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Helpful Reply1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures

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mmuna
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2017/02/20 04:20:36 (permalink)
Hello Everyone,
After install the Hybrid Cooler on my SLI of 1080 FTW, the temperatures changed as follows:
Top GPU: 53 load; (33 idle)
Bottom GPU: 58 load; (38 idle)
 
Before install the Hybrid Kit:
Top GPU: 82 load; (50 idle)
Bottom GPU: 72 load; (48 idle)
 
As you can see, before the installation, the top card always run 8-10 ºC hotter than the bottom card (under load). Now, after the installation the bottom card always run 5º C hotter than the top card (idle and under load). I double checked it.
 
I didn't inverted the cards to test yet.
The load temperatures were tested using 10 minutes of Unigine Heaven.
As the temperature gap is always 5º C, even at idle, I don't think it could be the radiators location.
 
Do you think is it normal the bottom cards gets hotther? Is it worth to disassenbly the cards and change the thermal paste? (I used the pre-installed thermal paste).
 
Thanks in advance for your help,
Cheers!
 
-------------------------------------------
Update on 02/21/2017
-------------------------------------------
New radiators position setup and new tests done. I added the new image at the initial post.
Ambient temperature: about 31 ºC
Run 10 minutes of Unigine Valley.
I got the numbers using the Precision software.
 
Top GPU:
49 ºC (32 idle)
Voltage: 1.000 V (0.625 idle)
 
Bottom GPU:
54 ºC (35 idle)
Voltage: 1.063 V (0.625 idle)
Power: always 3% - 7% higher than the Top GPU during load
 
The 5ºC gap remains the same. Could be the Voltage?
Although this fan configuration seems strange, it is very efficient and the internal components of the case look very cool.
On the Hybrid Kits, I touched the tubes and radiators during the tests, and they get extremely hot. Much more than the CPU AIO. It seems to be a good idea to use them as exhaust fans and prevent the tubes from getting too close to each other.
Now I don't know if worth it the disassembly process, in order to change the thermal paste. Any ideas?
Cheers!
 
post edited by mmuna - 2017/02/21 07:18:26

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#1
the_Scarlet_one
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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/20 04:38:50 (permalink)
I would definitely disassemble and change the tmermal paste, just to make sure it gets good coverage. I would think both cards would run abkut the same under hybrid coolers, especially if the coolers are both exhausting.

You picture isnt showing right now, just ahows a broken image link. Your picture is set to private on google, so only people that know you may be able to view it. Set your image to public, or use imgur to upload a picture.
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mmuna
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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/20 04:54:43 (permalink)
Scarlet-Tech
I would definitely disassemble and change the tmermal paste, just to make sure it gets good coverage. I would think both cards would run abkut the same under hybrid coolers, especially if the coolers are both exhausting.

You picture isnt showing right now, just ahows a broken image link. Your picture is set to private on google, so only people that know you may be able to view it. Set your image to public, or use imgur to upload a picture.



Are you able to see the picture now?
 
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the_Scarlet_one
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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/20 05:06:46 (permalink)
No, this is all that shows when following your link:


403. That’s an error.

Your client does not have permission to get URL /tlNAuBN_69tOtnaIv5kuXVZdKsYAX2Yhh0ye2ZQBvjN_OKFmO8bwLkBQ-T74GDNSkrrJT4ybw5SXNrM=w1440-h770-rw from this server. (Client IP address: 2600:1017:b825:4d92:20e3:506e:b666:5f38)

Forbidden That’s all we know.
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mmuna
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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/20 05:12:38 (permalink)
 
Ok, sorry about that.
Image attached now.
 
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the_Scarlet_one
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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/20 05:18:27 (permalink)
Beautiful system.

One suggestion, turn the bottom fans over. You want them to pull more air in, as you have negative pressure right now. The 3 front fans are pulling in, the top 3, back, and bottom two are pushing out.

Also, try moving the bottom radiator up to one of the higher fans to get the air out of the pump. You may have an air bubble in the right now that is causing the slightly higher temps.
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mmuna
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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/20 05:23:48 (permalink)
Thanks for your reply!
I have tried to to install the radiator on the fan at the front top, and invert the bottom as intake. No difference on GPUs temperatures at all, but the CPU rad get much hotter.
 
