justin_43
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Re: Potential issue with x299 platform
2017/06/29 19:36:26
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Wow this is crazy. I bet EVGA is doing some testing on the X299 Dark VRM heatsink. Maybe they are doing a redesign for the heatsink like ASUS is doing for their top end boards. Could be the reason for the delay. I just hope they get it right before release. If it takes longer to make it right I'm happy to wait.
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KLEYBA
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Re: Potential issue with x299 platform
2017/06/29 19:46:13
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I am going to skip this one. I just don't get why we have to spend $1k for 44 PCI Express Lanes when we've been getting them all along. And I agree with guru3d: it's 2017! We should be able to run 16x16 standard across the board! From all levels of CPUs.
I will probably buying AMD for the first time since 2004. Threadripper is just too enticing.
Also, I have a strong feeling that AMD is going to shock everybody with Threadripper's pricing!
Mark my words here, people are going to be saying: "What?! You mean I can get a XX CPU for $XXX dollars?!"
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KLEYBA
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Re: "The X299 VRM Disaster" By De8auer
2017/06/29 19:49:34
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Why buy x299 now when Threadripper is around the corner? I think gamers looking to upgrade should hold off until they see what it's all about.
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the_Scarlet_one
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Re: "The X299 VRM Disaster" By De8auer
2017/06/29 19:54:50
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KLEYBA Why buy x299 now when Threadripper is around the corner? I think gamers looking to upgrade should hold off until they see what it's all about.
Feel free to start a thread ripper thread. As I stated, keep this on topic, the VRM overheating
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mpoffo
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Re: "The X299 VRM Disaster" By De8auer
2017/06/29 20:08:45
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X299 System: Windows 10 Pro 64-bit | Intel Core i9 7900x (4.4 GHz)| ASUS Rampage VI Extreme | 32 GB 3200 G.SKILL TridentZ RGB Corsair 900D | Corsair AX 1200i PSU | Corsair H115i Elite Capellix (in Push/Pull) | EVGA RTX 3090 FTW3 Ultra & 1080 8 GB Samsung 870 PRO 2 TB | Samsung 850 EVO 500 GB | Intel 520 SATA SSD 240GB HD | 2 & 4 TB WD Black Hard Drive Creative Sound Blaster Z | Logitech THX 5.1 speaker setup | LG Blu-ray burner | Corsair AF 120 and 140 Fans Acer x34 Predator (G-Sync) | 2 x Samsung SyncMaster PX2370
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the_Scarlet_one
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Re: "The X299 VRM Disaster" By De8auer
2017/06/29 20:15:04
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mpoffo Looks like he will retest with a different power supply this weekend. CyrusBluebird16 hours ago Just a heads up, the PSU problems seem to stem from the 9-pin universal PSU connector cables. More testing needs to be done with the more regular arrangement on PSUs.
Reply 2
der8auer16 hours ago
Just saw that as well on techpowerup. Will test with a Seasonic PSU and post an update Video at the weekend
Perfect
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mpoffo
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Re: "The X299 VRM Disaster" By De8auer
2017/06/29 20:23:24
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Interesting stuff from TinyTomLogan: https://www.facebook.com/tinytomlogan/photos/a.199509330089988.47891.188125641228357/1707642909276615/?type=3&theater"After der8auer's video - Im running my own tests and hate to say it but mine are not getting anywhere near as hot as his (7900x -1.235v - 4.6ghz - OCCT Linpack) Front temps - 50c - rear temp 60c max"
Read all the stuff on the facebook post comments below the post. Interesting stuff. Jonny chimes in: Jon Gerow: No anomalies found. In fact... Like Tom, I didn't see anywhere near the high temperatures the guy in the video saw. My PSU connector (at the load) temperatures were < 40°C even after an hour. Maybe his thermometer or thermal couplers are pooched and this whole thing is a false alarm.
https://forum.overclock3d.net/showthread.php?t=81071"I think the problem is fairly unique to him......"
