theroc44
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Bunch of people online are saying broadwell-e wont live up to the hype, so i did some research and heres what i came up with. So has-e is 5% slower in instructions per cycle (ipc) than brd-e(based on tick-tock) but the brd-e especially the higher models are running at a 15% lower base clock due to power saving design of the chips. So its a wash there.Another thing the previous released broadwells had something called crystalwell igp,which gave it 128mbs more imbedded dram and that imbedded dram could be used as L4 cache.The extreme edition as we know doesnt have IGP so you lose that right off the bat.So looking at overclocking the original haswell and broadwell releases showed that for example the 4770k and the 5775c OC'ed on average 20-30%. If you extrapolate that to HEDT versions it parallels. Then the broadwell-e will likely match the 40-50% OC range that we see on haswell-e. So if its running at a lower clock its not really that much faster. Lastly the multi-threads(where broadwell-e shines), the haswell k's had 2mbs of L3 per core. The broadwells had 1.5mb per core. In the HEDT version the trend should continue, the broadwell-e is gonna be 6,8,10 core. Then the brd-e and the has-e will both have 20megs of L3 cache and obviously the 10 core 20 threads will win in multi threaded apps. But for gaming you dont need 20 threads.
SO all in all unless your heavy multi-tasking, then the broadwell-e isnt really worth the upgrade. It doesnt seem likely that it will overclock better and the small jump in performance 5% isnt great or worth the upgrade IMO. Not to mention it should still be locked at 40pcie lanes as well just like the higher 5930/5960 haswells. Hope this helps you guys/girls stuck on the fence about Haswell-e now or wait for broadwell-e.
Side-note- The skylake extremes should also be coming , those might be worth the change. I also have to give credit to gamers nexus for alot of this info
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Sajin
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Re: Broadwell-e vs Haswell-e, i did research heres what i came up with
2016/04/30 10:30:05
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10 core would be good for benchmarks. 
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theroc44
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Re: Broadwell-e vs Haswell-e, i did research heres what i came up with
2016/04/30 10:33:45
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Sajin
10 core would be good for benchmarks.
Yeah, have to admit in benchs the broad-e would def improve scores.
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Vlada011
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Re: Broadwell-e vs Haswell-e, i did research heres what i came up with
2016/04/30 12:24:02
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I vote for 6 core with high Frequency/Turbo. Overclocked give same result as 8 core on default and save 500 euro /dollars. Haswell-EX 6 i7-5820K/5930K cores are very good with even higher Smart Catch than 4820K 10MB/ 4930K12MB, same as 4960X-15MB We will see what will happen with Broadwell-EX, if everything stay on 15MB Cache, higher frequency that better customers to save money for six channel and Gen 3 PCH with Skylake-EX. You need to have a lot of money to have everything best. People invest 1000$ and now even 10 cores will show up. Somehow 6 Cores with K are some middle, offer all advantages of Extreme platform, good in multi thread application, overclocked excellent and in single threaded applications, in many cases even as 8 cores. Gamers in 80% situation will have only lower clock and unused 2-4 cores with more than Six cores. Even if you want to overclock and catch single threaded performance you need really serious watercooling. With 6 core some new AIO finish job on 4.2-4.3GHz.
post edited by Vlada011 - 2016/04/30 12:30:55
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bcavnaugh
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Re: Broadwell-e vs Haswell-e, i did research heres what i came up with
2016/04/30 13:15:59
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A Great CPU for Crunchers and Folders.
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theroc44
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Re: Broadwell-e vs Haswell-e, i did research heres what i came up with
2016/04/30 17:16:11
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bcavnaugh
A Great CPU for Crunchers and Folders.
Yeah it def will rock pumping 20 threads.
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gridironcpj
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Re: Broadwell-e vs Haswell-e, i did research heres what i came up with
2016/04/30 21:28:58
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I'm still on ol' Sandy Bridge E, so I might just upgrade to Broadwell E since Skylake E is probably another year away at least. It's sort of an annoying pickle to be in. 2017 looks like it'll be a great year for PC hardware. Skylake E, big Pascal, most likely 4K 120Hz with DP1.3, etc.