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the_Scarlet_one
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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/20 05:26:27 (permalink)
Your cpu definitely should not get hotter when given more cold air.

For the gpu, you could try changing the thermal paste, if you have some spare.
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X-TAC
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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/20 05:36:15 (permalink)
Before you start stripping the cards down, you might want to experiment with the fan/radiator placements.  It is possible there is a mild contact problem, but your load temps are only slightly high and more importantly the idle/load delta is the same between the two cards.  The odds on creating a perfectly replicated contact problem on both cards is low.  
 
In fact, a 20C delta isn't bad all.  However, your idle temps on both are high, unless you are in midst of Summer in warm room.  My 120 radiator kit is mounted in the rear exhaust and like you the CPU radiator is set as top exhaust.  The GPU idle temp is lowest in the system, sitting right at room temperature.  What kind of room and case temperatures do you have?
 
With the lower #2 GPU using intake air from the front, I would expect it to be cooler under load, however since it is both warmer at idle and load, I wonder if there is a different issue.  Can you compare the two voltages on your cards (idle and load)?  The two Asus 980's I recently removed were quite different.  One original ran at the standard 1.20v for that model, but the thrice RMA'd card only needed 1.06v to make its mark.  It was always cooler than 1.20v, no matter the position.
 
In the front panel, highest slot, the GPU radiator will dump waste heat into the CPU radiator.  That is likely the reason for the higher CPU temps.
post edited by X-TAC - 2017/02/20 08:10:40
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ksgnow2010
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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/20 05:47:59 (permalink)
Your lower GPU radiator is in the front of the case...using cooler intake air through the radiator.
 
The upper GPU radiator is in the back of the case...using warmer case internal air through the radiator.
 
Before you reapplying thermal paste, move the upper GPU radiator to be intake as well. 
 
It looks like you have a Corsair Air 740 case.  Turn the bottom radiator so that the hoses come out of the side (facing the window) instead of the bottom.  When you move the upper GPU radiator to the front, have the hoses facing the same way.  You'll be able to set them side-by-side.
 
I have the same case.  I run two 1080 hybrid kits modded onto my Titan XP cards, and also run a Corsair H80i v2 to cool my overclocked 5820K.  I have all 3 radiators as intake, with push/pull fan setup.  The GPUs stay below 50 C, and the CPU stays below 65 C.  The H80i v2 actually cools my CPU better than the H110i GTX I had (280 mm radiator.)
post edited by ksgnow2010 - 2017/02/20 05:50:05
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mmuna
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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/20 05:52:19 (permalink)
Thanks for your reply!
Yes, it is Summer and my room is pretty warm (about 33ºC). That is the reason i changed to the Hybrid solution.
Definitely I will invert the cards and check the voltages before the disassembly process. I will post here the results. Thanks for the tips!
Just for note, I updated the BIOS containing the new fan curve (thermalmod) and currently it is setted to the SLAVE bios.
 
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X-TAC
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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/20 08:09:25 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby mmuna 2017/02/21 07:33:39
OK, good.  Stop moving stuff around and you don't need to strip the coolers down.  You can't lower coolant temp below room temperature so you are as low as you can get.  When the weather turns, you will have temps like every one else.  You didn't specify what you ran for load, but a 20C delta is quite good and better than my gaming delta with moderate fan speed.  I am going to guess those ML120's were really turning at pace for that.  You shouldn't need to blast them at 2000+ RPM, but finding a noise/performance sweet spot can take some tinkering.   
 
I actually like your initial set-up.  The bottom fans help take the front GPU radiator waste heat directly out of the case.  The CPU and rear GPU radiators do the same.  That should give you really nice internal ambient temps, although you will be limited by the same environmental restraints and your motherboard temp is probably also 30-32C.  It's hard to steal air from the fan on the GPU, but running the bottom fans at 2400 rpm might come pretty close.  You can keep those on a slow turn and they will do just fine.  I am in the same case with similar hardware and was wondering how it would look with all ML's.  Really nice job.
 
