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Looking to upgrade my 8800 gtx quick question for 750i mono users

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AutobotVu
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Wednesday, October 31, 2012 5:54 PM (permalink)
I kind of wanted to get best i can get for my mobo 750i ftw .
Its got qx 6700 no oc
I was thinking of getting 690 gtx during black friday but have no idea if it would work in my set up anyone know this answer. Greatly appreciate it
 
So I think I decided on getting 690 gtx along with i7 3960x ( getting for 500 bucks) 
  
I have no decided what mobo to get any suggestions. 
  
also debating if I wanna get 480 gb ssd 520 series 
  
The combo for the i7 and ssd is around 850 bucks 
  
But I alrdy got 120 ssd atm I will only be storing games and app on the ssd though I got secondary and external for everything else. 
post edited by AutobotVu - Saturday, November 03, 2012 10:05 AM
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    ki11joy92
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    Re:Looking to upgrade my 8800 gtx quick question for 750i mono users Wednesday, October 31, 2012 5:59 PM (permalink)
    Huge bottleneck. Upgrade your while system and you can fully utilize a new video card


     
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    flyhii
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    Re:Looking to upgrade my 8800 gtx quick question for 750i mono users Wednesday, October 31, 2012 8:09 PM (permalink)
    If i'm remembering right your mobo's main PCI-E slot is using PCI-E 1.x specs (if 750i enthuiasist maybe, maybe PCI-E 2.0).
    The 690 should run but you will never get or see optimized performance from the card due to the limitations of the platform that you want to put it on & will most likely disappoint you performance-wise in the end......& it WON'T be the card's fault at large. At most a 650 ser Kepler will max out your platform, provided if the card can navigate the PCI_E 1.x specs seamlessly (mostly from a driver perspective).
    IMO a better choice (if you're set on keeping your current platform) would be a 400 ser card or low 500 ser card (560 or lower) as they would be a better fit on that platform & would give you less issues & better align w/ your expectations........& will be a cheaper option to boot depending upon the choices that you make. If you want to have the latest tech in vid cards.....................................................
     
    Otherwise as it has already been mentioned, stay w/ what you're currently using & plan to upgrade your platform 1st before looking to jump on a card such as the 690 ser, or any 600 ser card for that matter.
     
    In the end it's your money & your choice.
     
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    loveha
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    Re:Looking to upgrade my 8800 gtx quick question for 750i mono users Wednesday, October 31, 2012 8:14 PM (permalink)
    Take that money, buy a GTX670, then spend the rest on a new Mobo, CPU and RAM, and most likely new PSU. The new system will blow your current one out of the water.
    Like other have stated, the system will bottleneck the hell out of a 690 and you will be disappointed. The CPU tells the GPU what to draw. So if the CPU is slow, the GPU will just be sitting waiting for orders.
     
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    garnetandblack
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    Re:Looking to upgrade my 8800 gtx quick question for 750i mono users Wednesday, October 31, 2012 8:15 PM (permalink)
    The 750i FTW edition does have PCIE 2.0 support.  Still, that CPU will bottleneck some.  OC'ing it will help some, but even then...  Your next upgrade should definitely be a mobo and CPU.

    "My mother always told me someday you'll be good at somethin'. Who'd have guessed that somethin' would be zombie killin'?"
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    lehpron
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    Re:Looking to upgrade my 8800 gtx quick question for 750i mono users Wednesday, October 31, 2012 9:33 PM (permalink)
    AutobotVu
    I kind of wanted to get best i can get for my mobo 750i ftw .
    Its got qx 6700 no oc I was thinking of getting 690 gtx during black friday but have no idea if it would work in my set up anyone know this answer. Greatly appreciate it 
    There are different types of games, but two main groups: CPU-intensive and GPU-intensive.  All games are still run by the CPU and only the CPU tells the graphics what to draw.  What ki11joy92 is alluding to is that the QX6700 is dated in the sense that there are faster processors available even at the same frequency since Intel has been changing the design of the processor over the years.  But keep in mind, many active members of these forums do choose to keep up with technology so much that it blinds them with how to deal with older hardware other than suggesting you keep up.
     