post edited by mpoffo - 2017/06/29 20:35:09
X299 System: Windows 10 Pro 64-bit | Intel Core i9 7900x (4.4 GHz)| ASUS Rampage VI Extreme | 32 GB 3200 G.SKILL TridentZ RGB Corsair 900D | Corsair AX 1200i PSU | Corsair H115i Elite Capellix (in Push/Pull) | EVGA RTX 3090 FTW3 Ultra & 1080 8 GB Samsung 870 PRO 2 TB | Samsung 850 EVO 500 GB | Intel 520 SATA SSD 240GB HD | 2 & 4 TB WD Black Hard Drive Creative Sound Blaster Z | Logitech THX 5.1 speaker setup | LG Blu-ray burner | Corsair AF 120 and 140 Fans Acer x34 Predator (G-Sync) | 2 x Samsung SyncMaster PX2370
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Goobers
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Re: "The X299 VRM Disaster" By De8auer
2017/06/29 20:33:44
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I hope he puts at least a low speed fan near the VRMs when testing. The stock coolers for Intel chips (and probably AMD, I guess) are set up to push air down onto the CPU before going outward across various components, one of which is the VRM. His CPU cooler is completely set sideways so it won't blow any air across the VRM. And without the airflow from properly (even a basic one intake, one exhaust) set up inside a case, there's no air going over the VRM heatsinks. If nothing else, a low speed fan nearby will blow away the heat bubble that the VRM will create. EDIT: having mpoffo's post regarding what TTL and "Jonny" makes me want to retract at least some of my statement... In that, I also don't expect a 30c drop from a case. But, I do still expect a not quite "disaster" level temps.
post edited by Goobers - 2017/06/29 20:43:12
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mpoffo
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Re: "The X299 VRM Disaster" By De8auer
2017/06/29 20:41:20
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Goobers I hope he puts at least a low speed fan near the VRMs when testing. The stock coolers for Intel chips (and probably AMD, I guess) are set up to push air down onto the CPU before going outward across various components, one of which is the VRM. His CPU cooler is completely set sideways so it won't blow any air across the VRM. And without the airflow from properly (even a basic one intake, one exhaust) set up inside a case, there's no air going over the VRM heatsinks. If nothing else, a low speed fan nearby will blow away the heat bubble that the VRM will create.
Quite a number of people pointed out airflow issues with his set-up in combo with the PSU issue. It is encouraging to see others not getting the same results in more real life settings for those of us that use cases (Jonny and TinyTimLogain). Still I am glad that it appears at least some motherboard makers are making adjustments. Can't hurt.:) Here is hoping the next few days shed some more light on it. The response to the Youtube video is pretty interesting to me. People reacting and making large decisions based on one video that there are some legit questions about. I don't know De8auer rep well. He seems like a good guy and I am sure he would not intentionally post anything to mislead. I have enjoyed a number of his videos in the past.
X299 System: Windows 10 Pro 64-bit | Intel Core i9 7900x (4.4 GHz)| ASUS Rampage VI Extreme | 32 GB 3200 G.SKILL TridentZ RGB Corsair 900D | Corsair AX 1200i PSU | Corsair H115i Elite Capellix (in Push/Pull) | EVGA RTX 3090 FTW3 Ultra & 1080 8 GB Samsung 870 PRO 2 TB | Samsung 850 EVO 500 GB | Intel 520 SATA SSD 240GB HD | 2 & 4 TB WD Black Hard Drive Creative Sound Blaster Z | Logitech THX 5.1 speaker setup | LG Blu-ray burner | Corsair AF 120 and 140 Fans Acer x34 Predator (G-Sync) | 2 x Samsung SyncMaster PX2370
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Goobers
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Re: "The X299 VRM Disaster" By De8auer
2017/06/29 20:56:53
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Oh yeah, I posted on the video too. And while I also agree he probably isn't doing anything intentionally to mislead, I took issue when he responded to someone else about putting the fan near the VRM. "Who would go out of their way to put a fan on the VRM?" No one, because it's taken care of by the CPU or case fans. A better response would be... "well, I guess temps would be different in a case." ~~~~~ On a side note, I also hadn't heard of him until recently with the Skylake X deliding hoop-la. After seeing his tool to do it, I didn't think much of it, until it was explained in a Gamers Nexus video that it, for better or worse, PUSHES the IHS (is it integrated if its using TIM and not solder?) to break the bond the black adhesive(?). Now that I think about it, isn't that a bad idea? While we won't care what kind of forces are acting on the IHS... those same forces are also acting on the PCB of the CPU. I would rather have a tiny blade slice through it (edit: the bonding material), close to the IHS. Anyway... enough nitpicking from me.