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ypsylon
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Re: Broadwell-e vs Haswell-e, i did research heres what i came up with
2016/04/30 22:12:11
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bcavnaugh
A Great CPU for Crunchers and Folders.
^ This exactly. Comparing my 1366 at crunching and 2011 it's no contest. On most complex tasks it takes up to 70% more time on old CPU when compared to H-E. But that's about the only area where it really, really shows.
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gridironcpj
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Re: Broadwell-e vs Haswell-e, i did research heres what i came up with
2016/05/01 00:02:19
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ypsylon
bcavnaugh
A Great CPU for Crunchers and Folders.
^ This exactly.
Comparing my 1366 at crunching and 2011 it's no contest. On most complex tasks it takes up to 70% more time on old CPU when compared to H-E. But that's about the only area where it really, really shows.
There are actually a few games out there that benefit significantly from more cores and higher clock speeds.. Here's an old example: http://www.techspot.com/r...performance/page6.html
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ValkyrieStar
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Re: Broadwell-e vs Haswell-e, i did research heres what i came up with
2016/05/01 02:10:14
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i7-6900K
Cores/Threads: 8/16
Frequency 3.2GHz / 3.7GHz
Total Cache: 20MB
Memory Speed: 2400MHz
TDP: 140W
i7-6850K
Cores/Threads: 6/12
Frequency 3.6GHz / 3.8GHz
Total Cache: 15MB
Memory Speed: 2400MHz
TDP: 140W
i7-6800K
Cores/Threads: 6/12
Frequency 3.4GHz / 3.6GHz
Total Cache: 15MB
Memory Speed: 2400MHz
TDP: 140W
Base clocks and turbos are actually higher.
Caches are the same.
Memory controller rated higher at stock, hopefully 3200MHz memory will become more commonplace on X99.
Theres also a 10c 20t model, 25MB cache, 3.0 base 3.5 turbo.
So, id expect these to perform 5% better clock per clock, but as the clocks are increased too, id expect more like a 10-15% jump at stock.
Overclocking will be interesting, we've seen broadwell and skylake need high (1.4v+) voltages to push into the high frequencies.
As we know desktop broadwell sucked a lot with overclocking, partly because of the high voltages their 14nm node likes for the high frequencies.
The FIVR in desktop chips was not designed for high power applications, it was designed for mobile computing to increase the battery life of laptops. The FIVR in broadwell didnt scale up well to overclocking as well as haswells.
As a bit of an assumption, 9 months on we should be getting a much better built chip with good overclocking like skylake.
Broadwell desktop was kinda just "stuck in there at the end" to please those who really wanted it.
Haswell-E was slightly rushed out, with DDR4 and all that being new and quite a lot of bugs at first.
Expect to see a few refreshed X99 boards for the new broadwell e chips.
 
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bcavnaugh
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Re: Broadwell-e vs Haswell-e, i did research heres what i came up with
2016/05/01 09:35:54
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gridironcpj
ypsylon
bcavnaugh
A Great CPU for Crunchers and Folders.
^ This exactly.
Comparing my 1366 at crunching and 2011 it's no contest. On most complex tasks it takes up to 70% more time on old CPU when compared to H-E. But that's about the only area where it really, really shows.
There are actually a few games out there that benefit significantly from more cores and higher clock speeds.. Here's an old example:
http://www.techspot.com/r...performance/page6.html
The Core i7-3960X and Core i7-3770K CPUs are old and the newer CPUs are much faster at the CORE level. So the test above is really Three Generations behind so it is really no longer valid and is 4 years old now. The i7-3960X is now a i7-5960X http://ark.intel.com/compare/63696,82930 The i7-3770K is now a i7-6700K or i7-4790K http://ark.intel.com/compare/80807,88195,65523
post edited by bcavnaugh - 2016/05/01 09:44:37
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rludwic
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Re: Broadwell-e vs Haswell-e, i did research heres what i came up with
2016/05/01 13:10:33
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Valkyrie, that's just not 100% true. I have a lottery winner that pushes 4.8 @ 1.24 vcore. After winning the lottery, I have no intention of gambling again on it. This is my first STELLAR CPU since I started building about 15 years ago. Also with what I do, 2 more cores aren't going to do me much good anyways, possibly Pascal may change the game but a CPU upgrade isn't going to do it. I also read somewhere (no BS) yesterday, the very top of the line 10 core is going to be priced somewhere close to $2500. That's just plain insane. Most people thought I was nuts for spending a grand. I can see the commitment papers being all filled out if I were to blow that much cash on a CPU.
