whizzard9992
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Sunday, February 13, 2011 7:35 AM
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The short version is that sometimes my computer freezes: not BSOD, but completely unresponsive. I pulled every part from my computer, and the freezing only stops when I uninstall the GTX 480 and install my old GTS 8800. I can run memtest successfully overnight with the GTS 8800, but with the GTX 480 it freezes. I never get errors, though, and oddly enough, the red cursors still blink in Memtest, but it just stops running. I can press ESC and restart the computer... Sometimes (Often, actually) the computer will even freeze in the BIOS (Not POST, BIOS). This has happened to me before, but has gone away on its own. I first though thermal, so I cranked my fan to 100% whenever I played a game. Ran memtest to test RAM, and bought a new Power supply thinking it could be PSU. Each time, the problem seems to be resolved for about a month. Maybe it was a combination of things, or maybe my 480 is just flaky and fixes itself (Just coincidental that I'm changing things around trying to diagnose). I've tried: - Increasing VTT to 1.9v
- Using a different PSU
- Using different PCIe plugs on the PSU
- Disabling NVIDIA Audio drivers in windows device manager
- Removing EVERYTHING except a single stick of RAM, in all channels, and switching sticks.
- Updating BIOS
- Clearing BIOS
- Swapping out the video card with a GTS 8800 (Worked!)
After a lot of research I've found that many people with a similar issue have their part come back as "Tested Okay," so I want to make sure I cover all my bases before I set up the RMA. I'm pretty sure it's the video card, though. I don't think it's the RAM, only because I've never gotten an error in Memtest. Thoughts? System Specs: GIGABYTE GA-P55-USB3 Intel Core i7-870 Lynnfield 2.93GHz LGA 1156 95W Quad-Core Processor G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) CORSAIR CMPSU-850TX 850W (Everything else unplugged)
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madoblivion
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Sunday, February 13, 2011 3:41 PM
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I will be getting my 3rd replacement card this monday, The last card i RMA'd had the exact same problem you describe But the first card I RMA'd did not. So common sense is telling me there is just a problem with these cards. I am trying to run a SLI setup and do have one working gtx 460. When i sent in my cards for RMA they also told me the card passed testing. Some people are forced to send in their Entire Rigs to the card manafucturer just so they can then tell them the videocard is at fault. But you can take that same card that does not work in your system and put it in one of their older systems and would run fine. Evga Claims to not be aware of any such issue, But Nvidia IS and is investigating the matter right now. So more then likely its just a problem with the 400/500 series cards.
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morphaus
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Sunday, February 13, 2011 9:13 PM
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PSU Corsair 1200 ATX CPU Intel 5.0ghz i7 2600k asus maximus iv extreme Graphics Card.TRI GTX 480 FTW HC.SLI (testing 680 4gb sli) Memory Corsair 8gb 1866 water coooling GPU CPU Samsung 1080 3D Monitor 120hz Logitech diNovo Edge Keyboard Creative XFI 7.1 .
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whizzard9992
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Sunday, February 13, 2011 10:32 PM
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Thanks a ton morphaus for that link. Every time I trick my 480 into working it dies on me a month later. I can either spend $300 on an HD6950 (With less performance) or $200 on a new motherboard that works with the 480. Damn this 480 is getting more expensive by the day.
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HRPuffnstuff
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Monday, February 14, 2011 0:15 PM
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Morphaus all I see you doing on this forum is bad mouthing evga in every thread. Fermi might be power hungry and run hot but your personal troubles are not indicative of every fermi owner.