post edited by Goobers - 2017/06/29 22:29:00
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09973
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Re: "The X299 VRM Disaster" By De8auer
2017/06/29 23:36:56
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If a "better" PSU supplies the same VRM issues, I wonder if this could be a symptom of EVGA being a bit "late" with their X299 motherboards?
As long as your popular enough, you can get away with anything.
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mpoffo
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Re: "The X299 VRM Disaster" By De8auer
2017/06/30 14:03:47
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X299 System: Windows 10 Pro 64-bit | Intel Core i9 7900x (4.4 GHz)| ASUS Rampage VI Extreme | 32 GB 3200 G.SKILL TridentZ RGB Corsair 900D | Corsair AX 1200i PSU | Corsair H115i Elite Capellix (in Push/Pull) | EVGA RTX 3090 FTW3 Ultra & 1080 8 GB Samsung 870 PRO 2 TB | Samsung 850 EVO 500 GB | Intel 520 SATA SSD 240GB HD | 2 & 4 TB WD Black Hard Drive Creative Sound Blaster Z | Logitech THX 5.1 speaker setup | LG Blu-ray burner | Corsair AF 120 and 140 Fans Acer x34 Predator (G-Sync) | 2 x Samsung SyncMaster PX2370
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the_Scarlet_one
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Re: "The X299 VRM Disaster" By De8auer
2017/06/30 14:08:42
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There really hasn't been a true follow up. Der8auer himself needs to retest, since he was seeing it with all boards. JonnyGuru is strictly focused on PSU and hasn't been able to test the same setup at the same clocks and voltage. That was why I specifically asked about that on their site, and like he states, they need to know how much power Der8auer is actually pulling instead of guessing and assuming at this point. Also, I am far less concerned with the power cable temps, and far more concerned that his system is pulling more power than he assumes. Seeing how he is experiencing the problem on the cables and Vrm, then I assume either too much power, or what I mention below. To be honest, it sounds like his thermocouple or digital thermometer could be an issue. He is meauring 80-90 where everyone else is seeing 40-50. If his probe is the problem, that could be an easy fix.
post edited by Scarlet-Tech - 2017/06/30 14:13:52
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mpoffo
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Re: "The X299 VRM Disaster" By De8auer
2017/06/30 16:24:28
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Scarlet-Tech There really hasn't been a true follow up. Der8auer himself needs to retest, since he was seeing it with all boards. JonnyGuru is strictly focused on PSU and hasn't been able to test the same setup at the same clocks and voltage. That was why I specifically asked about that on their site, and like he states, they need to know how much power Der8auer is actually pulling instead of guessing and assuming at this point. Also, I am far less concerned with the power cable temps, and far more concerned that his system is pulling more power than he assumes. Seeing how he is experiencing the problem on the cables and Vrm, then I assume either too much power, or what I mention below.
To be honest, it sounds like his thermocouple or digital thermometer could be an issue. He is meauring 80-90 where everyone else is seeing 40-50. If his probe is the problem, that could be an easy fix.
