So what's the Deal manufactures switching GTX780's to Elpida memory ?

As title, obviously saving money with an inferior memory chip !
and this would be why we have the "3A" bios.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1408710/cl-evga-gtx-780-classified-gets-overclocked-to-1410-mhz-on-air/640#post_20572431

Ahhhhh, so this is why my memory overclock is worse than my 670 FTW was! I can't go past +250 on memory without my card freaking out, even if I give it more voltage (plus it raises the temperature way too much)
 
Meanwhile, others are all "Oh yeah, 7ghz is easy mode" lol.

Luckily memory OC is not nearly as significant as core.

Afterburner

http://www.overclock.net/t/1408710/cl-evga-gtx-780-classified-gets-overclocked-to-1410-mhz-on-air/640#post_20572431

 
Thanks for that...shame I had to figure it out. This will cause trouble I'm sure as I for one may not have purchased the card if I had known !

Andrew_K

Luckily memory OC is not nearly as significant as core.

It can mean more than you think. In Valley XHD, every 100mhz on the memory is 1fps increase from what I've seen. That said, those running their memory at 7ghz already have a 5fps advantage over what mine can do. Sure, it isn't a lot, but I'm sure in demanding games, a few fps can make a world of difference.
 
Regardless, I still love the card!

Everyone is overreacting on OCN, almost to troll level. The fact of the matter is you will see less memory OC, which really doesn't affect much as far as performance gains in real world scenarios. 
 
Go ahead and sell your classy and buy a lightning... I'm sure it will be worth the hassle so you can get a higher memory OC that achieves.... little to nothing.

I can definitely feel a difference with a decent memory OC. I have always thought more memory bandwidth helped with "smoothness" more so than absolute FPS.
 
It's a little disappointing that they aren't using Samsung. I don't really care so much about max OC I guess, but the most disappointing thing about Elpida is that it doesn't really seem to respond to additional voltage. Extra voltage can often make it more unstable. That takes the tweaking fun out of it, but the cards are still beasts. 

While I agree, better chips would be... better... The 1.5vcore limit on the cards means giving the memory much more voltage over stock would cut into your vcore limit. I'd rather get as much as I can out of the core to push them hard, and take whatever is left over on a small ram oc, personally.

Fail. Elpida is crap. EVGA should be using Hynix if there is no samsung available.

thebski

I can definitely feel a difference with a decent memory OC. I have always thought more memory bandwidth helped with "smoothness" more so than absolute FPS.

 
Have to agree a bit.  Also if you're a benchmark freak 3DMarks 13 Firestrike responds much better to GTX 780s memory OC over core.

MaelstromOC

Andrew_K

Luckily memory OC is not nearly as significant as core.

It can mean more than you think. In Valley XHD, every 100mhz on the memory is 1fps increase from what I've seen.

 
Just curious, did you really type that with a straight face? 

richj44

MaelstromOC

Andrew_K

Luckily memory OC is not nearly as significant as core.

It can mean more than you think. In Valley XHD, every 100mhz on the memory is 1fps increase from what I've seen.

Just curious, did you really type that with a straight face? 

 
I think more like 10 points per 100mhz in heaven at the settings I tested !

richj44

MaelstromOC

Andrew_K

Luckily memory OC is not nearly as significant as core.

It can mean more than you think. In Valley XHD, every 100mhz on the memory is 1fps increase from what I've seen.

Just curious, did you really type that with a straight face? 

Haha, thanks for making me giggle! I do see a 1fps increase with each step, like I said. Clearly I couldn't care less about it when it comes to real world gaming. I'd hardly notice it unless my fps was like 25, moving from 25 to 30 is a noticeable difference for sure, even 50 to 60 is, BUT lol, I was just putting that out there.
 
For anyone that's into benching, the lower ram speeds will surely dishearten them.  For me and gaming? Not that big of a deal at all.

I don't know with the 7xx series memory makes such a small difference.  Now the on my 680 Classy memory overclock was nearly as effective as a core clock bump.
 
That is disappointing though, I was waiting for a 780 Classy Hydro but if they are going to put cheaper parts in them now I might just skip the 7xx series.

MSilvis

I don't know with the 7xx series memory makes such a small difference.  Now the on my 680 Classy memory overclock was nearly as effective as a core clock bump.