    Fact is you have some leway in upgrading, you can only upgrade the fastest equivalent graphics card to what was possible back when Core 2 Quads were the big deal.  Back then in fall 2006 through 2007, 8800GTX was king and only up to 3-way SLI was possible towards the end of 2007.  Since not everyone overclocks their CPU, a modern equivalent to a triple of 8800GTX's is the fastest you could get before better fails to scale.  
     
    Equivalents to a triple of 8800GTX include GTX465, GTX560 and GTX660-- If you don't want to overclock the CPU or change your setup, these are the fastest cards you could get without worrying about scaling issues.
     
    The idea is that if a graphics card upgrade doesn't scale as expected, it is usually held back by another component, and it is usually a slower CPU; thus why we overclock.  But it isn't just about frequency since Intel changes the design architecture every few years.  For your case, an overclock could allow for a faster graphics card than what you have, in the sense that the CPU tells the graphics card what to draw. 
     
    By the time 3.2GHz QX9770 appeared in 2008 before the new generation Core i parts, people would use multiple GTX200 series cards, but back then the maximum was 3-way SLI whether you had CPU overclock or not.  Therefore, if you overclocked your QX6700 to the speeds of QX9770, then the maximum you could support would be the modern equivalent to 3-way SLI GTX280.  According to Anandtech reviews linked below, if we compare with the game Crysis Warhead at 1920x1200, 3-way SLI GTX280's comes close to a single GTX680, but not GTX690 which has the power of two GTX670's actually.
     
    In other words, a GTX690 may require a CPU overclock that your QX6700 cannot sustain, i.e. well over 4GHz because it is the equivalent power of six GTX200 series cards from the time of Core 2 Quad.  
     
    But if you have $1000 to spend of a GTX690, I rather suggest you get a new Core i5-3000 series processor in a Z77 chipset and a single GTX680 with new 1080p display if you don't have one.  Ironically, because you've waited so long, while you'd have to do this daisy-chain research to find a some context, a full on upgrade would be easier than not changing everything.
     
    Also, even if you had the best CPU and GPU combination, a low resolution will bottleneck which forces CPU-intensive, and with a QX6700, it would defeat the purpose of any graphics card you upgrade to if you had a lower resolution.

    For Intel processors, 0.122 x TDP = Continuous Amps at 12v [source].  

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    AutobotVu
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    Re:Looking to upgrade my 8800 gtx quick question for 750i mono users Wednesday, October 31, 2012 10:46 PM (permalink)
    Lol i waited cause my laptop is i7 with 650 gtx 16 gig of ram but since i wanted uae desktop for my 50 inch tv again . Well lol i wanted upgrade alittle but replacing everything is a slight pain.
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    loveha
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    Re:Looking to upgrade my 8800 gtx quick question for 750i mono users Wednesday, October 31, 2012 10:50 PM (permalink)
    AutobotVu

    Lol i waited cause my laptop is i7 with 650 gtx 16 gig of ram but since i wanted uae desktop for my 50 inch tv again . Well lol i wanted upgrade alittle but replacing everything is a slight pain.

    Your TV is probably most likely 1080P. In which case you do not need all that horsepower unless you want the best out there. The size of the screen does not dictate how much GPU power you need. It is the Pixel Count.

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    candle_86
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    Re:Looking to upgrade my 8800 gtx quick question for 750i mono users Wednesday, October 31, 2012 10:56 PM (permalink)
    lehpron

    AutobotVu
    I kind of wanted to get best i can get for my mobo 750i ftw .
    Its got qx 6700 no oc I was thinking of getting 690 gtx during black friday but have no idea if it would work in my set up anyone know this answer. Greatly appreciate it 
    There are different types of games, but two main groups: CPU-intensive and GPU-intensive.  All games are still run by the CPU and only the CPU tells the graphics what to draw.  What ki11joy92 is alluding to is that the QX6700 is dated in the sense that there are faster processors available even at the same frequency since Intel has been changing the design of the processor over the years.  But keep in mind, many active members of these forums do choose to keep up with technology so much that it blinds them with how to deal with older hardware other than suggesting you keep up.

