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Hot!SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS...

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servxtrem
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2012/03/11 16:59:20 (permalink)
Hi guys...
Okay now I see EVGA has released the SR-X.
Very nice idea again, but this time I really dont see what went wrong here.
 
I'll start with what I see a REAL MESS UP in the design of this board.
We all know PCI-EX lane routing on our enthusiast systems has been a real struggle since the PCI-Express technology existed, allways having to find a solution to get more lanes to a single GPU or splitting them to multi GPUs.
 
Now before Socket R (2011) was released, the best we could get is 36 lanes from a x58 chipset, giving x16 / x16 OR x16 / x8 / x8.
Many other designs exist too, ranging from the NF790i to the NF200 bridges and Lucid, PLX and others... all trying to split and share lanes; nothing really good for high bandwith.
 
Release of the Socket R processors has finally unlocked what i've been waiting for years: 40 lanes per CPU, with 80lanes in a dual socket board !
 
Now lets see 5 "equivalent" boards to the SR-X, all sharing the SAME design and layout.
- Supermicro X9DAi:

 
Three (3) PCI Express 3.0 x16 slots (CPU1 Slot2/
CPU2 Slot4/CPU2 Slot6),

Three (3) PCI Express 3.0 x8 slots (CPU1 Slot1/
CPU1 Slot3/CPU2 Slot5),

- Supermicro X9DR3-LN4F+
 
 
Four (4) PCI Express 3.0 x16 slots (CPU1 Slot1/Slot3, CPU2 Slot4/Slot5),
One (1) PCI Express 3.0 x8 slot (CPU2 Slot6),
One (1) PCI Express 3.0x4 in x8 slot (CPU 1Slot2)
 
 
- Intel® Server Board S2600CO Family

 
 -Slot 1: PCIe Gen II x4 electrical with x8 physical connector, routed from Intel ® C600 Chipset, support half-length card
-Slot 2: PCIe Gen III x16 electrical with x16 physical connector, routed from CPU1, support full length card
-Slot 3: PCIe Gen III x16 electrical with x16 physical connector, routed from CPU2, support full length, double width card
-Slot 4: PCIe Gen III x8 electrical with x8 connector, routed from CPU2, support full length card; support Intel designed SAS RAID on Card (ROC) Module (PCIe slot form factor)
-Slot 5: PCIe Gen III x16 electrical with x16 connector, routed from CPU1, support full length, double width card
-Slot 6: PCIe Gen III x16 electrical with x16 connector, routed from CPU2, support half-length card, Intel designed PCIe riser card
 
- TYAN S7055 (S7055AGM3NR)

 
(4) PCI-E Gen3 x16 slots (slot #7, #5, #3, #1) / (1) PCI-E Gen2 x8 slots (slot #4)
 
- ASUS Z9PE-D16

Slot 5: PCI-E x16 slot, x16 Gen3 Link , from CPU 1 (Auto switch to x8 Link if slot 6 is occupied)
Slot 4: PCI-E x16 slot, x16 Gen3 Link, from CPU 2
Slot 3: PCI-E x16 slot, x16 Gen3 Link, from CPU 1
Slot 2: PCI-E x16 slot, x16 Gen3 Link, from CPU 2
Slot 6: PCI-E x16 slot, x8 Gen3 Link , from CPU 1
Slot 1: PCI-E x16 slot, x8 Gen3 Link, from CPU2
 
Many other boards share the same design, i just cant post them all here, but:
All use the C606 /C602 chipset,
Have about the same options like SAS/SATA,
Ok some dont have Integrated audio, but these are server boards,
They ALL have some kind of BMC controller and remote management.
 
