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Helpful ReplyHot!SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink

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SilentMarket
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2017/07/15 11:04:32 (permalink)
The problem is the SLI HB bridge blocks 40% left heat sink's air flow, making the cooling effect less effective and overheat the SLI bridge (my finger can't even touch the SLI plate even it's made out of plastic).
GPUs got worse performance (mainly stutter and SLI scaling suddenly drop) and higher temperature (4-5 Celsius) with an SLI HB bridge.


(sorry for the lazy image edit, I just don't want to switch back to HB Bridge)
Right now I only use a single soft SLI bridge and get normal performance though the temperature is still very high (77 Celsius) at 4K (actually is 5120x2160, more than a 4K + 1080P)  99% SLI scaling in Mass Effect Andromeda, one of a few games that uses over 100% GPU power without even overclocking.
 

I think the only way to make a cooler effect is to go for a 600 bucks costume water loop. 
 
About the 77C high temp, it's normal in SLI, especially in Mass Effect. In Unigine Heaven either one of the GPUs will reach beyond 65C.
My Air 540 case has no positive air flow directly into the GPUs. 
Hard drives make it very hard and very little space to install fan beneath the GPUs.

 
 

Though FTW 1080ti's fan and heatsink make most of the air almost directly upward (you can actually feel the wind blow direction with your hand) for better flow this HB Bridge Design flaw just make it a normal performance cooling GPU.

So the conclusion is that I just purchased 2 1080ti and they're very hot...literally.
post edited by SilentMarket - 2017/07/15 11:46:16


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Cool GTX
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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/15 11:16:27 (permalink)
Remove the side panel --> do the temps come down on the GPUs?
 
SLI normally causes the top GPU to run warmer
 
ACX cooler remove a lot of heat, unfortunately most of that heat is dumped into the case.  Your case fans must get the heat out of the case before the warmed air is sucked back into the GPU, starting a loop of warmer & warmer air recirculating through the GPU ----> GPU temps rising
 
What fan curve do you use with your GPU ?
 
What fans are installed in your case & at what speed ?  Do they blow In or Out ?
 
Air 540 case
 
 
Air cooled SLI GPU = Full tower case with great airflow in my book

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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/15 11:20:28 (permalink)
Sorry mate, but they are not just literally "hot". + It's not good for your two hdd's too. You gotta optimize the airflow in your case, that's from my point of view the only option you got. These are tier-one gpu's, they got a lot of performance and that produces heat. I had two cards with acx 2.0 before, - this time I bought a 1080 Ti FE.
 
Edit: You should remove the protection from the two sli-fingers too, in case it's get to warm in that area.
post edited by Carbonshape - 2017/07/16 06:51:12

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SilentMarket
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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/15 12:17:42 (permalink)
Without the side panel, the temperature will drop only 3C (ambient temp is 25C). 
upper GPU use aggressive curve and lower GPU use custom 1:1 50C:50% 60C:60%...


Most of the fans are Noctua fans. 

 


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SilentMarket
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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/15 12:24:16 (permalink)
The lowest air( under the lower GPU) temp is cold, HDD is 34c, I guess these fans take out the hot air in time. 
The problem is there is no direct input GPU air and hot air flow is very focused.
I'll remove the rubber in SLI slot.


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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/15 12:37:13 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby SilentMarket 2017/07/16 09:59:09
Do me a favour and try that curve, all fans togheter... 030% - 030°C --- 050% - 060°C --- 070% - 070°C --- 100% - 080°C
 
Edit: + Is there a dust filter on your forward-fans? If possible, remove it. + Decrease (temporarily) the Power-Limit of your FTW3, you won't loose your stock-boost, but the cards will probably stay colder.
post edited by Carbonshape - 2017/07/15 13:44:50

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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/15 13:19:57 (permalink)
Increase the front intake airflow... to lower dust build up, you want to keep intake volume at slightly higher than exhaust volume. When exhaust is higher than intake, you usually end up sucking in air through cracks or other openings that are unfiltered. If you can't increase it... lower or remove the one rear exhaust. Better yet, since its a 140mm fan, move it to the lower front and replace the 120mm fan there.
 
In addition, too high a speed at the top, will pull all the incoming air up, before they get a chance to blow across the GPUs.
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SilentMarket
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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/15 13:56:10 (permalink)
I removed both the side panel and front panel and dust filter. But your profile is quieter than the one I've been using, the result is 76C.
It seems like that I have to lower the power target from 117% to 100% thus the clock will go down.