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morphaus
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Monday, February 14, 2011 0:47 PM
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Morphaus all I see you doing on this forum is bad mouthing evga in every thread (ASK YOUR SELF WHY). Fermi might be power hungry, (WHAT?) and run hot but your personal troubles are not indicative of every fermi owner.( Good to hear, Not ever one haivng these's problems. But after months, of trouble shooting... ITS the Cards. with certain motherboards.( my Case) Well i did spend £1100 .And if they work solid like 280 sli, i would not behere typing, Have i got anything against EVGA, well yes Ive used RMA, corsair. dell benq, samsung, phillips.ECT And this problem is the cards EVGA and this Motherboard EVGA. RMA is poor in euro.. Delt with alot in pass 10 years. From Differant company's (plus ive got to spend £ to send to germany. Imagine the cost, motherboard and 2 cards....... All evga brand. I did tell EVGA about my problem. But No reply ish. Did get email about Change for (standard. 580's) But that no Upgrade at all, From 480 FTW SLI Watercooled cards. if i got the new cards, after shipping cost's (charge me) and to buy 2 extra blocks, cards turn into not £1100 but £1300... how would you feel....
post edited by morphaus - Monday, February 14, 2011 0:51 PM
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whizzard9992
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Monday, February 14, 2011 1:18 AM
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Bearing in mind how many people build PC's and have NO clue what they're doing, or worse, overclock with no clue what they're doing, I'd say that EVGA's support is good (In the US anyway). I don't know anything about their European support. This definitely sounds like a problem with Fermi (Not EVGA-related, I'll note explicitly). Even if EVGA was aware of the issue, they can't confirm it until NVIDIA does; you're not going to bite the hand that feeds you. Their hands are as tied as ours until NVIDIA acts. Morpheus did help me out, so I think he deserves a little credit ;) He didn't bash EVGA in the process, either. HRPuffnstuff: any thoughts on my issue or did you just drop by to harp on Morpheus?
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morphaus
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Monday, February 14, 2011 1:49 AM
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Morpheus did help me out, so I think he deserves a little credit ;) He didn't bash EVGA in the process, either. HRPuffnstuff: any thoughts on my issue or did you just drop by to harp on Morpheus? well ive had 16 weeks with this issuie, All i ugraded was psu and gtx480sli. thought it might have been drivers, Ive done everthing i can at my end. Me Im bashing, THE RMA With evga in euro, why? sent RMA in. got email saying explain prob, Sent http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=187401&st=0 and others links. no reply from RMA But did get reply to step up too 580s sli, but for me its a step down Why. cost to send too germany. +(down time) cost to buy 2 new W?C blocks. All my, RMA's, ive never paid at my end.. and never will. if the problem is from who i got it from.... And ive got EVGA M/B and cards. since 2001 add 10 + RMA's ( differant company's) never had to foot the bill. and to show this propblem i would need to send M/B and 2 GTx 480 in post. Cost, My end alot+ downtime. Could pop in 280s and send back 480's.... But we carnt, Why http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=187401&st=0
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whizzard9992
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Monday, February 14, 2011 2:17 AM
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I could be wrong, but it doesn't look like this happens in the 500 series cards. If there's a problem with the 400-series chips and EVGA knows it, but NVIDIA won't confirm it, they would act exactly as they have: immediately encourage you to "step-up" and discourage the RMA (since the RMA isn't going to resolve the issue). All assumptions, though, but it makes sense. With over 1,000 replies to that thread over at nVidia, I feel happy that I'm not alone. I'll feel better when the issue is resolved. If not, this will absolutely be the last nVidia product I buy. I'm currently looking at a $500 brick, for which I've already purchased a new power supply thinking that was the problem. I'll call EVGA tomorrow and see what they say.
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morphaus
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Monday, February 14, 2011 2:31 AM
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Yeah sending back 2 cards, 400 series has not helped many.they still got the problem. Nvidia is working on the problem. But they carn't reproduce the problem. Yeah right. Yeah its nice to not be alone with this problem, after paying £1100 2 cards. Yeah if i step up. Might have find extra £200 ish. shipping and 2 new water-cooling blocks. + downtime. Been thinking about sandybridge. ? idunno......
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whizzard9992
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Monday, February 14, 2011 5:40 AM
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I was considering SNB, too, but really I'm happy with what I have, and I spent enough money on it. I just want it to work. I game at 1680x1050 so I can't justify the purchase. Besides, I'd be pretty heated if I got a new righ and the 480 still refused to work with it. If I do anything at this point, I'm getting a Radeon.