NOW LETS COME BACK TO OUR SR-X.
Whats the huge difference?
I see a PLX bridge splitting some lanes, ****?? Why cant it use all those native CPU lanes? Isn't it a dual socket? Want to use only 1 CPU? Just buy a single socket MOBO !
I see PCI-Express 3.0 switches, 4 per slot. ****? I thought the CPU PCI-e controller is native 3.0... Do u see those switches on the server boards I mentioned above? NO. But they are REAL Native 3.0 !!
I see an "HPTX" form factor, witch is an odd form I dont understand why using it. Look at the server boards, they all use SSI-EEB form factor
(304.80 mm x 330.20 mm), just nice to fit in a case like mine without touching the drive backplanes...

Now all I think EVGA has to do is redesign the board, this is no real enthusiast board compared to those nice (but not red) server boards...
I want to buid a new rig soon, and if EVGA cant build a board using all the PCI-Ex lanes, they lost me. (being with eevga for years...)

I am planning to use:
2 GPUs Radeon HD7970 (Slot1 / slot 3)
1 Areca 2882ix-24 SAS 2.0 Gen2 Dual core for the 15K storage
1 PCI Ex SSD (maybe the IODRIVE2 DUO 1.2TB SLC)
1 Sound controller

Or maybe quad GPUs...
post edited by servxtrem - 2012/03/11 17:42:30
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    Brocasta
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/11 19:51:18 (permalink)
    The only theory I've read was that SLI wont work if the lanes are coming from two different CPUs. Outside of that, it's a mystery. I would be interested to know, even though I already bought the D16.
    #2
    Captain Caveman
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/11 21:12:53 (permalink)
    you forgot the 8 memory slots on 1 CPU and 4 on the other...another epic fail
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    EVGA_JacobF
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/11 23:09:34 (permalink)
    servxtrem
    I see an "HPTX" form factor, witch is an odd form I dont understand why using it. Look at the server boards, they all use SSI-EEB form factor
    (304.80 mm x 330.20 mm), just nice to fit in a case like mine without touching the drive backplanes...
    

     
    None of the boards you show above have 7 PCI-E slots. Also, the EVGA SR-X is not really considered a server board, sure it can be used for one but Workstation/Enthusiast class is more fitting. The size is the same as SR-2...
    post edited by EVGA_JacobF - 2012/03/11 23:12:53


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    EVGA_JacobF
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/11 23:14:51 (permalink)
    Captain Caveman

    you forgot the 8 memory slots on 1 CPU and 4 on the other...another epic fail

     
    One of the boards you linked above had 4+4 memory slots... yet this one is ok? There is just not enough room for 8+8 + 4 graphics cards. 8+4 is a good compromise plus makes it easier to upgrade for SR=2 users.


    #5
    Captain Caveman
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/12 01:26:51 (permalink)
    EVGA_JacobF

    servxtrem
    I see an "HPTX" form factor, witch is an odd form I dont understand why using it. Look at the server boards, they all use SSI-EEB form factor
    (304.80 mm x 330.20 mm), just nice to fit in a case like mine without touching the drive backplanes...
    


    None of the boards you show above have 7 PCI-E slots. Also, the EVGA SR-X is not really considered a server board, sure it can be used for one but Workstation/Enthusiast class is more fitting. The size is the same as SR-2...

     
    and as he stated...you dont get full use of all lanes
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    Captain Caveman
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/12 01:39:03 (permalink)
    EVGA_JacobF

    Captain Caveman

    you forgot the 8 memory slots on 1 CPU and 4 on the other...another epic fail


    One of the boards you linked above had 4+4 memory slots... yet this one is ok? There is just not enough room for 8+8 + 4 graphics cards. 8+4 is a good compromise plus makes it easier to upgrade for SR=2 users.

    1. I didnt link the boards or start this thread...that was JacobF.
     
    2. no, not good compromise....memory lanes aren't of equal length for starters.
     
    not equal load on both CPU's. not having same amount of mem slots on each cpu is going to cause some issues for overclocking balance such as freq., voltage...etc.  they have to be doing some hucus pocus mumbojumbo in the back ground. Just a piss poor design all around, no thank...I'll stick with my SR2.
     