Rig#1 Fractal Define S 5960x @4.4 Custom Water Cooling Loop Asus Deluxe 2 x99 m/b 32 gigs GSkill 2666 1 EVGA 1080Ti Hydro Copper 1 Intel 750- 400Gig NVMe SSD 1 Samsung 950 Pro (500 gig) 1 Sammy 850-1TB SSD ( My Files and downloaded (SW library) 1Sammy 850-500Gig (Extra Games) 1 WD Black SATA 3 2 TB backup HDD EVGA 1050 watt SuperNova G Acer XB270HU monitor Firestrike Extreme score 16847 http://www.3dmark.com/fs/6075261https://www.heatware.com/eval.php?id=71122 Rig #2 HAF 932 EVGA X58 Classified 980x @4.5 Ghz 12 gigs Patriot Viper Sector 7's 2
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ValkyrieStar
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Re: Broadwell-e vs Haswell-e, i did research heres what i came up with
2016/05/01 13:22:21
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rludwic
Valkyrie, that's just not 100% true. I have a lottery winner that pushes 4.8 @ 1.24 vcore. After winning the lottery, I have no intention of gambling again on it. This is my first STELLAR CPU since I started building about 15 years ago. Also with what I do, 2 more cores aren't going to do me much good anyways, possibly Pascal may change the game but a CPU upgrade isn't going to do it. I also read somewhere (no BS) yesterday, the very top of the line 10 core is going to be priced somewhere close to $2500. That's just plain insane. Most people thought I was nuts for spending a grand. I can see the commitment papers being all filled out if I were to blow that much cash on a CPU.
i7-5775C? Someone i know managed 5GHz on air with HT off at 1.45v. For 95% of overclockers, theyre going to find it will need a lot of voltage to reach My 4790K managed 4.8 @ 1.325v, yet i can push mine up to 5ghz @ 1.625v and successfully bench on FireStrike & Cinebench without throttling (on a 240 + 360 rad with all fans maxed out). My friends 4790K manages 4.8 @ 1.225v, yet theirs wont go above 4.8 at any voltage, same mobo. Its mainly luck on the silicon lottery as to how a chip overclocks. My 5820K manages 4.6GHz at 1.3v but thats way too hot when rendering. I just keep it 4.0 @ 1.075v, even then it gets to 65-70c. I just got a hot chip. The Pre-Orders for the 10c cpu are 2500 usd yes, but thags the preorders, retail price is expected around 1500, and 1000 for the 8c.
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gridironcpj
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Re: Broadwell-e vs Haswell-e, i did research heres what i came up with
2016/05/01 22:54:45
(permalink)
bcavnaugh
gridironcpj
ypsylon
bcavnaugh
A Great CPU for Crunchers and Folders.
^ This exactly.
Comparing my 1366 at crunching and 2011 it's no contest. On most complex tasks it takes up to 70% more time on old CPU when compared to H-E. But that's about the only area where it really, really shows.
There are actually a few games out there that benefit significantly from more cores and higher clock speeds.. Here's an old example:
http://www.techspot.com/r...performance/page6.html
The Core i7-3960X and Core i7-3770K CPUs are old and the newer CPUs are much faster at the CORE level.
So the test above is really Three Generations behind so it is really no longer valid and is 4 years old now.
