the PSU, this way, you plug it into the wall and bypass messing with a power jack on the PSU.
Necessary? Definitely not. Makes life a LOT easier in the beginning oh definitely! Worth the 15$, IMHO, yes, sometimes convenience is worth it.
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bcavnaugh
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2013/02/24 09:42:08
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chump7431
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2013/02/24 14:37:11
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EVGATech_DaveB
Yes, when you are leak testing and bleeding the loop you want to run only the pump, so in most circumstances, you end up jumpering the pump via the 24 pin plug from the PSU, this way, you plug it into the wall and bypass messing with a power jack on the PSU.
Necessary? Definitely not. Makes life a LOT easier in the beginning oh definitely! Worth the 15$, IMHO, yes, sometimes convenience is worth it.
Ordered! Thanks!
Build log +1EVGA X79 DARK, 2 EVGA 780 Classified's, I7 4930K, Custom EK H2O, 16G 2133 GSkill Ram, Corsair AX1200, 900DubsD, Logitech G700-19-35
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RABBLE
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2013/02/24 15:10:16
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is there a benefit to running your loop in that order or is it just personal preference. i run res/pump -> cpu -> rad then back.
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loveha
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2013/02/24 16:01:12
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RABBLE
is there a benefit to running your loop in that order or is it just personal preference. i run res/pump -> cpu -> rad then back.
Loop order is irrelevant. Water temperature will reach an equilibrium and it will only vary 2-3 degrees anywhere in the loop.
Case - Phanteks Enthoo Evolv XMobo - EVGA X570 FTWCPU - AMD Ryzen 9 5900XRAM - 32GB Trident Z Royal 3600MHz 14-14-14-34GPU - EVGA RTX 3080 Ti FTW3 Ultra GamingPSU - Seasonic Prime TX-1000Heatkiller IV CPU Waterblock / Heatkiller V GPU WaterblockHeatkiller V EBC Active Backplate / Two Heatkiller Rad 360 L Six Noctua NF-A12x25 / Heatkiller D5 Pump
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hatchetrunner
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2015/02/12 14:43:46
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Reinstated missing images.
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Trides
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Re:Water cooling guide for noobs
2015/02/17 02:44:15
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Wow! Thank you, great post! I'm thinking of water cooling my 780 classified, but I worry I might do something wrong, considering the size of my case! (coolermaster silencio 352 matx). It does support watercooling as it says, but I'll keep researching before actually doing anything.
By the way, do you hear high pitches pump noises in watercooling? Are they more annoying than normal fan sound? Or do they disappear after bubbles settle in. Also, Do the fans cooling rads work on fixed speed? Wouldnt they be loud?
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