    But by all means, you go right ahead and buy one...youll see.
    #7
    servxtrem
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/12 07:24:33 (permalink)
    EVGA_JacobF

    None of the boards you show above have 7 PCI-E slots. Also, the EVGA SR-X is not really considered a server board, sure it can be used for one but Workstation/Enthusiast class is more fitting. The size is the same as SR-2...


    No, they dont have 7 PCI-e slots... But.. wait.. Has anyone been able to fully populate all slots with all lanes to all the GPUs / RAID controllers? And what about space? 2 GPUs kill 4 slots PLUS we get the 8x ones left for use after that...
    #8
    servxtrem
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/12 07:29:40 (permalink)
    EVGA_JacobF

    One of the boards you linked above had 4+4 memory slots... yet this one is ok? There is just not enough room for 8+8 + 4 graphics cards. 8+4 is a good compromise plus makes it easier to upgrade for SR=2 users.

    U see that Tyan Board? 4 FULL PCI-E GEN3 WITH FULL LANES across all slots, + they are spaced so u can fit 4 gpus together, u even have 1 last 8x for the sound controller... So ... more memory? or more lanes?
     
    Anyway, its another though, i dont see the matter to fill all banks if u are using 4 or 8 GB DIMMs...
    #9
    debs3759
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/12 18:52:16 (permalink)
    Iknow that if slot 2 has a GPU slots 1+2 become x8, and likewise for slots 3+4. What I want to know is can I have the following configuration:
     
    x16 x4 x16 x4 x16 x4 x16
     
    That would only use the 40 lanes from the CPU, but I am unsure if 8 are reserved for the motherboard. I also don't know yet (and not sure if anyone outside NVidia knows) whether a high-end Kepler will perform equaly at x8 and x16.
     
    If that can be done, I would use the x4 slots for 3 raid cards (I know I'm limited as to what cards I can use at x4, but it looks like the most economical way to have 4 GPUs at full power and the storage setup I want). For me, if Intel ever release unlocked SKUs, this board will be a folding machine and file server/storage.

     
    Asus Maximus IV Gene-Z
    i7-2700K @ 5 GHz (water cooled)
    8 GB Kingston HyperX @ 2133
    GTX 570 SC (975/1950/2400 @ 1.1V fully stable and folding)
    1000W CoolerMaster Silent Pro Gold (single 12V rail)
    2 * OCZ Vertex3 in RAID 0
     
    #10
    sentient04
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/12 20:18:58 (permalink)
    Are the 8 core 3.1 ghz CPUs Xeon E5-2687W from newegg overclockable (unlocked)? There have been some reports of them not.
    #11
    loveha
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/12 20:21:53 (permalink)
    sentient04

    Are the 8 core 3.1 ghz CPUs Xeon E5-2687W from newegg overclockable (unlocked)? There have been some reports of them not.

    Currently there are no Xeons for socket 2011 that have an unlocked Multiplier.


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    sentient04
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... ****? 2012/03/12 20:24:40 (permalink)
    Can you give me a list of suppliers for this board? Thanks!
    #13
    servxtrem
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... ****? 2012/03/13 08:45:45 (permalink)
    the board is not released yet...
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    servxtrem
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/13 08:50:31 (permalink)
    debs3759

    Iknow that if slot 2 has a GPU slots 1+2 become x8, and likewise for slots 3+4. What I want to know is can I have the following configuration:

    x16 x4 x16 x4 x16 x4 x16

    That would only use the 40 lanes from the CPU, but I am unsure if 8 are reserved for the motherboard. I also don't know yet (and not sure if anyone outside NVidia knows) whether a high-end Kepler will perform equaly at x8 and x16.



    Unfortunely the board DOES NOT have this capibility, that was the reason for my thread here.
     