    Fact is you have some leway in upgrading, you can only upgrade the fastest equivalent graphics card to what was possible back when Core 2 Quads were the big deal.  Back then in fall 2006 through 2007, 8800GTX was king and only up to 3-way SLI was possible towards the end of 2007.  Since not everyone overclocks their CPU, a modern equivalent to a triple of 8800GTX's is the fastest you could get before better fails to scale.  

    Equivalents to a triple of 8800GTX include GTX465, GTX560 and GTX660-- If you don't want to overclock the CPU or change your setup, these are the fastest cards you could get without worrying about scaling issues.

    The idea is that if a graphics card upgrade doesn't scale as expected, it is usually held back by another component, and it is usually a slower CPU; thus why we overclock.  But it isn't just about frequency since Intel changes the design architecture every few years.  For your case, an overclock could allow for a faster graphics card than what you have, in the sense that the CPU tells the graphics card what to draw. 

    By the time 3.2GHz QX9770 appeared in 2008 before the new generation Core i parts, people would use multiple GTX200 series cards, but back then the maximum was 3-way SLI whether you had CPU overclock or not.  Therefore, if you overclocked your QX6700 to the speeds of QX9770, then the maximum you could support would be the modern equivalent to 3-way SLI GTX280.  According to Anandtech reviews linked below, if we compare with the game Crysis Warhead at 1920x1200, 3-way SLI GTX280's comes close to a single GTX680, but not GTX690 which has the power of two GTX670's actually.

    In other words, a GTX690 may require a CPU overclock that your QX6700 cannot sustain, i.e. well over 4GHz because it is the equivalent power of six GTX200 series cards from the time of Core 2 Quad.  

    But if you have $1000 to spend of a GTX690, I rather suggest you get a new Core i5-3000 series processor in a Z77 chipset and a single GTX680 with new 1080p display if you don't have one.  Ironically, because you've waited so long, while you'd have to do this daisy-chain research to find a some context, a full on upgrade would be easier than not changing everything.

    Also, even if you had the best CPU and GPU combination, a low resolution will bottleneck which forces CPU-intensive, and with a QX6700, it would defeat the purpose of any graphics card you upgrade to if you had a lower resolution.

     
    umm just to correct you here, the Core2 showed that it bottlenecked sli 8800GTX's to an extent and people saw gains with the i5 and i7 cpu's and with triple even greater gains. The Core2 was designed to be faster than the Core, they dont say this is whats on the market lets make sure we can max that out, if so it would bottleneck anything faster than Crossfire 1950XTX or SLI 7950 GX2. As far as what was around during there production run, well you've got Geforce 200, and Radeon HD4000 so by your logic a Core2 wouldnt bottleneck dual GTX295's and to that sir i say lol.
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    boredgunner
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    Re:Looking to upgrade my 8800 gtx quick question for 750i mono users Wednesday, October 31, 2012 11:12 PM (permalink)
    GTX 690 is $1,000.  I agree with loveha, spend around $130 on an ASUS, ASRock, or Gigabyte Z77, $215 on the i5 3570k ($15 discount on newegg right now), and $40-$50 for Corsair/G.SKILL/Mushkin 8GB DDR3 1600.  This will leave you enough for a GTX 670 if you even need that kind of power.


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    lehpron
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    Re:Looking to upgrade my 8800 gtx quick question for 750i mono users Thursday, November 01, 2012 0:39 PM (permalink)
    AutobotVu
    Lol i waited cause my laptop is i7 with 650 gtx 16 gig of ram but since i wanted uae desktop for my 50 inch tv again . Well lol i wanted upgrade a little but replacing everything is a slight pain.
    Laptop GT650 is not like the desktop version, it is slower; yeah you've got 384-cores but they are running at 600MHz.  Compared to the 8800GTX with 128 cores at 1350MHz, your laptop is less than 40% faster.
     