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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/15 14:13:47 (permalink)
Both cards do 76°C or did they get higher? If not, you can make adjustments... try 080% - 070°C.
 
Powertarget: Strange... I did that with my Founders and the boost did not decrease.
 
 
 
 

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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/15 14:24:30 (permalink)
Some cases require the side panels to be closed to have the air actually flow through the case. Otherwise, much of the intake will vent directly back out, and the exhaust will just suck fresh air as opposed to having it travel across components between them.
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SilentMarket
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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/15 16:16:07 (permalink)
The upper card is 76C, 2C higher than original fan profile (90%-70C)(both without side panel).
The lower card temp is always under 64C. 
My finger feels the heat flow is super concentrated in the small space between GPUs.
I use OSD to monitor GPU power and clock. The power target (set at 100%) slows down the extra boost clock if GPU power exceeds 100%.
post edited by SilentMarket - 2017/07/15 22:19:17


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SilentMarket
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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/15 16:33:16 (permalink)
Increase the front intake airflow... to lower dust build up, you want to keep intake volume at slightly higher than exhaust volume. When exhaust is higher than intake, you usually end up sucking in air through cracks or other openings that are unfiltered. If you can't increase it... lower or remove the one rear exhaust. Better yet, since its a 140mm fan, move it to the lower front and replace the 120mm fan there.
 
In addition, too high a speed at the top, will pull all the incoming air up, before they get a chance to blow across the GPUs.

 
The top fans are mounted with radiator and they won't blow too much air because of the radiator slows most of the air flow. 
And the reason I mount a 120mm fan in the lower front panel is that only 120mm fan can blow the air into the space between GPUs. A 140mm fan's position is higher and makes less effective cooling. I've tried 140mm before, the upper GPU got higher temperature.
The overall airflow is good. The only thing needs to change is the small space between GPUS. Hot air is concentrated there.
post edited by SilentMarket - 2017/07/15 22:59:18


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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/15 17:46:01 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby SilentMarket 2017/07/16 09:58:39
How many drives do you have? That's a pretty wide case. Seems like there should be enough room to get your HDDs out of the main compartment and to the back side, giving you more room to play with for the video cards. If you have 3 pcie x16/x8 slots can you use slot 1 & 3 and place one of those pci slot blower exhaust cards between the video cards? I know that may require a different SLI bridge but don't they make longer bridges for different configurations?
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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/15 19:13:58 (permalink)
SilentMarket
The top fans are mounted with radiator and they won't blow too much air because of the radiator slows most of the air flow. 
And the reason I mount a 120mm fan in the lower front panel is that only 120mm fan can blow the air into the space between GPUs. A 140mm fan's position is higher and makes less effective cooling. I've tried 140mm before, the upper GPU got higher temperature.
The overall airflow is good. The only thing needs to change is the small space between GPUS. Hot air is concentrated there.


Airflow is good? Doubtful. You said it yourself you have no positive airflow to the GPU. Because you don't have enough to believe it's positive, then you can't be sure the hot air being generated by the GPUs is actually being evacuated from the area.

Are your fans capable of more than 1500 rpm? If so, turn them up just shy of the noise being unbearable. Yes, while the radiators do slow down airflow from the fans, you still have more exhaust volume than intake.

Do a smoke test to prove either you or I being "right."

But ya know what, I'm done with this topic.
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SilentMarket
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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/15 22:02:24 (permalink)
Airflow is good? Doubtful. You said it yourself you have no positive airflow to the GPU. Because you don't have enough to believe it's positive, then you can't be sure the hot air being generated by the GPUs is actually being evacuated from the area.

Are your fans capable of more than 1500 rpm? If so, turn them up just shy of the noise being unbearable. Yes, while the radiators do slow down airflow from the fans, you still have more exhaust volume than intake.

Do a smoke test to prove either you or I being "right."

But ya know what, I'm done with this topic.

 
I did it before like how you think it should be by slowing down the top fan then even switching the front fans with 3 Noctua IPCC industrial 3000rpm 120mm loudest fans.
It makes no difference except makes my PC sound like a jet engine.
As for the positive air flow, the solution I know is to mount the fans beneath the GPUs or cut the side panel a hole to mount side fans.
And the thing I can't do much is to change the air flow between 2 GPUs' small space. The air is tight there.
The HB Bridge just makes temp worse.
post edited by SilentMarket - 2017/07/15 23:02:00


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SilentMarket
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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/15 22:41:29 (permalink)
How many drives do you have? That's a pretty wide case. Seems like there should be enough room to get your HDDs out of the main compartment and to the back side, giving you more room to play with for the video cards. If you have 3 pcie x16/x8 slots can you use slot 1 & 3 and place one of those pci slot blower exhaust cards between the video cards? I know that may require a different SLI bridge but don't they make longer bridges for different configurations?

