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Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy.

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BMoffa
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Friday, November 04, 2011 1:27 PM (permalink)
I've been running stable for at least a year and a half with my 920 OCed to 3.5Ghz with 6GB of RAM.  Since RAM prices have dropped a bit I decided to double up. I Installed an additional 3 GB of matching RAM and immediately ran into problems.  First, on first boot Windows reported 12 GB installed (9.99 usable).   The 9.99 usable seemed really odd to me and I knew I had a problem.  Anyway, I then ran the Windows memory test.  I left it running, but when I cam back I had a BSD (0x07 stop as I recall).   So, I set my BIOS back to default settings, set the memory timings to the memory spec and ran several passes with MemTest.  The memory checks out at default settings.  I am running with default clocking for now.
 
What should I be looking at here?  My OC specs a listed below.
 
Mother Board ( EVGA X58 Classified 760 )
Drivers ( current )
Bios ( 80 )
CPU ( 920  DO)
CPU Cooler ( Cooler Master V8 )
Memory (6 GB Corsair XMS  PC12000 DDR3 1600MHz (8-8-8-24))
PSU ( Ultra X3 1000W )
GPU ( GTX 295 CO-OP x 1 )
Drivers ( 195.62 )
Operating System ( Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit Release)


Frequency Control
CPU Clock Ratio ( 20X )
CPU Host Frequency (Mhz) ( 178 )
MCH Strap ( Auto )
CPU Uncore Frequency (Mhz) ( Auto)
CPU Clock Skew ( 0 ps )
Spread Spectrum ( Disabled )
PCIE Frequency (Mhz) ( 100 )
OC Recovery ( Disabled )

Memory Feature        
Memory Speed ( Standard )
Memory Control Setting ( Enabled )
Memory Frequency ( 2:8 )
Channel Interleave Setting ( 6 Way )
Rank Interleave Setting ( 4 Way )
Memory Low Gap ( Auto )
tCL Setting ( 8 )
tRCD Setting ( 8 )
tRP Setting ( 8 )
tRAS Setting ( 24 )
tRFC Setting ( 74 )
Command Rate ( 1T )


Voltage Control
EVGA VDroop Control ( With VDroop )
CPU VCore ( 1.26250 )
CPU VTT Voltage ( +100)
CPU PLL VCore ( Auto)
IOH PLL VCore ( Auto) 
QPI PLL VCore ( Auto)
DIMM Voltage ( 1.65 )
DIMM DQ Vref ( +0mV )

IOH VCore ( Auto )
IOH/ICH I/O Voltage ( Auto )
**BR04 ( NF200) Voltage ( Auto )
**VTT PWM Frequency ( 250 KHZ )
**CPU PWM Frequency ( 800 KHZ )
**CPU Impedance ( Auto )
**QPI Signal Compensation ( Auto )
ICH VCore ( Auto )


CPU Feature
Intel SpeedStep ( Disabled )
Turbo Mode Function ( Enabled )
CxE Function ( Disabled )
Execute Disable Bit ( Enabled )
Virtualization Technology ( Disabled )
Intel HT Technology ( Enabled )
Active Processor Cores ( All )
QPI Control Settings ( Enabled )
QPI Link Fast Mode ( Enabled )
QPI Frequency Selection ( 4.8 GT/s )


PnP/PCI     PCI Express
Maximum Payload Size ( 512 ) 

EVGA X58 Classified (760)
Bios 83
Core i7 920 2.66GHz D0 O/C to 3.55GHz
G.Sill [Ripjaws] F3-128000CL7T-12GBRM (4GBx3)
Cooler Master V8
GTX 480 SC
2 x 500gb SATA in RAID 1 (Intel on board)
SB XFi XTreme Gammer PCI
Corsair HX1000W PSU
Windows 7 Ultimate SP1 64-bit
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    sgtharry
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Friday, November 04, 2011 1:43 PM (permalink)
    You probably will need more vtt when you run all 6 slots. Have you tried going up on it at all yet? +100 seems low.


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    BMoffa
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Friday, November 04, 2011 1:48 PM (permalink)
    I really haven't tried anything else yet--hoping to get some guidance.  The VTT+100 has been like that the entire time.   How much would you think it show go up?
     