That is disappointing though, I was waiting for a 780 Classy Hydro but if they are going to put cheaper parts in them now I might just skip the 7xx series.

It would be good to know actually why they have done this....besides the money saving !

Jacob has posted on OCN that Samsung is out of stock. They have two suppliers in case that happens. It kind of sucks, but doesn't ruin the card or anything. 

Yeah, there's nothing they can do when the supplier runs out of an allotment of chips lol
 

One thing some folks forget as they wrap themselves around an axle... The warranty only covers the clock listed. Anything beyond that is gravy. It's not like anyone will have an earth shattering improved experience gaming on an OC vs warrantied clock...
 
 

Afterburner

One thing some folks forget as they wrap themselves around an axle...

I literally laughed out loud when I read this. 

One thing to keep in mind is Jacob also mentioned that the MSI Lightning and Galaxy HOF will also be sporting the Elpida memory ...
 
http://www.overclock.net/t/1411500/official-evga-classified-owners-club/650#post_20576757

Afterburner

One thing some folks forget as they wrap themselves around an axle... The warranty only covers the clock listed. Anything beyond that is gravy. It's not like anyone will have an earth shattering improved experience gaming on an OC vs warrantied clock...

I assume the Elpida memory has at least been proven to be stable at the Classified Clock speed and have an equal longevity to the Samsung memory i.e. can I expect my card to last just as long as someone with the Samsung memory at listed speed? Yes, I know I have a warranty to cover me, but it is as major hassle having to RMA cards. Given I just bought two of the Classifieds for SLI, I plan on keeping them awhile.
 
It sounds like there is very little overclock tolerance on these chips compared to the Samsungs which means stock speeds may not be as stable as well.

Oh, this is not good.
 
http://www.desktopreview.com/default.asp?newsID=1808&News=Elpida+RAM+Maker+Bankrupt
 
 

I bought mine on hour 1 directly from EVGA.....woot?

Afterburner

One thing some folks forget as they wrap themselves around an axle... The warranty only covers the clock listed. Anything beyond that is gravy. It's not like anyone will have an earth shattering improved experience gaming on an OC vs warrantied clock...

 
I just bought the 10 year warranty, are you telling me I void my expensive warranty I just bought if I overclock my card?

txfeinbergs

Oh, this is not good.

http://www.desktopreview.com/default.asp?newsID=1808&News=Elpida+RAM+Maker+Bankrupt

This is from Wednesday, March 07, 2012 and Wikipedia says "The company is currently in the process of being acquired by Micron Technology after a Tokyo court and Elpida creditors approved the acquisition in February 2013."
 

zenfoldor

Afterburner

One thing some folks forget as they wrap themselves around an axle... The warranty only covers the clock listed. Anything beyond that is gravy. It's not like anyone will have an earth shattering improved experience gaming on an OC vs warrantied clock...

I just bought the 10 year warranty, are you telling me I void my expensive warranty I just bought if I overclock my card?

Overclocking does not void the warranty, they just can't guarantee anything past what the card specs state.

That article was from last year
 

txfeinbergs

Oh, this is not good.

http://www.desktopreview.com/default.asp?newsID=1808&News=Elpida+RAM+Maker+Bankrupt

Hmm, did not notice the 780 only has a mem clock of 6ghz.
So if the Elpida Ram doesnt clock to 7ghz does that mean they dont use it in the 770? What does the 770 use if not Samsung? 

The memory manufacturer has to meet a certain specification required by the purchaser and as long as it meets that spec that is fine, regardless of the end item in which it is installed.

Well, let's just hope Nvidia chips don't get short :D

I was reading this on OCN the other day, my take on it.
It's win win for evga, better memory on the very first cards and people see the crazy bench scores then everyone buys the card only to find out their card isn't up to par?
 
It's kind of like we ran out of turbochargers so only the first 51 corvettes got them, but here's the kicker they don't tell you until you already bought one and you don't find out until you get home and pop the hood.   
  

rjohnson11

The memory manufacturer has to meet a certain specification required by the purchaser and as long as it meets that spec that is fine, regardless of the end item in which it is installed.

 
Elpida still sucks however.
 