Well hopefully he can retest this weekend as he indicated. It sounds like TTL did some testing on some of the same boards with a different PSU. From his forums he was not seeing the same temps at all. He did measure temps and appears he will be posting something at some point as well. I am not expert in this area but from what I gather these are the areas that need to be explored (please correct me if I am wrong): 1. Issues with the PSU he used and how the boards he tested drew power from it given the unique way that PSU is designed. I believe the implication is that the this causes some increase in the VRM temps. 2. Overall testing mechanism (test bench), perhaps without adequate air flow contributing to the overall results. 3. As you say something faulty with the testing methodology, perhaps the thermocouple/thermometer. I would agree that more testing is needed but something seems off and a number of folks are picking that up now. Jonny is cited in many of the on-line stories.
post edited by mpoffo - 2017/06/30 17:17:40
X299 System: Windows 10 Pro 64-bit | Intel Core i9 7900x (4.4 GHz)| ASUS Rampage VI Extreme | 32 GB 3200 G.SKILL TridentZ RGB Corsair 900D | Corsair AX 1200i PSU | Corsair H115i Elite Capellix (in Push/Pull) | EVGA RTX 3090 FTW3 Ultra & 1080 8 GB Samsung 870 PRO 2 TB | Samsung 850 EVO 500 GB | Intel 520 SATA SSD 240GB HD | 2 & 4 TB WD Black Hard Drive Creative Sound Blaster Z | Logitech THX 5.1 speaker setup | LG Blu-ray burner | Corsair AF 120 and 140 Fans Acer x34 Predator (G-Sync) | 2 x Samsung SyncMaster PX2370
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quadlatte
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Re: Potential issue with x299 platform
2017/06/30 16:41:20
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KLEYBA I am going to skip this one. I just don't get why we have to spend $1k for 44 PCI Express Lanes when we've been getting them all along. And I agree with guru3d: it's 2017! We should be able to run 16x16 standard across the board! From all levels of CPUs.
I will probably buying AMD for the first time since 2004. Threadripper is just too enticing.
Also, I have a strong feeling that AMD is going to shock everybody with Threadripper's pricing!
Mark my words here, people are going to be saying: "What?! You mean I can get a XX CPU for $XXX dollars?!"
with AMD past over hype history and under performing results i would not hold your breath to much
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quadlatte
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Re: Potential issue with x299 platform
2017/06/30 16:42:36
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willdearborn Wow this is crazy. I bet EVGA is doing some testing on the X299 Dark VRM heatsink. Maybe they are doing a redesign for the heatsink like ASUS is doing for their top end boards. Could be the reason for the delay. I just hope they get it right before release. If it takes longer to make it right I'm happy to wait.
i think evga will, they have always seemed to go a bit overboard with heatsink design
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the_Scarlet_one
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Re: "The X299 VRM Disaster" By De8auer
2017/06/30 16:44:01
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Der8auer isn't very know for bad reviews or calling out issues like this, so he must have thought something serious was going on to post that video. Hopefully it was all just a flawed test method.
I can say for a fact, I set up my second x99 platform for folding, and didn't have a fan on the ram at first, and it got warm.. the whole board did.. now I keep a fan on the ram and Vrm area, and everything is much cooler.
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Iamrogue
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Re: Potential issue with x299 platform
2017/06/30 22:56:12
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i have to say that i dont haave any vrm problems with my MSI SLI PLUS, its one of the cheapest boards and i am using 7900x @ 4,7ghz...
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mpoffo
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Re: "The X299 VRM Disaster" By De8auer
2017/07/01 14:49:20
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TTL did his video showing very different results on the VRM temps. Tested the strix and some other boards. All temps are significantly lower. Hype train derailed.