    I need to be careful because I use this machine for work too.

    EVGA X58 Classified (760)
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    zombiewarpig
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Friday, November 04, 2011 1:57 PM (permalink)
    I use +150 for my 12gb if I oc the cpu.

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    rjohnson11
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Friday, November 04, 2011 2:07 PM (permalink)
    I agree, try +150 and if that doesn't work try +200 (I don't remember if there is a +175 but if there is try that)

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    HalloweenWeed
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Friday, November 04, 2011 2:31 PM (permalink)
    Set command rate at 2t. Also, your avail mem is not wrong for your gfx card mem size. The mem low gap should be set to 2G for that vid card. 12-2=10.
    post edited by HalloweenWeed - Friday, November 04, 2011 2:33 PM

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    Overclocking is useless to me if it is not rock stable.
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    BMoffa
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Friday, November 04, 2011 7:23 PM (permalink)
    OK. This morning I tried VTT at +150, +175 and +200.  MemTest started getting errors during test 5 on the 1st pass (about 15 mins.) in every case.  Then, I set everything back to default clocks and ran a few memtest passed clean.  I rebooted then I started getting errors in Windows, the finally a BSD stip 0x3B.  
    HalloweenWeed, how sure are you about the 2T and would the mem gap be causing this kind of thing?  I have just about decided to give on the 12 Gig.

    EVGA X58 Classified (760)
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    BMoffa
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Friday, November 04, 2011 7:44 PM (permalink)
    Getting worse!  I pulled the new mem and put my old OC settings back in and this thing won't even POST.  Back to basics again.  What the heck is going on???

    EVGA X58 Classified (760)
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    atfrico
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Friday, November 04, 2011 7:45 PM (permalink)
    Loose the timings a bit. run them at 9-9-9-24. and set these settings on your bios
     
    CPU Uncore Frequency (Mhz) ( Auto)  x16
    Execute Disable Bit ( Enabled )  Disabled
     
    Post your results
     

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    hoserx
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Friday, November 04, 2011 7:45 PM (permalink)
    try loosening timings. increase qpi voltage. increase vtt voltage as stated. set TRL to +2 in your memory settings. 

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    atfrico
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Friday, November 04, 2011 7:53 PM (permalink)
    BMoffa

    Getting worse!  I pulled the new mem and put my old OC settings back in and this thing won't even POST.  Back to basics again.  What the heck is going on???

    Previous OC settings won't work when you add new hardware.  You need to redo/reapply your OCing.  Start with the default settings and work your way up, just try to remember the settings you have on your previous OC.

    Those who abuse power, are nothing but scumbags! The challenge of power is how to use it and not abuse it. The abuse of power that seems to create the most unhappiness is when a person uses personal power to get ahead without regards to the welfare of others, people are obsessed with it. You can take a nice person and turn them into a slob, into an insane being, craving power, destroying anything that stands in their way.
     
     
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    BMoffa
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Friday, November 04, 2011 8:01 PM (permalink)
    Actually I didn't add new hardware.  I just removed the new mem and put my old OC settings back to where they were before the new mem.  That's when it doesn't POST now.  Those settings were good for at leat 18 months.

    EVGA X58 Classified (760)
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    G.Sill [Ripjaws] F3-128000CL7T-12GBRM (4GBx3)
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    atfrico
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Friday, November 04, 2011 8:07 PM (permalink)
    BMoffa

    Actually I didn't add new hardware.  I just removed the new mem and put my old OC settings back to where they were before the new mem.  That's when it doesn't POST now.  Those settings were good for at leat 18 months.

    Adding more memory is considered hardware, even if it is 1 stick of memory. I upgraded memory and CPU. I tried using previous OCing settings to run my rig and I had the same issues as you.  I started from scratch, I reset the bios and little by little i got my OCing settings back.  I will recommend to do the same with new memory installed.

    Those who abuse power, are nothing but scumbags! The challenge of power is how to use it and not abuse it. The abuse of power that seems to create the most unhappiness is when a person uses personal power to get ahead without regards to the welfare of others, people are obsessed with it. You can take a nice person and turn them into a slob, into an insane being, craving power, destroying anything that stands in their way.
     
