the_Scarlet_one

bcavnaugh
I do not use Boost so can I still Move the Voltage Slider to 100% and OC the Card just like what we do now on the GTX Cards?

Gpu Boost 4.0 is on every nvidia card and doesn’t give the option to turn it off. You can still overclock just like normal, but don’t expect extra high numbers, just go in expecting the 2050 mhz range just like last gen.

So what it the K-Boost Button for in PXOC?

GTXJackBauer

Ravenmaster
What pissed me off about the new cards is that the 2080 is literally a 1080ti clone performance-wise and the're charging Titan prices for the 2080Ti. 

Pretty much and you're starting to see it back fire.  While it's sad I'm kind of glad people are finally coming to their senses.  I wouldn't be surprised if we see the prices slashed across the board.  I still believe they wanted to lure many to the overstocked 10xx series since for many, the 20xx series is unaffordable.

Yea but the big question is how long will that price slash take lol

the_Scarlet_one
Sajin, adjusting the curve in software doesn’t actually change the cap of the voltage.. the card is locked down and if you can’t change the actual voltage, then you just said the exact same thing I said. The placebo slider does nothing, as stated. “It unlocks higher ranges” means nothing because it does nothing. The voltage doesn’t change. Say it however you want, it’s the same thing.

 
You're right adjusting the curve doesn't actually change the cap. The cap is controlled by the voltage slider. You can change the actual voltage... on pascal modifying the curve does allow you to change the voltage. The cap is controlled by the voltage slider, as I've already stated. The voltage slider isn't placebo. The voltage slider actually unlocks higher voltage ranges when increased.
 
e.g.
 
Here is my card idling on the desktop at default settings with kboost enabled. Notice how the voltage is running at 1.042mv...

 
 
Now here is the max voltage I can apply to the card by just adjusting the voltage/frequency curve without adjusting the core voltage slider to 100%...

 Max voltage cap with core voltage slider at 0% = 1.062mv.
 
After adjusting the core voltage slider to 100% the max voltage cap is raised to 1.093v (three voltage ranges unlocked), but to obtain 1.093v you must again tweak the voltage/frequency curve to obtain it...

Max voltage cap with core voltage slider at 100% = 1.093mv.
 
 
 
 

I feel kind of let down by the performance vs. the 1080ti but for those who are upgrading from a couple generations ago I feel you have enough to justify the upgrade but I think the 1080 and 1080ti have proven to be worth keeping to a lot of people. I really don't see why they would release a card with a locked voltage since it's not what anyone buying a $800+ graphics card would want.

xblackvalorx

jonkrmr
So, Voltage locked down, 2080 only marginally faster than 1080 Ti at same price point as 1080 Ti even though it has faster clock speed and faster memory than 1080 Ti (granted it has less shaders than 1080 Ti), Nvidia says over volting GPU will shorten its' life big time (probably why they locked down voltage), cannot flash BIOS to get around these limitations, reports of them running hotter than last generation, more difficult to over clock because of Boost 4.0, 2080 Ti double the price than last gen 1080 Ti, no games at launch that support the new tech Nvidia has been touting as the biggest upside of the RTX, meh reviews and Nvidia stock dropped 2.6% today because of the reviews.
 
Way to go Nvidia. You sure know how to introduce new technology to the consumer market :)
 
Nvidia kinda seems like they are following Microsoft's lead on how to force their vision and products onto the consumer market this time around............
 
WOW, just WOW. That's all I can say.
 
AMD, you have the door left wide open for you to catch up to and even surpass Nvidia, take advantage...........