So all we have left is a 5C difference between cards.  If there is a standard voltage difference, that would tie everything off.
post edited by X-TAC - 2017/02/20 08:43:10
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bcavnaugh
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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/20 08:30:09 (permalink)
 
I would move the Front Radiator Up 1.
This way your Bottom Front Fan will pull in cool fresh air into the Blowers on the GPUs.
Between the two GPUs is where you need it the most to cool the VRM and even the PCB.
This also puts the Bottom of the Radiator above the GPU as Recommend.

post edited by bcavnaugh - 2017/02/20 08:48:40

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X-TAC
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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/20 08:42:37 (permalink)
Perhaps, but you don't need a lot of air on the hybrid models.  The GPU fan is cooling the VRM and memory modules and he hasn't mentioned an issue with those.  It won't have any effect on the diode temperature cited above.  Either way, the on board GPU fan is displacing the air around those board components.  Moving that air out, rather than the actual temperature of the replacement air, is what makes it effective.   
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mmuna
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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/20 08:44:15 (permalink)
Thanks!
But on the FTW Hybrid Kit, the fan on the cards exhausts hot air. It is not the same type as on the non FTW kit.
 
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mmuna
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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/20 08:45:29 (permalink)
X-TAC
OK, good.  Stop moving stuff around and you don't need to strip the coolers down.  You can't lower coolant temp below room temperature so you are as low as you can get.  When the weather turns, you will have temps like every one else.  You didn't specify what you ran for load, but a 20C delta is quite good and better than my gaming delta with moderate fan speed.  I am going to guess those ML120's were really turning at pace for that.  You shouldn't need to blast them at 2000+ RPM, but finding a noise/performance sweet spot can take some tinkering.   
 
I actually like your initial set-up.  The bottom fans help take the front GPU radiator waste heat directly out of the case.  The CPU and rear GPU radiators do the same.  That should give you really nice internal ambient temps, although you will be limited by the same environmental restraints and your motherboard temp is probably also 30-32C.  It's hard to steal air from the fan on the GPU, but running the bottom fans at 2400 rpm might come pretty close.  You can keep those on a slow turn and they will do just fine.  I am in the same case with similar hardware and was wondering how it would look with all ML's.  Really nice job.
 
So all we have left is a 5C difference between cards.  If there is a standard voltage difference, that would tie everything off.




You are right about your comments. You got my ideas about the air flow.
The MLs are really nice, I use the Commander Mini in order to configure them.
I run the tests using the following configuration:
 
CPU (H100i) (60% speed) about 1450 rpm (2x ML120 top exhaust)
GPUS (65% speed) about 1600 rpm (1x ML120 rear exhaust, 1x ML120 front intake)
Front (50% speed) about 1200 rpm each (2x ML120 front intake)
Bottom (40% speed) abount 900 rpm each (2x ML120 bottom exhaust)
 
This is a good compromise between the noise and the thermals, but I need to fine tune better these number, now that I have the setup done.
Rise the fans more that that doesn't affect the thermals much.
The load temperatures were tested using 10 minutes of Unigine Heaven.
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bcavnaugh
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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/20 08:50:09 (permalink)
X-TAC
Perhaps, but you don't need a lot of air on the hybrid models.  The GPU fan is cooling the VRM and memory modules and he hasn't mentioned an issue with those.  It won't have any effect on the diode temperature cited above.  Either way, the on board GPU fan is displacing the air around those board components.  Moving that air out, rather than the actual temperature of the replacement air, is what makes it effective.   


The (memory modules) are cooled mostly by the Radiator not the Blower Fan on the FTW Hybrid Cooler.
 

Also the Blower Coolers Exhausts Hot Air out the Rear of the Case unlike the ACX Coolers.
post edited by bcavnaugh - 2017/02/20 08:58:38

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X-TAC
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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/20 09:02:41 (permalink)
 
OK, good.  If you have the copper plate conducting heat back to the cold plate then that is one less thing to worry about with the blower fan.
 
I think your coolant delta at 20C is excellent.  I may have to try a ML120 up there and I do like the ML140 on my CPU 280mm radiator.  For comparison, I have been using a Noctua NF-F12 industrial 2000 at about 1500 and my GPU delta is about 25-28C while playing a heavy AAA game in 4K.  I suppose I should run Heaven for a more accurate comparison, but that is promising.  I imagine your are also at that resolution, but perhaps the SLI set-up shares the load better than a single card and that accounts for the better coolant delta.
post edited by X-TAC - 2017/02/20 09:37:43
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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/20 09:05:57 (permalink)
Nice looking Rig mmuna
 
My basic airflow test --> if you see the temps decrease with the side cover to the PC Case removed, there is room for improved airflow.
 