post edited by mpoffo - 2017/07/01 16:18:40
X299 System: Windows 10 Pro 64-bit | Intel Core i9 7900x (4.4 GHz)| ASUS Rampage VI Extreme | 32 GB 3200 G.SKILL TridentZ RGB Corsair 900D | Corsair AX 1200i PSU | Corsair H115i Elite Capellix (in Push/Pull) | EVGA RTX 3090 FTW3 Ultra & 1080 8 GB Samsung 870 PRO 2 TB | Samsung 850 EVO 500 GB | Intel 520 SATA SSD 240GB HD | 2 & 4 TB WD Black Hard Drive Creative Sound Blaster Z | Logitech THX 5.1 speaker setup | LG Blu-ray burner | Corsair AF 120 and 140 Fans Acer x34 Predator (G-Sync) | 2 x Samsung SyncMaster PX2370
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the_Scarlet_one
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Re: "The X299 VRM Disaster" By De8auer
2017/07/01 15:16:47
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Without space [ tube]YouTube share link [/ tube]
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mpoffo
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Re: "The X299 VRM Disaster" By De8auer
2017/07/01 16:16:46
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Thanks Scarlet. I was having issues posting things from my phone. It will be interesting to see what De8auer says in his video. There was a reason why his results are so inflated, we have mentioned some possibilities, now to get it from the source. According to some updated comments from De8auer in his video and on the TTL video he has tested a different PSU and different x299 chip and obtained the same results. He just got a strix and said he will test that. It is very odd that people are getting way different results. JonnyGuru said on his site that he tested the PSU that De8auer has it it did ok. So it does not appear PSU related. Looks like De8auer was talking to TTL and comparing notes. Hope to get this mystery solved.
post edited by mpoffo - 2017/07/01 16:57:13
X299 System: Windows 10 Pro 64-bit | Intel Core i9 7900x (4.4 GHz)| ASUS Rampage VI Extreme | 32 GB 3200 G.SKILL TridentZ RGB Corsair 900D | Corsair AX 1200i PSU | Corsair H115i Elite Capellix (in Push/Pull) | EVGA RTX 3090 FTW3 Ultra & 1080 8 GB Samsung 870 PRO 2 TB | Samsung 850 EVO 500 GB | Intel 520 SATA SSD 240GB HD | 2 & 4 TB WD Black Hard Drive Creative Sound Blaster Z | Logitech THX 5.1 speaker setup | LG Blu-ray burner | Corsair AF 120 and 140 Fans Acer x34 Predator (G-Sync) | 2 x Samsung SyncMaster PX2370
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the_Scarlet_one
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Re: "The X299 VRM Disaster" By De8auer
2017/07/01 17:33:50
(permalink)
mpoffo Thanks Scarlet. I was having issues posting things from my phone. It will be interesting to see what De8auer says in his video. There was a reason why his results are so inflated, we have mentioned some possibilities, now to get it from the source. According to some updated comments from De8auer in his video and on the TTL video he has tested a different PSU and different x299 chip and obtained the same results. He just got a strix and said he will test that. It is very odd that people are getting way different results. JonnyGuru said on his site that he tested the PSU that De8auer has it it did ok. So it does not appear PSU related. Looks like De8auer was talking to TTL and comparing notes. Hope to get this mystery solved.
I am very curious what it actually going on at this point. my bet would be flawed testing or a bad thermocouple/thermometer testing.
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Goobers
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Re: "The X299 VRM Disaster" By De8auer
2017/07/01 20:02:51
(permalink)
Scarlet-Tech
mpoffo Thanks Scarlet. I was having issues posting things from my phone. It will be interesting to see what De8auer says in his video. There was a reason why his results are so inflated, we have mentioned some possibilities, now to get it from the source. According to some updated comments from De8auer in his video and on the TTL video he has tested a different PSU and different x299 chip and obtained the same results. He just got a strix and said he will test that. It is very odd that people are getting way different results. JonnyGuru said on his site that he tested the PSU that De8auer has it it did ok. So it does not appear PSU related. Looks like De8auer was talking to TTL and comparing notes. Hope to get this mystery solved.
I am very curious what it actually going on at this point. my bet would be flawed testing or a bad thermocouple/thermometer testing.
Question... would it be acceptable to "calibrate" it by stuffing it in your armpit to see what the reading is?