What I don't get is why they'd care with AIBs, it's there warranty issue
Seems more like a push to keep AIBs from having a huge advantage over nvidia made cards

With the AIB's PCB and components used on the PCB, yes. With the GPU itself, no. The cost of a faulty\failed GPU die would be reimbursed to the AIB from Nvidia (the AIB's purchase the GPU dies from Nvidia, just like we purchase the graphics cards from the AIBs. I seriously doubt the AIB's would eat the cost of faulty\failed GPU dies they bought from Nvidia unless the failure was caused by their PCB\component failure). This would still impact Nvidia big time.
Nvidia is now looking to be a bigger player in direct sales of their product to the general public. They are now offering factory over clocked cards. This seems to me to put the AIB's in direct competition with Nvidia (at least with reference design cards from the AIB's). This would also explain why Nvidia has been playing hard ball with AIB's in regards to the draconian NDA's and agreements Nvidia is imposing on AIBs in order to sell cards based on Nvidia chips. Nvidia is trying to ensure they can be competitive in sales with the AIBs.
 
"Seems more like a push to keep AIBs from having a huge advantage over nvidia made cards" - Bingo :)

jonkrmr

xblackvalorx

GTXJackBauer

Ravenmaster
What pissed me off about the new cards is that the 2080 is literally a 1080ti clone performance-wise and the're charging Titan prices for the 2080Ti. 

Pretty much and you're starting to see it back fire.  While it's sad I'm kind of glad people are finally coming to their senses.  I wouldn't be surprised if we see the prices slashed across the board.  I still believe they wanted to lure many to the overstocked 10xx series since for many, the 20xx series is unaffordable.

Yea but the big question is how long will that price slash take lol

As soon as 1080\1080 Ti GPU inventory is depleted..............
 
Nvidia was already strong arming AIB's with RTX GPU die allocations to get rid of their 1080 & 1080 Ti GPUs that they over produced anticipating the mining craze that crashed. They have a massive overstock of them and were\are strong arming AIBs to get rid of them with veiled threats of short shipping RTX 2080\2080 Ti GPUs allocations to them.

Well that's messed up. Smh nvidia

Kept mine for the eye-candy and because I feel like betting on the mining profit this could make with the right software!
For a moment I though you were talking about the "Power" target slider and I freaked out, but you were talking about voltages after all. That has some benefits I suppose; since I take good care of my card and never push the voltages, but when I try to resell my card I get sceptical people who ask me if I've ever overclocked my card.
 
Personally I'm fine but I'm sure it's unfair for people who have spent money on water-cooling.
Let's see if the FTW3 will come with pre-configured higher voltages in accordance to the custom PCB and superior cooling.

I think there is a misunderstanding that higher voltages automatically unlock a lot more performance. It doesn't. 

xblackvalorx

Zybane
I think there is a misunderstanding that higher voltages automatically unlock a lot more performance. It doesn't. 

Erm
It typically allows for higher overclocks
Which unlocks more performance

I get an extra ~100mhz out of my 980ti classified with an extra .75mv

That is on an old card. These newer chips, more voltage gets you very little performance and get very thermally inefficient. 

I'm confused by people’s reactions. As feature size gets smaller, voltages are going to get more critical and have less wiggle room. Tom Petersen even said it - that voltage slider just unlocks a few higher voltage steps that only get accessed as part of the voltage/frequency tuning. It doesn’t set the voltage directly. But beyond that, go too high and you shorten the life of the GPU.

People look at these voltages and they don’t look big at all. It’s just a volt and fractions of a volt is all. But what you have to remember is that those voltages are over very short distances. 1 volt over a micron is the same stress as 1,000,000 volts over a meter. The highest voltage power transmission line ever was 1.15 MV and in air there are corona effects and issues with possible arc-over if cable sway gets out of phase and gets large enough in high winds. Those wires are well over a meter apart. The voltage stresses in ICs can be huge and small increases can have dramatic effects.

People seem to think Nvidia locking down voltages is arbitrary — like Jensen just woke up one day and decided he didn’t want people overclocking his chips. Why does that make sense to anyone? If you could crank up the voltage — without killing the chip — and get better performance, why not let people do it? Why not do it from the factory? Why would Nvidia choose to hobble a chip that they want to "gouge" buyers on? Seems to me that if Nvidia wanted to arbitrarily charge lots more for a chip and they could so easily make them overclocking demons that would sate the otherwise complaining masses, they would and smile all the way to the bank.