The i7-3960X is now a i7-5960X http://ark.intel.com/compare/63696,82930
The i7-3770K is now a i7-6700K or i7-4790K http://ark.intel.com/compare/80807,88195,65523
Yeah, it's old. I'm not going to deny that. I'd like to see a similar performance review for the upcoming Borderlands 3 and see if it's as CPU-bound as Borderlands 2 was. I'm sure there are a few modern games that may benefit from more cores and/or higher clock speeds. Unfortunately, CPU gaming performance reviews are rare. If they're conducted, it's for trivial games such as Bioshock Infinite or Tomb Raider, in which it's obvious those games aren't CPU bound.
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ValkyrieStar
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Re: Broadwell-e vs Haswell-e, i did research heres what i came up with
2016/05/02 01:25:18
(permalink)
gridironcpj
bcavnaugh
gridironcpj
ypsylon
bcavnaugh
A Great CPU for Crunchers and Folders.
^ This exactly.
Comparing my 1366 at crunching and 2011 it's no contest. On most complex tasks it takes up to 70% more time on old CPU when compared to H-E. But that's about the only area where it really, really shows.
There are actually a few games out there that benefit significantly from more cores and higher clock speeds.. Here's an old example:
http://www.techspot.com/r...performance/page6.html
The Core i7-3960X and Core i7-3770K CPUs are old and the newer CPUs are much faster at the CORE level.
So the test above is really Three Generations behind so it is really no longer valid and is 4 years old now.
The i7-3960X is now a i7-5960X http://ark.intel.com/compare/63696,82930
The i7-3770K is now a i7-6700K or i7-4790K http://ark.intel.com/compare/80807,88195,65523
Yeah, it's old. I'm not going to deny that. I'd like to see a similar performance review for the upcoming Borderlands 3 and see if it's as CPU-bound as Borderlands 2 was. I'm sure there are a few modern games that may benefit from more cores and/or higher clock speeds. Unfortunately, CPU gaming performance reviews are rare. If they're conducted, it's for trivial games such as Bioshock Infinite or Tomb Raider, in which it's obvious those games aren't CPU bound.
If borderlands 3 is anything like battleborn, it will be more gpu limited. I got serious frame drops in B2 but gpu usage was barely tickling 30% at times. Wherr BB sits at a constant 100% on the gpu. B2 is DX9 - much more cpu bound BB is DX11 - less cpu bound If B3 jumps to DX12 then we'll see pretty much the best performance on all combinations of hardware except those with very weak machines.
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gridironcpj
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Re: Broadwell-e vs Haswell-e, i did research heres what i came up with
2016/05/02 18:28:14
(permalink)
ValkyrieStar
gridironcpj
bcavnaugh
gridironcpj
ypsylon
bcavnaugh
A Great CPU for Crunchers and Folders.
^ This exactly.
Comparing my 1366 at crunching and 2011 it's no contest. On most complex tasks it takes up to 70% more time on old CPU when compared to H-E. But that's about the only area where it really, really shows.
There are actually a few games out there that benefit significantly from more cores and higher clock speeds.. Here's an old example:
http://www.techspot.com/r...performance/page6.html
The Core i7-3960X and Core i7-3770K CPUs are old and the newer CPUs are much faster at the CORE level.
So the test above is really Three Generations behind so it is really no longer valid and is 4 years old now.
The i7-3960X is now a i7-5960X http://ark.intel.com/compare/63696,82930
The i7-3770K is now a i7-6700K or i7-4790K http://ark.intel.com/compare/80807,88195,65523
Yeah, it's old. I'm not going to deny that. I'd like to see a similar performance review for the upcoming Borderlands 3 and see if it's as CPU-bound as Borderlands 2 was. I'm sure there are a few modern games that may benefit from more cores and/or higher clock speeds. Unfortunately, CPU gaming performance reviews are rare. If they're conducted, it's for trivial games such as Bioshock Infinite or Tomb Raider, in which it's obvious those games aren't CPU bound.
If borderlands 3 is anything like battleborn, it will be more gpu limited. I got serious frame drops in B2 but gpu usage was barely tickling 30% at times. Wherr BB sits at a constant 100% on the gpu.
B2 is DX9 - much more cpu bound
BB is DX11 - less cpu bound
If B3 jumps to DX12 then we'll see pretty much the best performance on all combinations of hardware except those with very weak machines.