Samsung > Hynix >
 
 
 
And not even close third Elpida
 

USFORCES

I was reading this on OCN the other day, my take on it.
It's win win for evga, better memory on the very first cards and people see the crazy bench scores then everyone buys the card only to find out their card isn't up to par?

It's kind of like we ran out of turbochargers so only the first 51 corvettes got them, but here's the kicker they don't tell you until you already bought one and you don't find out until you get home and pop the hood.   
 

 
A person buying a Corvette should be smart enough to pop the hood before driving off the dealer lot to see if its got the snails.  And even during a test drive you can feel the slight throttle lag and the bit of a whirl from a turbo.  This however, you don't even get a chance to check out till you've already made an outright purchase.

USFORCES

I was reading this on OCN the other day, my take on it.
It's win win for evga, better memory on the very first cards and people see the crazy bench scores then everyone buys the card only to find out their card isn't up to par?

It's kind of like we ran out of turbochargers so only the first 51 corvettes got them, but here's the kicker they don't tell you until you already bought one and you don't find out until you get home and pop the hood.   
 

Funny that you chose 51, that's the serial number of my Classified haha (last two digits preceded by quite a few 0's

lol, I'll admit missing the turbo is a little overboard, but if the GPU is the engine what would memory be? Either way I think it's kind of bogus EVGA did this because I like most went by benchmarks before we bought these cards.
They knew how much memory they had before they made the cards, If they ran out of the good Samsung memory like they are saying then they should of waited until more was available, not selling us something else that's sub par!  
Bait-and-switch?

Guys, this isn't the first time that video cards have switched to different memory manufacturers in the middle of production.  Why such an uproar now and no uproar in the past?
 
When the card is sold, the stock speeds are all that is advertised.  Everyone knows that overclocking is not guaranteed.

ty_ger07

Guys, this isn't the first time that video cards have switched to different memory manufacturers in the middle of production.  Why such an uproar now and no uproar in the past?

When the card is sold, the stock speeds are all that is advertised.  Everyone knows that overclocking is not guaranteed.

Err, let me think for 1 second.....That's it, it's down graded, runs hotter etc..
Reviews tell you what you can expect regarding hardware, you know Just as well as me if different options were available for memory very few would pay the same money for the inferior option.

Honestly, I don't really care as long as the card is rock stable at its advertised specs. I don't really overclock and I know EVGA will stand by its warranty (although I am now considering buying the extended warranty). I was just pointing out that Elpida is still officially under bankruptcy protection despite the article I listed being from last year. If Micron acquires them, they should be okay.

ty_ger07

Guys, this isn't the first time that video cards have switched to different memory manufacturers in the middle of production.  Why such an uproar now and no uproar in the past?

When the card is sold, the stock speeds are all that is advertised.  Everyone knows that overclocking is not guaranteed.

 
lol go to OCN and check out the upset people and non purchases because the GPU doesn't come with XX Ram or XX VRM or different pins for power input.
 
 

USFORCES

I was reading this on OCN the other day, my take on it.
It's win win for evga, better memory on the very first cards and people see the crazy bench scores then everyone buys the card only to find out their card isn't up to par?

It's kind of like we ran out of turbochargers so only the first 51 corvettes got them, but here's the kicker they don't tell you until you already bought one and you don't find out until you get home and pop the hood.   
 

BAH! I would have driven the sales guy nuts with multiple trips to the lot looking it over, and over, and over... I would have looked that car over for at least a few weeks before I could wear my wife down to the point of yelling at me to just go buy the damn thing... Bwahahahahahaha. 
 
Anyway, that is not a very good example... Besides, unless you remove the cover can we tell what ram is on it?

Rei86

ty_ger07

Guys, this isn't the first time that video cards have switched to different memory manufacturers in the middle of production.  Why such an uproar now and no uproar in the past?

When the card is sold, the stock speeds are all that is advertised.  Everyone knows that overclocking is not guaranteed.

lol go to OCN and check out the upset people and non purchases because the GPU doesn't come with XX Ram or XX VRM or different pins for power input.

 
Ok, then all you crazies should just stop buying it it bothers you so much.  And if you did already buy it, what can I say?  If you don't like it, then you must suffer the regret.
 