I also agree that you should look at the voltage and see if the warmer card has a reason to be warmer.

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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/20 09:32:02 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby mmuna 2017/02/22 17:50:27
For another test you can connect your Graphics Video Cable to the second card as well.
You can do this with the Power on to allow the NVIDIA Control Panel/Driver know.
Then the Bottom Card will become the Primary and the Top Card will become the Secondary.
Some Games that do not really support SLI your second card will just sit their doing nothing.
post edited by bcavnaugh - 2017/02/20 09:36:14

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mmuna
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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/21 04:09:31 (permalink)
New radiators position setup and new tests done. I added the new image at the initial post.
Ambient temperature: about 31 ºC
Run 10 minutes of Unigine Valley.
I got the numbers using the Precision software.
 
Top GPU:
49 ºC (32 idle)
Voltage: 1.000 V (0.625 idle)
 
Bottom GPU:
54 ºC (35 idle)
Voltage: 1.063 V (0.625 idle)
Power: always 3% - 7% higher than the Top GPU during load
 
The 5ºC gap remains the same. Could be the Voltage?
Although this fan configuration seems strange, it is very efficient and the internal components of the case look very cool.
On the Hybrid Kits, I touched the tubes and radiators during the tests, and they get extremely hot. Much more than the CPU AIO. It seems to be a good idea to use them as exhaust fans and prevent the tubes from getting too close to each other.
Now I don't know if worth it the disassembly process, in order to change the thermal paste. Any ideas?
Cheers!
post edited by mmuna - 2017/02/21 04:11:33
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ksgnow2010
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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/21 05:52:18 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby mmuna 2017/02/21 07:20:13
You are showing a 4 C drop in your GPU temperatures...I call that a win!
 
When I switched to the AIOs as intake, my case internals (especially memory temperature) dropped drastically.  I was not expecting this.
 
The GPU AIO is cooling at least 150 W under load.  To get a 150 W pull out of your CPU, all cores need to be pegged at 100% with a heavy overclock.  That's why the tubes are hotter.
 
You have enough intake air in your case to offset the slightly warmer air from the GPU AIOs.  I would turn up the fan speed on your exhaust fans (back fan and CPU radiator AIO fans) to get more of the warm air out of the case.  Said differently, with enough intake air, the name of the game is exhaust...i.e. circulating air through the case to get the warm air out.
 
There can be tolerances in the GPU temperature diodes...that's probably part of it.  Also, the higher power under load will cause higher temperatures.  I have two Titan X Pascal cards in my case, and one card always runs hotter than the other by about 5 C.  The hotter card also draws more power.
 
Now, all you need is a H80i v2 for your CPU, and push/pull for the radiators and your case will be like mine!  :-)  Push/pull will get you another 2 C or so.  But, you can run both fans at lower RPMs.  I'll see if I can take a picture of the inside of my case and post it here.
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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/21 06:04:42 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby mmuna 2017/02/21 07:19:36
I have a similar setup...even changed paste....about 5c dif all the time. I wouldn't worry about it.

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mmuna
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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/21 07:24:04 (permalink)
Thanks for share your build SKRYKER, it looks awesome!
ksgnow2010 -> it would be great see an image of your build!  :-)
post edited by mmuna - 2017/02/21 07:30:31
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ksgnow2010
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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/21 08:24:36 (permalink)
mmuna
Thanks for share your build SKRYKER, it looks awesome!
ksgnow2010 -> it would be great see an image of your build!  :-)




Here's an infra-red picture...I'll have to take a regular picture and post it!
 