    As for adding a GTX560 with 336-cores at 1800MHz to your QX6700 setup, that is very decent being three times that of your 8800GTX and still faster than your laptop's GPU, you don't have to upgrade the whole thing.
     
    Don't think because you had your eye on GTX690 that anything less isn't worth it; that 'go big or go home' line is just BS.  Both your laptop and desktop are behind/slow enough that you can go cheaper and still gain a major advantage.
     
    candle_86 
    umm just to correct you here, the Core2 showed that it bottlenecked sli 8800GTX's to an extent and people saw gains with the i5 and i7 cpu's and with triple even greater gains. 
    No, you're just repeating what I already said in the first paragraph where a newer CPU will succeed where an older overclocked processor couldn't to better feed older graphics cards; it happens.  Question is, how many will acknowledge modern processors hold modern graphics cards back that only future processors can fix?  Many folks here can't swallow that type of pride where their perfect new 5GHz Sandy or Ivy is holding back their 670/680 SLI setup...even though the 4th GPU tends to make it very clear.
     
    That being said, I found an old 3-way SLI 8800GTX review from Legitreviews that used a QX9770 at stock and only tested games at 2560x1600 resolution.  If 2-way SLI was truly bottlenecked by a Core 2 Quad at 3.2GHz, then the third card wouldn't show gains at all because the CPU is holding everything back.  The closest result in that link of that occuring is the 3Dmark06 run at the default 1280x1024 resolution; while only Call of Jaurez was not bottlenecked by the stock 45nm quad-core.  All other games showed some gains with the third card, but not as linearly, proving that the CPU could have been faster to make the scaling linear but not that much was needed.
     
    BTW, linear means by the same percentage increase, not 100%.  It can be 60% with each additional card and still be linear; but if it is 60% and then 40%, that isn't linear; it means each additional card will lead to a CPU-bottleneck.  But I have noticed people treat CPU overclocking like a one time fix, as if the lack of further GPU scaling isn't the CPU's fault.   No, bottleneck is an ideology and doesn't go away; it just constantly shifts to something else.  This is why what you said in that quote is true; but you aren't correcting me, it is just something I've been saying for months.
     
    Conclusion: If the OP's QX6700 was bumped up to a 400MHz FSB to match a QX9770, and an equivalent to 3-way SLI 8800GTX = GTX560 was used, then those results in the LegitReviews are representative.  But getting a GTX690 is way out of bounds!
     
    Most 3-way GTX200 reviews I've found have already moved onto Nehalem, but we do know that a i7-920 is as fast as QX9770, or about 25% clock-for-clock.  A stock 965X would be like the C2Q's up at 4.0GHz; but a i7-920 at 4GHz is not practical for C2Q to match, which is 5GHz.  I remember K|ngp|n did a record run using LN2 just to get a QX6700 to 4.9GHz.
    post edited by lehpron - Thursday, November 01, 2012 0:44 PM

    For Intel processors, 0.122 x TDP = Continuous Amps at 12v [source].  

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    #11
    RainStryke
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    Re:Looking to upgrade my 8800 gtx quick question for 750i mono users Thursday, November 01, 2012 2:06 AM (permalink)
    That QX6700 would need 6GHz+ on an overclock to run a single GTX 670. Not gonna happen... Those QX6700's had the really crappy C1 stepping too. You would be lucky to hit 3.6GHz on a overclock.
     
    It's time to upgrade... Even a i3 3000 series processor stomps the performance of that QX6700 in games.
     
    If you look at this:
    http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/cpus/2012/05/01/intel-core-i5-3570k-cpu-review/6
     
    You will see, even a i7 900 series processor has a hard time keeping up at stock settings with a GTX 590. Those processors are around 40-50% faster at the same clock speed compared to a QX6700.
     