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madoblivion
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Monday, February 14, 2011 4:20 PM
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Sad these card manufacturers seem to be giving us the run around. When i talk to tech support it seems they are reading lines out of a book making it even hard to get a word in sometimes because they talk without taking a pause, A typical telemarketing tactic. I find it odd Tech support would incorporate such a tactic.
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donta1979
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Monday, February 14, 2011 8:14 PM
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Interesting I have 3x GTX 480's and have had zero issues minus the issue i had with my classified 759 board not having enough power to resuling in a meltdown of my 24pin 12v pins... but EVGA made it right by giving me a classified 3. But yeah the GTX 480's are not bad cards just hot, and a bit noisy but you can take steps to keep temps below 70C. I would not call it a bad card at all. OP it could be a multiple of things, psu not giving the card enough juice/amps or you just ran into bad luck, or your case does not have enough airflow. Or something is just lose.
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chrism101
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Monday, February 14, 2011 8:32 PM
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Obviously there are lots of blame to throw around, some lies with nvidia and some with the user. I can tell you in most systems a single gtx480 is not a problem, but add the heat and powerdraw of the SLI setup and most endusers cannot engineer out the solutions needed. Just face it, some hardware is incompatible. Get a board you know works with it and get over it instead of the same stuff over and over. The same applies to Cases, PSUs, fans, etc. Nvidia has alot of failings in the FERMI release and in driver issues etc. Dont expect them to fix anything. If it doenst work and you tried move on or get left behind. I wouldnt spend more than a week trying to make something work before admitting that i dont have the knowledge to do it. You arent Nvidia engineers and so fort. RMA, buy something else, or switch brands.
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whizzard9992
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Monday, February 14, 2011 9:22 PM
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I have to disagree here that "some blame rests on the user." This isn't RAM we're talking about. Video cards are supposed to work in any system that meets the published system requirements. If there's a compatibility issue, that issue is the responsibility of the manufacturer to either (1) resolve or (2) publish. I paid $500 for a video card I used for 6 months before it died, and sending the card in for an RMA will simply get me another card with the same issue. In other words, no warranty. I assume no responsibility for that. This is something that needs to be resolved by nVidia. I'm not here to trash Fermi: I love it that's why I got the card, but truth be told I've had nothing but problems with it and I'm not alone. It is what it is.
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whizzard9992
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Monday, February 14, 2011 9:29 PM
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Thanks donta. I did try and address those issues. I've tried 3 PSU's (Two of the same brand / wattage, and one new one) and actively monitored voltages and temps. I've done everything but re-seat the motherboard. Since removing the card, the system's been stable. Between that and seeing so many others exhibiting the same issue, I feel confident that it's a problem with the card. For those who feel so inclined to personally defend Fermi / nVidia, I'm not saying it's a bad card: I'm pointing out a problem that needs to be resolved. If the card was "bad," then so many users wouldn't be using the card successfully. If the card was "perfect," though, so many users wouldn't be exhibiting the same problem. I think we can agree that the card may have some issues that need to be resolved, even if they don't affect everyone. On a personal note, I don't think that something this widespread could have gone unnoticed by nVidia for so long. I am disappointed in how nVidia is handling this.
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madoblivion
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Monday, February 14, 2011 11:03 PM
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I received my 2nd replacement today, The card seems to be booting and running Great. I have not had a chance to game much with it, but I'm fairly confident i have a working functioning card now. For testing i Restarted the system about 4 times to see if i could replicate any boot issue, No problems found there. I also ran a 3dmark 11 benchmark, The only Problem with that is that i had to disable one of my monitors so that the test would complete itself without bouncing back a "lost keyboard focus" error. I have similar problems with stereoscopic 3D in a multi display config, on 1 OR 2 GPU's. Disable one display and my 3D works fine. I would like to say the problems mentioned above has nothing to do with your PSU and is purely a problem with these cards. But since i can easily fix the issue I'm not gonna cry too much about it. Soo My current conclusion is, if you do receive a RMA'd card and still have a problem... RMA it again until the problem is resolved. I still have some tests to do... but so far so good. But the fact that these previous Rma'd cards passed testing saddens me greatly.