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KLEYBA
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Re: Potential issue with x299 platform
2017/07/04 00:23:30
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https://youtu.be/j3ssad0qZuU
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mpoffo
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Re: "The X299 VRM Disaster" By De8auer
2017/07/04 11:35:33
(permalink)
No update video yet from der8auer
X299 System: Windows 10 Pro 64-bit | Intel Core i9 7900x (4.4 GHz)| ASUS Rampage VI Extreme | 32 GB 3200 G.SKILL TridentZ RGB Corsair 900D | Corsair AX 1200i PSU | Corsair H115i Elite Capellix (in Push/Pull) | EVGA RTX 3090 FTW3 Ultra & 1080 8 GB Samsung 870 PRO 2 TB | Samsung 850 EVO 500 GB | Intel 520 SATA SSD 240GB HD | 2 & 4 TB WD Black Hard Drive Creative Sound Blaster Z | Logitech THX 5.1 speaker setup | LG Blu-ray burner | Corsair AF 120 and 140 Fans Acer x34 Predator (G-Sync) | 2 x Samsung SyncMaster PX2370
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Goobers
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Re: "The X299 VRM Disaster" By De8auer
2017/07/04 14:32:40
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It could just take a while to do. I mean, he is a so-called "pro-overclocker" for whatever that's worth. So he could have plenty of things on his plate. That's my "benefit of doubt" statement. The less beneficial statement... maybe he's been testing and is unhappy with the results, enough that he's not ready to publish them. Either because at best, results are wonky or completely turn his earlier statements false. Anyway, whatever the reason... I'd say, just give it a little more time.
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mpoffo
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Re: "The X299 VRM Disaster" By De8auer
2017/07/04 15:16:08
(permalink)
Goobers It could just take a while to do. I mean, he is a so-called "pro-overclocker" for whatever that's worth. So he could have plenty of things on his plate. That's my "benefit of doubt" statement. The less beneficial statement... maybe he's been testing and is unhappy with the results, enough that he's not ready to publish them. Either because at best, results are wonky or completely turn his earlier statements false. Anyway, whatever the reason... I'd say, just give it a little more time.
I certainly will. He had mentioned Monday so if he is doing a more detailed video and going through his methodology then it will be worth it. In the more recent comments he has made he has implied that his results are the same with a different CPU and PSU, so perhaps there is still a deeper mystery that needs to be figured out.
X299 System: Windows 10 Pro 64-bit | Intel Core i9 7900x (4.4 GHz)| ASUS Rampage VI Extreme | 32 GB 3200 G.SKILL TridentZ RGB Corsair 900D | Corsair AX 1200i PSU | Corsair H115i Elite Capellix (in Push/Pull) | EVGA RTX 3090 FTW3 Ultra & 1080 8 GB Samsung 870 PRO 2 TB | Samsung 850 EVO 500 GB | Intel 520 SATA SSD 240GB HD | 2 & 4 TB WD Black Hard Drive Creative Sound Blaster Z | Logitech THX 5.1 speaker setup | LG Blu-ray burner | Corsair AF 120 and 140 Fans Acer x34 Predator (G-Sync) | 2 x Samsung SyncMaster PX2370
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Sajin
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Re: "The X299 VRM Disaster" By De8auer
2017/07/05 16:33:26
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foxmino
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Re: Potential issue with x299 platform
2017/07/05 18:45:17
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Asus Z790 Apex 13900ks Custom water cooling Msi 4090 Suprim Liquid V color 7800mhz A die memory Seagate Firecuda 4tb Evga 1300watt G plus Lian Li PC-011 Dynamic evo HeatWare http://www.heatware.com/eval.php?id=76088
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the_Scarlet_one
formerly Scarlet-tech
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Re: Potential issue with x299 platform
2017/07/05 20:06:43
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I have merged two thread on the same topic, and moved one from the x299 section as the issue is tied directly to overclocking.
This will keep users from having to go to a total of three sections to see the same posts that are getting shared by 3 different people.
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