I'm hoping DX12 implementation will be much better by the time Borderlands 3 releases (along with multi-GPU support so we can ditch SLI). Yes, I remember that terrible GPU usage with Borderlands 2. The poor GPU usage even scaled itself so that you get the same FPS regardless of GPU. I went from 2 Titans (originals) to 2 980 Ti's and I was getting the same FPS, just lower GPU usage on the 980 Ti's. Needless to say, I wasn't even hitting 60FPS in some instances. Talk about absurd.
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V84x4
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Re: Broadwell-e vs Haswell-e, i did research heres what i came up with
2016/05/02 19:09:23
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Just upgraded to X99 platform I pulled the trigger on a 5820k and a new Micro 2 mb and I can tell you (IMO) I made the best choice I knew about the new Broadwell and read the specs and decided I wouldn't wait so I went Haswell and couldn't be happier $319 at microcenter and GSKILL TridentZ 3200 running 4.2 mhz and ram at 3200 XMP Stable in firestrike http://www.3dmark.com/fs/8245080 Good luck Regards, Rick
Computer Specs:Lilan Li 011D Bitspower DISTRO, MSI 570 Carbon Pro MB, AMD 3900X @ 3.8ghz, Bitspower Water Loop, TRIDENT Z 64GB (4x16GB) DDR4 3200, evga 2080 Super, EK waterblock 980 PRO M.2 1TB ,evga 1000w G3 psu, LG GSYNC 4KK Curved 32 inch, Windows 10 64bit  
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transdogmifier
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Re: Broadwell-e vs Haswell-e, i did research heres what i came up with
2016/05/03 04:33:25
(permalink)
I'm fine with my 5930k, I can't see upgrading anytime soon...does everything without batting an eyelash...
AMD Ryzen 7900x3d Deepcool LT720 Gigabyte Aorus Elite AX X670 (Might change..don't like this board) eVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 Ultra Gaming (Hybrid kit on it) Asus ROG Swift PG43UQ 4k Monitor eVGA 1600W Supernova T2 PSU 32GB Kingston 6000 DDR5 (2x16GB) Fury Corsair MP600 Pro 2TB (Boot) Corsair MP600 2TB (Games/Data) Phanteks P500A Case
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V84x4
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Re: Broadwell-e vs Haswell-e, i did research heres what i came up with
2016/05/10 15:57:45
(permalink)
See bench marks here http://www.overclock.net/t/1599068/6850k-vs-5820k#post_25123355NOT WORTH THE PRICE JUMP..............$150 more Plus 5820 has lower CAS (Lower CAS = more bandwidth Right ? ) Why pay more for less (you'll never see the difference unless you bench mark) And who the hell cares about Bench Marks anymore Everything is so fast now I'm playing the same games on both a Skylake and my new 5820K (BF4, COD & Titanfall) both running 980 ti classified's (1480) and both 950 pro M.2 I can tell you FROM PERSONAL EXPERIENCE there's no difference in game what so ever you will not see any difference in game from, haswell to broadwell to skylake Im not saying not to stay up with the times and buy the latest and greatest Im saying save a buck and spend your money where it counts on a GSYNC 2K ROG 144 hrtz Monitor your games will pop like you've never seen before.......HUGE Differance !!!! if you have never played on 144hzt with GSYNC ............OMG hold on to your face Processor prices will drop over the next couple years and sure enough a new line of processors will be available then Right now and over the next few years NO games need anything over 6 gb GPU ram or 3.0 gig CPU Again............My opinion...............Don't waste your money Best Regards Rick
post edited by V84x4 - 2016/05/10 16:00:44
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ValkyrieStar
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Re: Broadwell-e vs Haswell-e, i did research heres what i came up with
2016/05/10 16:45:57
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V84x4
See bench marks here
http://www.overclock.net/t/1599068/6850k-vs-5820k#post_25123355
NOT WORTH THE PRICE JUMP..............$150 more
Plus 5820 has lower CAS (Lower CAS = more bandwidth Right ? )
Why pay more for less (you'll never see the difference unless you bench mark)
And who the hell cares about Bench Marks anymore
Everything is so fast now
I'm playing the same games on both a Skylake and my new 5820K (BF4, COD & Titanfall)
both running 980 ti classified's (1480) and both 950 pro M.2
I can tell you FROM PERSONAL EXPERIENCE there's no difference in game what so ever
you will not see any difference in game from, haswell to broadwell to skylake
Im not saying not to stay up with the times and buy the latest and greatest
Im saying save a buck and spend your money where it counts
on a GSYNC 2K ROG 144 hrtz Monitor
your games will pop like you've never seen before.......HUGE Differance !!!!