post edited by madoblivion - Monday, February 14, 2011 11:54 PM
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chrism101
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Tuesday, February 15, 2011 1:18 AM
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Look Everyone of you Should have Known what FERMI GTX4XX was from the start. A Failure. It failed to enter the market when it was supposed to, was not at all a 512 core design. The yield of functioning chips was <3% from the silicon at the foundry. And those 3% represented the unfinished 512 fermi which was respun once if not twice more and entered the market finally in late 2010 versus Q3 2009. The 400 series is and always was a stopgap between the 200 series and the 500 series, and we wont even talk about the rebadging they did trying to come up with a 300 series. Every Review and Preview predicted it would be too hot, it would be a power hog, and NVIDIA would likely LOSE money on it. But They were so late to the Game it had to be Released. ATI 58XX cards already supported DX11 and tessellation. So gtx4xx got rushed out a full 6 months or more before the True Fermi (gtx 580) was released. Yes each of us here in this Forum purchased an engineering failure. Dont expect much in the way of sympathy from Nvidia. These chips are all Binned based on capability. It physically as produced could not run the full 512 cores because of HEAT and Power requirements. So they Neutered a group of 32 cores off of each piece of silicon, Meaning the 480 has 15 SMs versus the Fermi Spec 16 SMs. If it ran within spec with 480 cores of the 512 it got to be a gtx480 so maybe 5% met that criteria, If it ran with less then it was maybe another 3-5% That met gtx470 spec, and then 3-5% that may meet gtx465 specs and on and on down. This is why alot of chips vary greatly among voltage and thermal properties even among the same core class. The manufacturers then take and test these chips and the ones that spec higher with greater clock speeds without needing extra voltage of course become your SSC, SC, and FTW chips. but even some of these chips will experience problems because of the HEAT the chipset produces. Heat makes for the need for added voltage to stabilize and voltage makes heat causing instability in a vicious cycle that becomes hard to balance when running at temps far greater than prior chip designs and specifically within a Flawed design.
post edited by chrism101 - Tuesday, February 15, 2011 1:25 AM
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whizzard9992
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Tuesday, February 15, 2011 1:37 AM
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Your brazen declaration of intellectual superiority serves only yourself. If you'd like a soapbox upon which to air your grievances about Fermi, please do it elsewhere. If you can help in some way, that's fantastic, otherwise step aside and let someone else help.
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chrism101
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Tuesday, February 15, 2011 4:17 AM
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Heres a thought , RMA your MB. Obviously if you had 6 working months and then something fried. Do not limit your damage strictly to that component. Possibly something fried in the PCI bus that or MB power that will still allow enough for the old card but not for the new cards. If something happened to the PC say a surge and it was damaging to the VGA card then you can and will have other components damaged. Aside from that, I notice it is a crossfire Board, and can help but think maybe they lack some of the full NVidia support. This too might make a difference these are footnotes to your MB: (Note 2) For optimum performance, if only one PCI Express graphics card is to be installed, be sure to install it in the PCIEX16 slot. (Note 3) When the PCIEX1_2 slot is populated with an expansion card, the PCIEX4_X1 slot will operate at up to x1 mode. (Note 4) The PCIEX16 slot operates at up to x4 mode when ATI CrossFireX is enabled. Honestly, it doesnt sound like a spectacular motherboard given that using crossfire throws it down to x4 bus speeds. And it makes me think more about its inability to power a gtx480 if it is in anyway damaged.
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madoblivion
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Tuesday, February 15, 2011 3:35 PM
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Worse advice EVER. RMA the card. The MB should be a last resort, and i can pretty much guarantee if you RMA your MB that will not fix your issue.
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chrism101
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Tuesday, February 15, 2011 9:28 PM
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No the worst advice would be not to RMA Either. If you have friend perhaps nearby that has a system to test it in, I would do that first. You can easily rule out the Card that way versus some other issue.