     
     
     

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    AutobotVu
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    Re:Looking to upgrade my 8800 gtx quick question for 750i mono users Thursday, November 01, 2012 8:47 AM (permalink)
    Yah the SPec on it right now is
    Thermaltake armor case
    4 gigs kingston ram
    evga 750i ftw
    Qx6700
    Asus 8800gtx
     
    I use for everything now my laptop is better but main comp is easier to upgrade.
     
    Laptop is
     
    ASUS G74SX-DH73-3D
     
    Display: 17.3" FHD 16:9 "Matte Type" Super Clear Ultra Bright LED Screen (1920x1080) 120Hz 3D Ready w/ 3D Vision Glasses[[
         nVidia GeForce GTX 560M 3,072MB PCI-Express GDDR5 DX11[ 
     I'll prob get i7 from uncle who works at intel but thats going to take some time.

     
    Will 690 gtx work in the 750i mean while or what will happen?
     
    I was hoping it would max out the most a QX6700 can handle till I upgrade mobo  power supply and cpu
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    Angrychair420
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    Re:Looking to upgrade my 8800 gtx quick question for 750i mono users Friday, November 02, 2012 2:37 AM (permalink)
    do what I did, upgrade everything, you will be much happier.  It's only money!
     
     

     
    #14
    AutobotVu
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    Re:Looking to upgrade my 8800 gtx quick question for 750i mono users Saturday, November 03, 2012 8:30 AM (permalink)
    Just need to know now what Ram, Mobo, If i really need the higher capacity ssd, power supply, and cooling
     
    Will my old

    Thermaltake Armor Series VA8000BWS

     be sufficient enough for the new cpu/video card?
    post edited by AutobotVu - Saturday, November 03, 2012 10:09 AM
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    rjohnson11
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    Re:Looking to upgrade my 8800 gtx quick question for 750i mono users Saturday, November 03, 2012 9:11 AM (permalink)
    I have to agree with everyone here that your best bet is an upgarde of the processor, memory, and motherboard. maybe an EVGA Z77 motherboard. Then take the leftover cash and buy a GTX 670 or higher. 

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    lehpron
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    Re:Looking to upgrade my 8800 gtx quick question for 750i mono users Saturday, November 03, 2012 3:59 PM (permalink)
    candle_86
    As far as what was around during there production run, well you've got Geforce 200, and Radeon HD4000 so by your logic a Core2 wouldnt bottleneck dual GTX295's and to that sir i say lol.
    Years back I ran the in-game benchmark for "World in Conflict: Soviet Assault" at 1080p and max details with my single GTX260, but I noticed that the performance with my i7-920 didn't really change no matter how many cores I enabled.  The following chart was compiled from that test, with the i7-920 having only one core w/HT enabled.
     

     
    These results show that I was GPU-bottlenecked, that only either an additional GTX260 for SLI or a faster graphic card would have scaled up performance with the CPU overclock, which did absolutely nothing for my performance.  If it was CPU-bottlenecked, then frame rates should have changed with resolution, not remained flat.
     
    The i7-920 with 1c-2t at 3.4GHz, no such processor existed like that, closest would be an i5-670 with HT disabled.  Considering the clock-for-clock difference between Nehalem and Penryn of about 25%, then a Core 2 Duo in the 4.2GHz range would match; and any E8400 or better could reach that.  So an E8400 at 4.2GHz with a GTX260 should produce the same result as with my i7-920 at 3.4 with just one core and HT enabled. Definitely more than one GTX260 is needed to shift the problem to CPU-intensive, though I admit being on the fence whether the equivalent of four GTX260's (in two GTX295's) would scale well without knowing for certain.  But I'm certain 2-way and 3-way would have scaled well in this circumstance.
     
    Considering the Anandtech links from my first reply, a GTX680 is as fast as 3-way GTX260, so pairing it with a 4.2GHz Core 2 wouldn't be a problem for World in Conflict at 1080p max details.  It depends on the type of game, it isn't just about the hardware.  Sure the OP may need a crazy overclock for a CPU-intensive game, but not GPU-intensive; especially when his HDTV is still just 1080p.

    For Intel processors, 0.122 x TDP = Continuous Amps at 12v [source].  

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