     
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    BMoffa
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Saturday, November 05, 2011 1:36 PM (permalink)
    Just an update.  I am back to where I started BEFORE adding the new RAM.   Apparently, the reason my system wouldn't POST when I put everything back to theses settings was a loose PCI sound card.  Once it was seated correctly I was back running with my old OC. 
     
    I am going to make another attempt at the 12 gig later today maybe.   Shouldn't the 12 gig work with standard clocking though?  Or, do I need to adjust timings, etc. just for that???
     

    EVGA X58 Classified (760)
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    HalloweenWeed
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Saturday, November 05, 2011 2:43 PM (permalink)
    BMoffa

    Shouldn't the 12 gig work with standard clocking though?  Or, do I need to adjust timings, etc. just for that???

    Yes you do. It is basic computer setup routine. XMP spd tables were supposed to eliminate this need, but according to reports of users for the last three years EVGA boards do not do this well; so using "XMP memory profile" is not recommended, and even the manual clearly states not to use it if you OC your CPU.
     
    Bottom line: ALWAYS enter your latencies and V manually. You should also set your mem multi manually.
    Have you set 2t yet? Your mem is 2t.
     

    Main (gaming) rig: i7-3930K; Asus Rampage IV Extreme; H100 W/p-p Excaliburs, AS5; MSI 7870 2GD5/OC; Crucial M4 SSD 256GB.
    See my primary ModsRigs: Adam for the rest, and I have a second (wife's) rig Asus Rampage III Extreme & 960: Eve.

       
    Overclocking is useless to me if it is not rock stable.
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    BMoffa
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Saturday, November 05, 2011 2:54 PM (permalink)
    Interesting.  I do enter all the memory timings manually.  I have always had it set to 1T.  I haven't been able to find that on Corsairs web site so I just left it at 1T.   That will be the next thing I try.

    EVGA X58 Classified (760)
    Bios 83
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    G.Sill [Ripjaws] F3-128000CL7T-12GBRM (4GBx3)
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    rjohnson11
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Saturday, November 05, 2011 3:43 PM (permalink)
    Just for your info on this board please do not use the Corsair XMS profile. Set everything manually to include the DIMM voltage. I have Corsair vengeance LP which runs at a low 1.35 volts and it sees all of the ram at default levels.

    AMD Ryzen 9 7950X,  Corsair Mp700 Pro M.2, 64GB Corsair Dominator Titanium DDR5  X670E Steel Legend, MSI RTX 4090 Associate Code: H5U80QBH6BH0AXF. I am NOT an employee of EVGA

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    BMoffa
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Sunday, November 06, 2011 7:55 PM (permalink)
    OK. Making some progress here.  I can get the system to run the 12 GB at stock CPU settings and memory timings set to 8 8 8 24 2T (mem spec).   Memory Frequency at 2:10 (1333Mhz)  Uncore at X20.
    Voltage settings:
    CPU VCore 1.26250 (Left over from OC probably more than neede at stock)
    CPU VTT = +200
    DIMM Voltage = 1.65 (mem spec)
    The above is stable at 5 passes of LinX, SO FAR.  Test contining.
     
    The following are some other things I tried....
     
    The memory is 1600 MHz so I also tried a memory frequency of to 2:12 and set Uncore accordingly.  After windows started it said 12 GB insatalled 8.xx (forgot exactly) usable. Did not try any testing at that setting.
     
    I also played with some OC settings trying host frequencies of 178 (from when I had 6 GB) and 176 (mem. freq at 2:8) with other setting above and windows couldn't see all 12 GB.  Also, got a BSD in the first LinX pass at 176.   Tried setting the memory timings to 9 9 9 24 2T.  No help there either.
     
    Hope that's not too confusing.  I would really like to get this thing back to 3.5+ GHz with the 12 GB.