Switching components to different manufacturers is a perfectly fine and legal thing to do as long as the specifications are the same or better.  If you don't like the brand they switched to, tough.  EVGA advertises the stock clocks and does not advertise the component's brands.
 
Basing your purchasing decisions off of any overclocking results -- even a 1MHz overclock -- is a foolish thing to do.  That's your fault.

I was speaking to everyone, not you particularly.
 
Important points:

1. EVGA isn't the only one doing it.
2. This isn't the first time this has happened.
3. There is nothing legally wrong with doing this.
4. There is no false advertising involved because the replacement components are to the same design specifications and no component manufacture was advertised.
5. Using a review's or other user's experience to make a purchasing decision is unwise.  Only stock abilities are advertised and should be your only expectation.

 
This is NOT bait and switch.  The bait is stock performance which never changed.
 
If you want to be mad at someone, you should be mad at the reviews for giving you false expectations.    Better yet, you should be mad at yourself.

Nomanor

ty_ger07 
This is NOT bait and switch.  The bait is stock performance which never changed.

People don't buy Classifieds for stock performance, you ***Removed***    

 

I love when people resort to name calling.
 
Read the thread title.  Does this thread only apply to Classifieds?  Sure Classifieds also apply, but this thread is for "vanilla" cards too.  I could call you a name right now too.    Something about not being able to read.
 
What do you buy Classifieds for?  You buy them because you THINK that they will overclock better?  Only stock clocks are advertised and only stock clocks are guaranteed.    Wise up.   Start thinking for yourself and stop following hype.  Just like any computer component, you could get an overclocking dream or you could get an overclocking dud.   The overclocking dud is just as good as the overclocking dream from a legal standpoint.

Ok folks. Knock it off. Deleted about five posts... A few of you have been here long enough to know better. For the rest of you, read the TOS again. Last and only friendly reminder. Next violation earns you time off from the forums... 
 

• Personal Attacks - Personal attacks often lead to the trading of insults, and can throw the discussion of a legitimate topic off-track.  Personal attacks can be defined as issuing a single or repeated personal attack or attacks aimed at another member, rather than at their opinions or ideas.  Criticizing a member's post is not considered a personal attack, but using terms such as "child," "idiot," "fanboy," for example, or any other derogatory term designed to discredit a member, is not permitted.  Furthermore, comments of a racist or sexist nature, as well as derogatory comments about national origin or sexual orientation, will be dealt with harshly as in a ban from the forums.

 

ty_ger07

I was speaking to everyone, not you particularly.
 
This is NOT bait and switch.  The bait is stock performance which never changed.

If you want to be mad at someone, you should be mad at the reviews for giving you false expectations.    Better yet, you should be mad at yourself.

Yeah it is, when you advertise with something and switch it with something that's inferior its bait and switch.  And when you don't update your pictures and still advertise it with the past item.
 
How about when EVGA decided to say nothing when they had to pull the EVBot from the GTX 680 Classified, left the pictures of Classified with EVBot ports and did not say one word till a owner bought one and had to report it on the forums?
 
Or how about when they downgraded the GTX 670 FTW's PCB and said nothing till owners got their hands on it?
 
But back to topic about the Elpida memory switch, it isn't just EVGA.  Samsung has run dry and its probably because AMD and nVidia is buying them up since they know its the better memory chip out on the market.  And maybe a reason why EVGA isn't using Hynix probably also has to do with AMD buying them up for the up coming R9 series.

Rei86

ty_ger07

I was speaking to everyone, not you particularly.

This is NOT bait and switch.  The bait is stock performance which never changed.

If you want to be mad at someone, you should be mad at the reviews for giving you false expectations.    Better yet, you should be mad at yourself.

Yeah it is, when you advertise with something and switch it with something that's inferior its bait and switch.  And when you don't update your pictures and still advertise it with the past item.

 
But, has EVGA advertised anything about a certain type of memory being used?  If not, it isn't bait and switch.  Reviewer's or consumer's advertisements don't count.
 
I'm not going to discuss your other examples because they don't pertain to this thread.

Bottom line majority of people bought this card for bench testing. I did even though I game more than anything. This is only going to hurt Evga, I can safely say less cards will be sold because of this. I for one wouldn't of bought mine if I had know they did this, I'm half temped to return them now.
But see Evga's got you with there 15% restocking fee! $105...