    The pdf briefely states x16 x16 x16 Or x16 x16 x8 x8
    I assume that is the PLX bridge splitting some lanes... still dont figure out what it is doing there anyway...
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    beaker7
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/13 09:53:00 (permalink)
    Went with Asus.  Maybe SR-4...

    System 1:  Supermicro X9DRG-QF | 2x E5-2690v2 | 256 GB Crucial 1866Mhz ECC | 2x iofx 1.65 TB | LSI 9361-8i + 8x Seagate ST2000NM0043 | Samsung 840 Pro | 3x Quadro K6000 | Red Rocket-X | Corsair AX1200i
    System 2:  Mac Pro 2013 | E5-2690v2 | 64 GB | D700 | 1TB flash 
    System 3:  Asus Z9PE-D8-WS | 2x E5-2687W v2  | 128 GB  |  4x EVGA TITAN BLACK




     
    #16
    servxtrem
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/13 10:53:51 (permalink)
    @ beaker7 are those systems your dream rigs? Or actual ones ?
    o_O
    #17
    beaker7
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/13 11:40:29 (permalink)
    servxtrem

    @ beaker7 are those systems your dream rigs? Or actual ones ?
    o_O

     
    actual, but work pays for some of them 
     

    System 1:  Supermicro X9DRG-QF | 2x E5-2690v2 | 256 GB Crucial 1866Mhz ECC | 2x iofx 1.65 TB | LSI 9361-8i + 8x Seagate ST2000NM0043 | Samsung 840 Pro | 3x Quadro K6000 | Red Rocket-X | Corsair AX1200i
    System 2:  Mac Pro 2013 | E5-2690v2 | 64 GB | D700 | 1TB flash 
    System 3:  Asus Z9PE-D8-WS | 2x E5-2687W v2  | 128 GB  |  4x EVGA TITAN BLACK




     
    #18
    jff1968
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/14 12:52:14 (permalink)
    beaker7

    servxtrem

    @ beaker7 are those systems your dream rigs? Or actual ones ?
    o_O


    actual, but work pays for some of them 


    @ breaker 7 your Raid Controller is it working well?
    #19
    beaker7
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/14 12:53:59 (permalink)
    jff1968

    beaker7

    servxtrem

    @ beaker7 are those systems your dream rigs? Or actual ones ?
    o_O


    actual, but work pays for some of them 


    @ breaker 7 your Raid Controller is it working well?

     
    Yes all are working great.   Also run 2 Arecas in a server in RAID 100 config.  24 ssd.  Works great.

    System 1:  Supermicro X9DRG-QF | 2x E5-2690v2 | 256 GB Crucial 1866Mhz ECC | 2x iofx 1.65 TB | LSI 9361-8i + 8x Seagate ST2000NM0043 | Samsung 840 Pro | 3x Quadro K6000 | Red Rocket-X | Corsair AX1200i
    System 2:  Mac Pro 2013 | E5-2690v2 | 64 GB | D700 | 1TB flash 
    System 3:  Asus Z9PE-D8-WS | 2x E5-2687W v2  | 128 GB  |  4x EVGA TITAN BLACK




     
    #20
    servxtrem
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/14 19:42:21 (permalink)
    1882ix-24 FTW
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    beaker7
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/14 19:53:58 (permalink)
    servxtrem

    1882ix-24 FTW

     
    Better performance and redundancy if you split it across 2.

    System 1:  Supermicro X9DRG-QF | 2x E5-2690v2 | 256 GB Crucial 1866Mhz ECC | 2x iofx 1.65 TB | LSI 9361-8i + 8x Seagate ST2000NM0043 | Samsung 840 Pro | 3x Quadro K6000 | Red Rocket-X | Corsair AX1200i
    System 2:  Mac Pro 2013 | E5-2690v2 | 64 GB | D700 | 1TB flash 
    System 3:  Asus Z9PE-D8-WS | 2x E5-2687W v2  | 128 GB  |  4x EVGA TITAN BLACK




     
    #22
    servxtrem
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/14 22:49:02 (permalink)
    beaker7

    Better performance and redundancy if you split it across 2.