There are physical reasons why voltages can’t be arbitrarily increased and why it can shorten chip life if you do. These things are getting into ranges where quantum effects start becoming issues. You get current leakages that increase heat and transistors that aren’t completely on or off. It may be a digital circuit but it exists in a cross between analog and quantum worlds. It’s threading a needle. It’s why Nvidia likes to show eye diagrams — those are a measure of the quality of that balance.

Anyone complaining about not being able to set more voltages at 12/16 nm, is going to be really disappointed at 7 nm. There may not be any wiggle at all just because each step will get that much more important. If there are steps, they will be very tiny. It’s just how it goes. As you divide by smaller numbers, the result blows up.

The 2080s just are what they are. Nvidia is introducing things like RTC and DLSS to work smarter. The old way of doing things is hitting a wall. If we want advances, the ways of doing things needs to change. To that end, Nvidia created a new line with new features and also added more of the old resources to increase base performance. That resulted in a huge chip that reduced yield and increased costs. So what we end up with is an expensive GPU that includes new features that don’t have as much application just yet, but a significant but not earth shattering increase in base performance.

People should either buy it or not based on their own needs. The 20s are expensive GPUs, the performance increase is significant but maybe not what some expect, and yep, RTX and DLSS applications aren’t widely available yet. But the conspiracy stuff isn’t founded in reality and is harmful to everyone. There is just no reason Nvidia would artificially restrict voltages if there wasn’t a valid reason to do it especially if it would shut down some of the arguments againts the new chips.

If we stay with the old way of doing graphics, we hit the wall faster. No pain, no gain.

wmmills

Hoggle
I feel kind of let down by the performance vs. the 1080ti but for those who are upgrading from a couple generations ago I feel you have enough to justify the upgrade but I think the 1080 and 1080ti have proven to be worth keeping to a lot of people. I really don't see why they would release a card with a locked voltage since it's not what anyone buying a $800+ graphics card would want.

Nope, not at those prices with the locks and touting soft/hard enhancements that wont be useable really until the next gen drops, when the industry has caught up to them. So why buy it now?!?! Unless your card just blew out and theres no 10xx series cards available.

I was hoping the 1080ti's were going to go down in price, but they havent.
You can get a 2080 for EXACTLY the same price as a 1080TI.
I am coming from a Titan X Maxwell, that cant even do stable framerates or ANYTHING anymore, so I decided to go with the 2080 instead of the 1080ti.
Plus, if its old stock just sitting around, no matter if used or not, the 1080ti's will degrade a bit. So, at least I am getting a NEW card, and not just new old stock.
Now I just have to get a new PSU, as this evga 1600 seems to be having issues (AGAIN. My 1300G2 went out, and now my 1600G2 is going out. Going back to Corsair, as my old 1000I STILL works just great, but I am not sure if it will power 2 2080's or not).

Their is a Ribbon Cable in the Video that talks a little about it, three different Items if I recall. Fans, LED and ? I think was on Cooling.

One More, bad news IMO

Too lazy to perform a hard mod?

I didn't pre-order. And I am glad that I didn't. It's overpriced hot garbage at the moment.

the_Scarlet_one
Less to do with strictly voltage control and more to do with the lackluster performance and no way to increase it.

My next big question: once Ray tracing is turned on, and the RT cores activate, how is the extra heat going to be controlled on air coolers?

+1 :)
I bet these things are going to be hitting the power wall big time also when the RT cores are working. I suspect we will see GPU-Z showing 1's a lot for the PerfCap Reason.
 
Like my father used to tell me, "Son, do not buy the first model year of any car. Wait until they have worked the bugs out of it a year or two down the line"...................

I'm keeping my TI FTW preorder. I've gotten over caring about getting an extra tiny bit of overclock because cards are voltage limited :P