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madoblivion
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Wednesday, February 16, 2011 1:52 AM
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There are various things that can cause a boot problem. But, considering i had the exact same problem with my last card.. i can tell you my MB is not faulty and the 2nd card they sent me as a replacement works fine. Soooo from personal experience... RMA the card. Sooo lets crack some numbers I have received a total of FOUR GTX 460's OUT OF THOSE FOUR, ONLY TWO OF THEM WORKED. Sooo with those numbers in mind.. I'm gonna go ahead and say its a faulty card.
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whizzard9992
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Wednesday, February 16, 2011 5:08 PM
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Thanks for the advice (and for taking my harsh criticism so well... I apologize for that). I don't think it's the motherboard because my PC works fine with the GTS 8800. I can't use the 4x PCIe slot anyway since it would cover my SATA ports. I have another PC I could try, but that would require me installing a new PSU (I have one, but that's a lot of work :( ) I considered testing the card in the 4x slot, but again, the SATA ports get in the way. Someone from nVidia contacted me on the other boards, so I think nVidia is actually looking into this. I'm going to hold off on doing anything for a couple weeks, anyway, since I'm in Europe. Hopefully nVidia has some good news by then.
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failgo
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Wednesday, February 16, 2011 9:50 PM
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Are you running an overclock on your CPU? Try running everything at default speeds. I think it has to do with RAM more but that is usually why it would just reboot or freeze. That and power. Run your RAM slower. Are you sure you don't have a bad PSU, or an able one. I had a brand new PSU crap out on me before. If an RMA doesn't fix it than it most likely is a PSU or CPU OVerclock issue. Just because the older card works doesn't mean it isn't a bad PSU or CPU issue. Older cards don't stress other components so much. My 260s ran fine but my computer would reboot whenever a game was ran with my 470s. Bad PSU. Also had reboot issues when my CPU overclock(which ran fine with 2x260s) was unstable.
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chrism101
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Thursday, February 17, 2011 2:12 AM
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Another Thought is just some bios setting that you are missing? Maybe some form of power management? I know alot of the new settings on Motherboards are jumping on the Green Bandwagon to save energy and save the world. It could be some of these are activating and dropping power to the PCI. Just a wild theory. But personally I turn all of those power features off in BIOS and in Windows. I want my PC Running and humming 24/7 i dont want it getting lazy with my data, taking a nap, or dropping a connection.
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whizzard9992
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Thursday, February 17, 2011 9:53 AM
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I normally run my PC stock. It hasn't really been stable since I bought it (Which I've now concluded is because of my video card), so I was never confident enough in the hardware to overclock it. (I didn't buy the highest quality MB / RAM). I did, however, play with just about every setting in my BIOS. I tried overclocking and underclocking my PCIe bus; I tried disabling all C-states and power management in the CPU; I tried increasing the Vtt voltages (The PCIe bus voltages in Lynnfield), etc; I tried disabling ALL other peripheral devices, such as SATA controller, USB3, Serial & Parallel ports, etc. Nothing worked. I've tried 3 different PSUs, all of which work fine in other PC's (With other video cards ;) The latest of which is 850W and has a single, massive 12v rail. I will eventually RMA the card, but I'm waiting to hear back from nVidia that they've diagnosed the problem. As far as I can tell, this is something wrong with Fermi (or the reference designs) that nVidia hasn't yet identified. See the thread mentioned in the above post (3rd reply).
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donta1979
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Thursday, February 17, 2011 10:51 PM
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It could be you just ran into bad luck, bios does not get along with card or you were one of the few who got a bad card. It happens after all in anything you buy I would call EVGA tbh and setup an rma.
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cynthetic
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Re:GTX 480 Freezes computer, sometimes in BIOS
Sunday, March 27, 2011 7:44 AM
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I have had this exact same problem 3 different times, with 3 different model video cards, all from evga. 1st was gtx 280 2nd was gtx 295 3rd will be the one I am submitting now which is the gtx 480. And yes I have done all the testing, bare minimum components, put in an ATI card and it worked instantly. no problems whatsoever. even got a new mobo, exact same thing.
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