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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/21 08:32:09 (permalink)
Looks good, enjoy your lower temps

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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/21 13:51:40 (permalink)
Oh, reverse flow.  That's interesting.  I was just wondering how that would work out if I put a 360 on the front and 280 up top, both as exhaust with bottom/rear intake.  You'll need to adjust for any room temperature differences, but since the idle/load delta came down 1/3C respectively, that does look like an improvement.  However, since most people's liquid temps are so much lower than air cooling, a 1-3C difference might not be overly compelling if you have to make sacrifices elsewhere.  I would think this would be better case and component temperatures as well since all the waste heat is now going straight out, but I have not tried to run in reverse.  I would take off the front air filter, if you haven't already done so.  The 740 has a pretty good one with a little offset from the frame so it doesn't completely choke the fans, but it is still resistance and you shouldn't need it in this configuration.  
 
It looks like you also found the voltage difference and that explains the temperature gap between the two cards.  From what I have seen, the 1.06v is normal and your 1.00v model is just a superlative example that makes its clocks with lower voltage.  Leave it where it is as the top/#1 dominant card.  It is normal the for the smaller radiator hoses to be warmer than the H100iv2.  Each of your GPUs at 100% is producing considerably more wattage than your CPU can generate, even overclocked to the brink.  To boot, it is also likely to stay at a higher load for a longer duration during gaming (or similar) whereas most people have more variable CPU loads.  Combined with the smaller volume of water in the 120mm radiator and you get a higher coolant temp than the CPU radiator.  
post edited by X-TAC - 2017/02/21 13:56:09
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ksgnow2010
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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/21 14:06:38 (permalink)
Good Spot!
 
I just looked again and saw that OP reversed his flow (i.e. exhaust through front).  I have mine setup as intake through front/bottom and exhaust through top/back.
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mmuna
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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/21 17:23:43 (permalink)
X-TAC
Oh, reverse flow.  That's interesting.  I was just wondering how that would work out if I put a 360 on the front and 280 up top, both as exhaust with bottom/rear intake.  You'll need to adjust for any room temperature differences, but since the idle/load delta came down 1/3C respectively, that does look like an improvement.  However, since most people's liquid temps are so much lower than air cooling, a 1-3C difference might not be overly compelling if you have to make sacrifices elsewhere.  I would think this would be better case and component temperatures as well since all the waste heat is now going straight out, but I have not tried to run in reverse.  I would take off the front air filter, if you haven't already done so.  The 740 has a pretty good one with a little offset from the frame so it doesn't completely choke the fans, but it is still resistance and you shouldn't need it in this configuration.  
 
It looks like you also found the voltage difference and that explains the temperature gap between the two cards.  From what I have seen, the 1.06v is normal and your 1.00v model is just a superlative example that makes its clocks with lower voltage.  Leave it where it is as the top/#1 dominant card.  It is normal the for the smaller radiator hoses to be warmer than the H100iv2.  Each of your GPUs at 100% is producing considerably more wattage than your CPU can generate, even overclocked to the brink.  To boot, it is also likely to stay at a higher load for a longer duration during gaming (or similar) whereas most people have more variable CPU loads.  Combined with the smaller volume of water in the 120mm radiator and you get a higher coolant temp than the CPU radiator.  




Yes, the front filter was removed. It is sad because it is a really good magnetic filter.
Now I need to find out some filters for the rear and for the bottom.
The amount of heat that come out from the front now, during stress load, is absurd! That makes me confident about this inverse setup. I really want to avoid such a heat storm geting into the case.
When I was running the tests, my office got so hot that I had to turn on a fan near the window to remove all the heat from the room!  :-)
Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
 
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X-TAC
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Re: 1080 FTW SLI Hybrid Kit Temperatures 2017/02/21 18:15:10 (permalink)
The rear should be easy enough to find a magnetic 140mm filter to slap on the back.  The bottom 280mm opening is a little trickier.  I was a disappointed the case did not come with one since it is advertised as coming with filterfor all intakes.  Just the one filter for the front, so the plurality was misleading.  Regardless, there is absolutely no room in between the fan and case bottom.  The wave form underside and strange mesh material makes it difficult to put one there, unless you just take filter material and shape and secure it to the bottom (that was my original plan).  However, you might also be able to put either a 240/280mm filter directly on top of the fans on the inside of the case.  It won't prevent dust from getting into the fan blades, but it would keep it out of the rest of the case.  I did that for a week or so before deciding a didn't really care about the dust and preferred 3-4C cooler idle temps on my m.2 drive without blasting the fans.  
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