    EVGA X58 Classified (760)
    Bios 83
    Core i7 920 2.66GHz D0 O/C to 3.55GHz
    G.Sill [Ripjaws] F3-128000CL7T-12GBRM (4GBx3)
    Cooler Master V8
    GTX 480 SC
    2 x 500gb SATA in RAID 1 (Intel on board)
    SB XFi XTreme Gammer PCI
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    Windows 7 Ultimate SP1 64-bit
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    HalloweenWeed
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Sunday, November 06, 2011 8:26 PM (permalink)
    Try these things:
    DIMM 1.7V
    tRCD (the second latency) 9
     

    Main (gaming) rig: i7-3930K; Asus Rampage IV Extreme; H100 W/p-p Excaliburs, AS5; MSI 7870 2GD5/OC; Crucial M4 SSD 256GB.
    See my primary ModsRigs: Adam for the rest, and I have a second (wife's) rig Asus Rampage III Extreme & 960: Eve.

       
    Overclocking is useless to me if it is not rock stable.
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    rjohnson11
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Sunday, November 06, 2011 8:37 PM (permalink)
    The ram should be matching as you said but I'd also like you to swap the modules completely around. 1st set in place of where the slots for the 2nd set should be.

    AMD Ryzen 9 7950X,  Corsair Mp700 Pro M.2, 64GB Corsair Dominator Titanium DDR5  X670E Steel Legend, MSI RTX 4090 Associate Code: H5U80QBH6BH0AXF. I am NOT an employee of EVGA

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    BMoffa
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Monday, November 07, 2011 11:57 AM (permalink)
    HalloweenWeed, Is that to get the mem running at 1600 or for the 178 Host freq. OC?  How high is too high on dimm voltage?
     
    And, the mem. is the same stock no. and the same specs but purchased a year and a half apart (different lot numbers). 
     
    Edited.........
    Tried the 1.7 Dimm v. and timing.  With mem freq of 2:12 (1600) Host freq 133.  Windows reporeted 12 GB (5.99 usable).   Will try moving the memory around.   First, I will just put the new stuff in without the old and see if it will handle my old OC.  
     
    It may take a day or two to get back.
    post edited by BMoffa - Monday, November 07, 2011 12:54 AM

    EVGA X58 Classified (760)
    Bios 83
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    G.Sill [Ripjaws] F3-128000CL7T-12GBRM (4GBx3)
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    BMoffa
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Monday, November 07, 2011 1:53 PM (permalink)
    I had a little time to play with the mem. this morning.   I removed to old sticks and put just the new in the red slots.  Booted with my old OC and windows showed 6 GB (3.99) usable.  Went back to the BIOS and up'ed the VTT from +100 to +200.  Got a BSD during windows startup.   I think those sticks are going back.     By the way there was a difference in the ver. beteen the 2 sets the new ones are 3.19A then old ones are 2.??.
     
    I put the old sticks back in and packaged up the new ones.  Just to see if the old sticks could run at 1600MHz, I set the mem. freq. to 2:10 and bumped the host freg back to get the mem. target as close to 1600 as I could without going over.  I think that is 1596.    Running LinX right now (why I can see specifics) and things seem very stable. 

    I may order a 12GB set next and try all this again.   
     
    Which would give better overall performance results 3.55GHz CPU and mem. running 14xx MHz (2:8) or 3.1GHz and mem at 1596MHz (2:10).

    EVGA X58 Classified (760)
    Bios 83
    Core i7 920 2.66GHz D0 O/C to 3.55GHz
    G.Sill [Ripjaws] F3-128000CL7T-12GBRM (4GBx3)
    Cooler Master V8
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    2 x 500gb SATA in RAID 1 (Intel on board)
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    #22
    HalloweenWeed
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Monday, November 07, 2011 2:14 PM (permalink)
    I suggested those settings bc I had to set my mem at 1.7V to get it to run at full speed, but only when my CPU was near full OC. Besides that, OC status irrelevant, I had to set my 9-9-9-24 memory at 9-10-9-24 to get it to run at full 1600 without occasional BSOD about once a week. So I thought maybe if you did the same...
     
    Now you should work on determining whether your prob is caused by CPU or mobo (or RAM). You would need to swap things out to do that. GL.

    Main (gaming) rig: i7-3930K; Asus Rampage IV Extreme; H100 W/p-p Excaliburs, AS5; MSI 7870 2GD5/OC; Crucial M4 SSD 256GB.
    See my primary ModsRigs: Adam for the rest, and I have a second (wife's) rig Asus Rampage III Extreme & 960: Eve.