    I know!
    But this is again PCI-e related, u see if u want a couple radeon 7970 GPUs + a good sound controller + a IODRIVE2 DUO for system and games + the 1882ix-24 for the mass 15K RPM reliable storage...
     
     
    #23
    servxtrem
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/14 22:51:33 (permalink)
    btw the 1.2TB SLC flash IODRIVE2 Duo is sold $35,900
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    uoftredphoenix
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/14 23:09:33 (permalink)
    I had notify me in place for the SRX. But I have been contemplating whether or not I should upgrade to SRX. Does not seem like an good solid upgrade for SR2. Just to take advantage of the new 2011 CPUs and possible future unlocked ones but lose on all these important issue mentioned. NOT worth it?
     
    Base on the general SR2 and potential buyers I think INTEL will be paying close attention on how SRX is doing. If mostly negative then I don't think they will even have unlocked ones later.
     
    I don't understand why release 50% done right product and have all these unnecessary feedback that will discourage the engineering & design team ??
     
    I hope next SR version will be better.
    I will have let SRX be a faint memory of the past.
     
    Please pick up Steve Jobs autobiography at Costco and perhaps improve your product. SR2 blows all other motherboards out of the water. If you name any other mobos, my answer is, "Come again? Never heard of that but by the way SR2 is the board"
    post edited by uoftredphoenix - 2012/03/14 23:14:07
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    Brocasta
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/14 23:19:38 (permalink)
    What's to improve? The SR-X is, by all appearances, fine. What would you have preferred EVGA do, cancel the project when they knew that there wouldn't be any unlocked CPUs at launch? Can you imagine the ****storm that would have caused? Based simply on the sudden yanking of the 6gb SAS feature by intel, I don't think EVGA knew all that far ahead of time that there would be no OCable CPUs at launch.
    #26
    uoftredphoenix
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/14 23:43:36 (permalink)
    Appearance I can care less. I didn't say cancel. Postpone!! Even if unlocked CPU is out of their control then work on the pci e issue. Add 3rd party controller, so at least wont be screw up by intel. Dang it, be the 2% why be the 98%.
    #27
    Brocasta
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/15 00:10:06 (permalink)
    Even if they had postponed it, people would have been mad.
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    servxtrem
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/16 11:55:53 (permalink)
    I found a new board:
    The ASUS Z9PE-D8 WS.

    4 x PCIe 3.0/2.0 x16 (dual x16 or quad x8) *1
    2 x PCIe 3.0/2.0 x16 *1
    1 x PCIe 3.0/2.0 x16 (x8 mode) *1
     

      
     
    post edited by servxtrem - 2012/03/16 19:43:21
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    beaker7
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    Re:SR-X AND PCI-EXPRESS... 2012/03/16 12:18:46 (permalink)
    servxtrem

    I found a new board:
    The ASUS Z9PE-D8 WS.
    Curiously, some mess up with PCI-Ex ports...

    4 x PCIe 3.0/2.0 x16 (dual x16 or quad x8) *1
    2 x PCIe 3.0/2.0 x16 *1
    1 x PCIe 3.0/2.0 x16 (x8 mode) *1



     
    How is it a 'mess up' ?
     
     

    System 1:  Supermicro X9DRG-QF | 2x E5-2690v2 | 256 GB Crucial 1866Mhz ECC | 2x iofx 1.65 TB | LSI 9361-8i + 8x Seagate ST2000NM0043 | Samsung 840 Pro | 3x Quadro K6000 | Red Rocket-X | Corsair AX1200i
    System 2:  Mac Pro 2013 | E5-2690v2 | 64 GB | D700 | 1TB flash 
    System 3:  Asus Z9PE-D8-WS | 2x E5-2687W v2  | 128 GB  |  4x EVGA TITAN BLACK




     
    #30
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