Elpida is managed by Micron so I think their memory would be fine

rjohnson11

Elpida is managed by Micron so I think their memory would be fine

 
Samsung can handle +400 plus, try that with the Elpida you'll probably need a RMA, lol

Afterburner

BAH! I would have driven the sales guy nuts with multiple trips to the lot looking it over, and over, and over... I would have looked that car over for at least a few weeks before I could wear my wife down to the point of yelling at me to just go buy the damn thing... Bwahahahahahaha. 

Anyway, that is not a very good example... Besides, unless you remove the cover can we tell what ram is on it?

Nice to see someone else use the same strategy with their wife that I do, except I get really depressed for awhile until she finally says to go buy it :)   Honestly, she is pretty cool about the occasional large purchase because I usually am buying her just as nice of stuff for her computer.

USFORCES

rjohnson11

Elpida is managed by Micron so I think their memory would be fine

Samsung can handle +400 plus, try that with the Elpida you'll probably need a RMA, lol

 
Card #2 received 2 days ago using Elpida memory.  Valley run GPU +0  MEM +855  

 

I missed all the name calling, not really necessary. but I'm not quite sure the "defenders" are putting their view very delicately ! we are talking expensive high end parts here and not just a cheap old GFX cards.
People don't generally buy this stuff without an understanding of what it does and what it can do if you push it, everyone realises overclocks are a bonus but we have come to expect that to be reasonable, rightly or wrongly.

pharma57

USFORCES

rjohnson11

Elpida is managed by Micron so I think their memory would be fine

Samsung can handle +400 plus, try that with the Elpida you'll probably need a RMA, lol

Card #2 received 2 days ago using Elpida memory.  Valley run GPU +0  MEM +855  
 

Something very wrong there :D

Perfectly right by me...
 
Memory verified after changing thermal paste yesterday.  Using modded bios and Classified software tool if your not familiar with the PrecisionX settings. 

So my card came with 80.10.36 BIOS and I haven't changed it. Are they the ones using the Samsung memory and the ones using "3A" Elpida memory? Sorry just wanted to know 

Marrv

I missed all the name calling, not really necessary. but I'm not quite sure the "defenders" are putting their view very delicately ! we are talking expensive high end parts here and not just a cheap old GFX cards.
People don't generally buy this stuff without an understanding of what it does and what it can do if you push it, everyone realises overclocks are a bonus but we have come to expect that to be reasonable, rightly or wrongly.

 
I understand but I also disagree.  I would agree if it created a difference to the product specifications.  But this is an un-measurable difference because it affects something outside the product's specifications (overclocking) which was never constant in the first place.  Just because you don't like the brand of memory doesn't mean that the memory is necessarily worse or that EVGA and other manufacturers are ripping off their customers.
 
You should expect the unexpected and expect that one card with Elpida may perform better than a card with Samsung memory and another card with Samsung memory may perform better than a card with Elpida memory.  You are assuming or perceiving a difference which is not measurable because there are too many other variables.  We are talking about overclocking after-all and everyone should know to make no expectations.
 
We don't know that every card with Samsung memory is better than every card with Elpida memory.  Actually, to the opposite, we can very easily prove that is false.  Some cards with Samsung memory will be duds and some cards with Elpida memory will be stay performers.

All I can say is that if you don't like it, don't buy the product.

"So my card came with 80.10.36 BIOS and I haven't changed it. Are they the ones using the Samsung memory and the ones using "3A" Elpida memory? Sorry just wanted to know "
 
It's probably Samsung memory, but eVGA support will be able to confirm.  Mine is '3A' and is Elpida modules.

I have been bad were is my time out.

remenaker

I have been bad were is my time out.

Timeouts are for wimpy parents. You need a beatin!

Out of the all the people I know that overclock your the only one that can go over +250 on the Elpida memory air cool too, I've got two cards with Elpida memory and neither go much over +200.
Strange... 
pharma57 I noticed you just joined OCN right when the 780 classified came out, where were you a member before when it comes to overclocking?

Really not into overclocking before then ... sli'd eVGA 680's before but only became interested after getting a Classified.  I have two cards, one from first batch and the other received last Thursday. 
Edit:  Before I hung at Guru3d with a primary interest in good Drivers for the games I play.