       
    Overclocking is useless to me if it is not rock stable.
    #23
    sgtharry
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Monday, November 07, 2011 2:17 PM (permalink)
    If you want 12 gigs, always better off buying a 3 stick set of 3X4's. Alot easier on your memory controller.


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    BMoffa
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Monday, November 07, 2011 2:32 PM (permalink)
    Any recommendation on a 12GB 3-Stick set of 1600GHz.  I probably will not try to push the CPU much beyond 3.55 (Host freq 178) because of cooling.

    EVGA X58 Classified (760)
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    G.Sill [Ripjaws] F3-128000CL7T-12GBRM (4GBx3)
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    HalloweenWeed
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Monday, November 07, 2011 3:21 PM (permalink)
    BMoffa

    Any recommendation on a 12GB 3-Stick set of 1600GHz.  I probably will not try to push the CPU much beyond 3.55 (Host freq 178) because of cooling.

    Actually that's 3.74GHz - you figure the Turbo if it is enabled. That's what it would run at when stressing W/LinX/IBT (and I rounded up the 4, Kram will not allow that for the Club, which you wouldn't make anyway at that speed).
    I strongly suggest g.skill. The lower the latency, the better, but don't skimp on any other spec to do so. Also 1.5V might be a little better in a few OC scenarios (it's rare), so again don't skimp on anything else to get the low-V ram. Like sgtharry said, 3x4GB might be slightly better in real-world use.
     
    Also, large heatsinks sometimes get in the way of large air-based CPU coolers. If you might ever get one:
    Ripjaws = OK
    Other tall heatsinks like the sniper: Not so OK.
    If you stick W/the V8 it's an entirely different story, snipers will run cooler and therefore might last a bit longer theoretically.
    post edited by HalloweenWeed - Monday, November 07, 2011 3:26 PM

    Main (gaming) rig: i7-3930K; Asus Rampage IV Extreme; H100 W/p-p Excaliburs, AS5; MSI 7870 2GD5/OC; Crucial M4 SSD 256GB.
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    #26
    BMoffa
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Monday, November 07, 2011 3:27 PM (permalink)

    EVGA X58 Classified (760)
    Bios 83
    Core i7 920 2.66GHz D0 O/C to 3.55GHz
    G.Sill [Ripjaws] F3-128000CL7T-12GBRM (4GBx3)
    Cooler Master V8
    GTX 480 SC
    2 x 500gb SATA in RAID 1 (Intel on board)
    SB XFi XTreme Gammer PCI
    Corsair HX1000W PSU
    Windows 7 Ultimate SP1 64-bit
    #27
    sgtharry
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Monday, November 07, 2011 3:35 PM (permalink)
    It "may" be hard to get them to run with those cas7 timings. That is very tight for 4 gig sticks. Maybe this set if you have your heart set on G-Skill?  http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231406


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    #28
    BMoffa
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Monday, November 07, 2011 3:40 PM (permalink)
    I don't have my heart set on anything but GSKILL was suggested above.  Will take any recommendations.  But remember I'm not going for much above 3.5 because of cooling.

    EVGA X58 Classified (760)
    Bios 83
    Core i7 920 2.66GHz D0 O/C to 3.55GHz
    G.Sill [Ripjaws] F3-128000CL7T-12GBRM (4GBx3)
    Cooler Master V8
    GTX 480 SC
    2 x 500gb SATA in RAID 1 (Intel on board)
    SB XFi XTreme Gammer PCI
    Corsair HX1000W PSU
    Windows 7 Ultimate SP1 64-bit
    #29
    sgtharry
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    Re:Upgrade From 6 GR to 12 Gr Ram, No Joy. Monday, November 07, 2011 3:49 PM (permalink)
    G-Skill is very good memory. I also like Corsair Dominator series, and Mushkin.
    Prices really vary on different companys though.
    Lots of guys in here are running 12 gig sets, I'm sure some of them will chime in here soon to give some idaes for you. I run 6 gigs, so can't really give a definate answer for you.


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