 
I'm going to take away the HDDs to the backroom and mount fans under the GPU to see the difference.
The 3rd slot has PC front panel connector and system panel connector in there. It blocks the way to insert the installation of lower GPU the size of FTW 1080Ti.
If I remove these connectors the PC won't be able to start by pushing the start button.
post edited by SilentMarket - 2017/07/15 22:54:04


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SilentMarket
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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/15 22:51:09 (permalink)
Yet many people's concern is my case's airflow. The purpose of this post is to distribute the problem of the heat sink with HB SLI bridge which makes higher temps.
I am wondering if there are people with similar build SLI FTW3 1080Ti air cooled and be free to share the temp status of benchmarking at 4K with power target set at 117%.
post edited by SilentMarket - 2017/07/15 22:56:53


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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/16 06:19:39 (permalink)
Both cards do 76°C or did they get higher? If not, you can make adjustments... try 080% - 070°C.
 
Powertarget: Strange... I did that with my Founders and the boost did not decrease.

 
Only the upper card has 76C and my original profile is 90% - 70C. 
The lower card never reaches beyond 64C.
If the power target is set at 100%. When the OSD shows that the GPU power reaches over 100%, the extra boost clock speed will decrease.
Today I swapped two 6TB hard drives below the GPU to the second room. Normally the drive is around 35-36C but after they are set in the second room, both of them rises to 46C. It's because of no fan in the second room and PSU increasing extra heat. At this point, it proves that the cooling in lower GPU is enough for itself and hard drive, but not enough to prevent upper GPU overheating.
 


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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/16 06:44:52 (permalink)
You did a lot. What's left is to change the thermal grease, buy a different case or live with a hoover...
 

 
Edit: + Change the cards, maybe the lower will stay colder on top.

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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/16 07:48:40 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby SilentMarket 2017/07/16 09:44:14
SilentMarket
So the conclusion is that I just purchased 2 1080ti and they're very hot...literally.

They're 280W TDP GPU's, and with the power limit increased this goes even further, don't be surprised they run so warm in SLI.
Especially with these GPU's that aren't a blower style cooler it's important to have enough airflow.
Though it's worth noting that these coolers will probably be a lot less noisy than you'd have with most tunnel-design coolers, and they run pretty hot too under stress.
 
My friend has two FTW3's in SLI inside a HAF X case combined with H100i & noctua 3000RPM (running about 2000~) fans on a i7 5960x, case is inside a badly ventilated desk (before 680 4GB Classified tunnel-blower SLI).
The GPU's both use Precision XOC's aggressive fan curve, 80°C would mean 100% fan speed.
 
The temperatures have been like this when the ambient temperature was about 29-30°C in GTA V (2.5x scaling I think on 1600p):
Main GPU (top): 76°C - fan speed 96%~
Secondary GPU (below): 66°C - fan speed 86%~
 
Temperature with 35°C outside, so likely easily similar ambient temperature:
Main GPU: 79°C - fan speed 99%~
Secondary GPU: 70°C - fan speed 90%~
 
The GPU's still run above 1900Mhz, only 100% power target.
I wouldn't say there is anything wrong with your cards and they perform as expected.
EVGA also uses one of the best TIMs available on the market, which is Shin-Etsu, as confirmed by @EVGA_JacobF:
https://forums.evga.com/FindPost/2502704
This TIM is also used for example by Corsairs AIO watercoolers, so I wouldn't bother to replace the TIM.
 
About the boost clock, with the Pascal GPU's the GPU Boost 3.0 is even more sensitive to temperatures, so even if it can draw enough power you still would want it to run cooler to achieve higher boost clocks.
 
http://www.anandtech.com/show/10325/the-nvidia-geforce-gtx-1080-and-1070-founders-edition-review/15
To start, Pascal clockspeeds are much more temperature-dependent than on Maxwell 2 or Kepler. Kepler would drop a single bin at a specific temperature, and Maxwell 2 would sustain the same clockspeed throughout. However Pascal will drop its clockspeeds as the GPU warms up, regardless of whether it still has formal thermal and TDP headroom to spare. This happens by backing off both on the clockspeed at each individual voltage point, and backing off to lower voltage points altogether.


post edited by CriticalHit_NL - 2017/07/16 07:57:39

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SilentMarket
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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/16 09:57:35 (permalink)
Thanks, it's very helpful.
Doing some change to increase the air flow from down below.
The temp drops down 2-3C, but the fans are only 1200rpm. 
I guess I need to switch the fans with some 3000rpm fans.