if you have never played on 144hzt with GSYNC ............OMG hold on to your face
Processor prices will drop over the next couple years and sure enough a new line of processors will be available then
Right now and over the next few years NO games need anything over 6 gb GPU ram or 3.0 gig CPU
Again............My opinion...............Don't waste your money
Best Regards Rick
Lower cas doesnt mean higher bandwidth, afaik it is the number of cycles to do something, cant remember what, it helps primarily towards better access times. Higher frequency gives higher bandwidth. Also, cas is almost unrelated to CPU. Generally the CPU can either run memory st X frequency or not. And at any given working frequency, lowest cas latency is defined by whatever the memory itself can run. With dx12 the overall power of the cpu will be more relevant than pure single threaded speed. Also in the world of gaming. Nothing above an i5 is going to give any major benefit. Heck even a high clock i3 does brilliant. If your using X99 you either need it for the cores, or you need it for the pcie lanes of multi gpu. Or both. I use mine to render things for friends. An overnight job for me would be a 72h job for some of my friends with their i3s and other non beefy chips.
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V84x4
iCX Member
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Re: Broadwell-e vs Haswell-e, i did research heres what i came up with
2016/05/10 17:46:42
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Thanks again As always.............. I learn so much from you..............your sooooo knowledgeable you and Scarlet-Tech have helped me learn soooo much I use my 5820K for music scoring and video editing in sony vagas and see a huge difference I also game on it but see no difference between my SKYLAKE and the 5820K in games Regards, Rick
post edited by V84x4 - 2016/05/10 20:54:42
Computer Specs:Lilan Li 011D Bitspower DISTRO, MSI 570 Carbon Pro MB, AMD 3900X @ 3.8ghz, Bitspower Water Loop, TRIDENT Z 64GB (4x16GB) DDR4 3200, evga 2080 Super, EK waterblock 980 PRO M.2 1TB ,evga 1000w G3 psu, LG GSYNC 4KK Curved 32 inch, Windows 10 64bit
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ValkyrieStar
Superclocked Member
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Re: Broadwell-e vs Haswell-e, i did research heres what i came up with
2016/05/10 21:35:31
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V84x4
Thanks again
As always.............. I learn so much from you..............your sooooo knowledgeable
you and Scarlet-Tech have helped me learn soooo much
I use my 5820K for music scoring and video editing in sony vagas and see a huge difference
I also game on it but see no difference between my SKYLAKE and the 5820K in games
Regards, Rick
I agree, for gaming it is pointless, originally i upgraded from a 4790K to 6700K, asus maximus gene viii. When id set it up, did the auto oc feature, and it put it at 5.0ghz, 1.5v on the core, frightened the willies out of me! Was actually stable and touching 95c under water. However the performance increase for rendering etc was 10% ish if that coming from a 4.8GHz 4790K. I ended up selling the 6700K as a tested 5Ghz stable chip on ebay and got close to double what i paid for it. Used that money to splash out and get a 5820K + motherboard. Even at 4.0ghz im getting a 30-35% increase, if i'm away i'll set it to my 4.4ghz profile and its pulling closer to 45% increase, now that's more interesting. Over the next year or so i'll probably pick up a 6900K or something. If i already had a 5960X i wouldnt bother, but since i dont have it, might aswell get the broadwell e version down the line and enjoy lower power and slightly better performance at same clock + 2 cores over my 5820K. That's if i dont go AMD that is. Depends whats out.
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