My HDDs are 9-10C hotter because of no air flow in the second room :(



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SilentMarket
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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/16 10:07:17 (permalink)
You did a lot. What's left is to change the thermal grease, buy a different case or live with a hoover...
 

 
Edit: + Change the cards, maybe the lower will stay colder on top.

 
I am thinking of buying a motherboard that supports 3 slot spacing SLI with at least x8 x8 to enable SLI since my Z97 motherboard is old and only support PCI X8X4X4, I tried to mount the second GPU at slot 3 but it doesn't work with SLI though the temp is super good because the 120mm just blow right between the GPUs into the 3 slot space.


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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/16 10:25:33 (permalink)
Do you got an i7 with a -K? Try to get that board: EVGA Z97 Classified. That's just options I'm talking about: That Mix is still a powerhouse! And maybe buy a different case, something like the Obsidian 750D airflow... + Don't forget to enjoy your cards!

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SilentMarket
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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/16 19:54:20 (permalink)
Carbonshape
Do you got an i7 with a -K? Try to get that board: EVGA Z97 Classified. That's just options I'm talking about: That Mix is still a powerhouse! And maybe buy a different case, something like the Obsidian 750D airflow... + Don't forget to enjoy your cards!


 
Yes, the PC is mounted with i7-4790K OC at 4600MHz, it's upgraded from 2014 980 SLI build.
I just googled that the Z97 Classified has special SLI ability, very interesting. 
But the motherboard is out of stock everywhere..:(


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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/17 00:55:32 (permalink)
I saw yesterday a few on ebay.
 
Edit: + A Z97 FTW would do the job too... it would be a shame to waste that i7.
post edited by Carbonshape - 2017/07/17 04:46:42

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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/17 20:55:45 (permalink)

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SilentMarket
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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/18 10:26:53 (permalink)
So I paid 200 bucks for an RMAed EVGA Z97 Classified motherboard (all the Z97 now is second-hand or RMAed), it will be delivered in next 12 hours.
The previous owner said the board is deserted since 2015 because he switched newer motherboard for newer generation CPU and never test the old board when it's returned back. I read some reviews on Amazon and Newegg and some other forum said that a faulty Z97 Classified board may killed GPU, kind of strange to me.
The motherboard has PLX switch and the manual (download from EVGA) claims that the board can do x16x16 SLI in PCI lane 1 and lane 4. 

But the owner and some other users notify that the manual is wrong (I have to admit that the manual is a very lazy ****ty manual with the lowest amount of detail for an original 300 bucks card) the board can only do x16x16 SLI in PCI lane 2 and PCI lane 4, which is the same 2 slots space compared with my current MSI Z97 gaming 5. This won't reduce the overheating problem. 
 
So the question is if the board is function normally (I'll try with my old 980s first to test the board) and I give up x16x16, can I do x16x8 SLI like this?

or even lower like this? (there is no gold finger lock in PCI 6)

 
 
 
 
 


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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/18 10:45:56 (permalink)
Ouh Mr. SilentMarket! First, I did not force you to anything, sorry. But I think you made a wise move. Besides, I got an Z87-Classy which is a very decent board that never ever compromised me. In fact, it is the best board I ever had. Well, you gotta assemble your stuff and if you do that right, there is NOTHING to worry about. You can write me via pm too, kind regards.
 
P.S. I know, the manual sucks. ^^ Contact the EVGA-dudes, I'm confident they will help you. - MAY THE FORCE BE WITH YOU
P.P.S. How's the condition of the board?
 
Edit:...
post edited by Carbonshape - 2017/07/18 10:48:08

Corsair Obsidian 900D - Crucial (Micron) 2x8GB Ballistix Elite @ 1866MHz - EVGA (Nvidia) 1080 Ti Founders Edition - Supernova 750 G2 - Z87 Classified - Func KB-460 - MS-3² - Intel i7-4770K - Samsung 850 Pro 512GB - s24e450 HDMI Monitor
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bcavnaugh
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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/18 11:02:52 (permalink)

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w318ti
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Re: SLI Problem with FTW3's heat sink 2017/07/18 11:13:04 (permalink)
If this board is pcie 3.0 you really shouldn't see a performance difference between the x16 or x8 slots, so you should have a lot of options.

With pcie 2.0 yes you may have a small performance decrease using the x8 slots vs the x16 slots, so best to stick to the confirmed x16 slots if possible.
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