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Helpful ReplyHot!Memory support

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B0baganoosh
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2021/03/29 04:24:25 (permalink)
I was just curious if anyone could tell me EVGA's normal timing for putting out QVLs for memory on a new motherboard launch. Is this something I shouldn't really worry about and just try to get the best kit ahead of time? (there's a 10% off sale on Newegg today lol). I was just thinking that if they launched it and didn't release a QVL at launch, I'd just have to take a shot anyway. Seems like going for the best 2x16GB kit of G.Skill b-die I can find should be fine maybe? Specifically looking at F4-4000C16D-32GTZR if anybody wants to weigh in. Thanks.

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rblaes_99
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Re: Memory support 2021/03/29 07:04:54 (permalink)
I'm eyeballing the same ram kit.  those or the royals.  


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B0baganoosh
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Re: Memory support 2021/03/29 09:24:42 (permalink)
From Jacob:

https://twitter.com/EVGA_...76568308695101440?s=19

"You should be fine with those :) Actually going forward the QVL memory lists will be retired, no real known compatibility issues with memory that falls under spec."

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EVGATech_LeeM
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Re: Memory support 2021/03/29 10:38:40 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby Nike_7688 2021/03/29 10:44:11
We usually publish a QVL when the product goes in-stock or shortly thereafter.  Generally speaking, the only place I would expect to see any compatibility issues is on the extreme high-side of the memory overclocking limit, which would be normal for every board.
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ty_ger07
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Re: Memory support 2021/03/29 11:49:05 (permalink)
Nike_7688
"You should be fine with those :) Actually going forward the QVL memory lists will be retired, no real known compatibility issues with memory that falls under spec."

That's a pretty lazy approach. The purpose of QVL is to verify that the memory works and so that the motherboard manufacturer has a chance to work with the memory and optimize the board's sub-timings. If the QVL is retired, memory compatibility could suffer and memory performance could suffer.
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B0baganoosh
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Re: Memory support 2021/03/29 12:16:24 (permalink)
ty_ger07
Nike_7688
"You should be fine with those :) Actually going forward the QVL memory lists will be retired, no real known compatibility issues with memory that falls under spec."

That's a pretty lazy approach. The purpose of QVL is to verify that the memory works and so that the motherboard manufacturer has a chance to work with the memory and optimize the board's sub-timings. If the QVL is retired, memory compatibility could suffer and memory performance could suffer.



It depends on how they do it, really.
 
For example, if you look at the z490, it says "Memory Support – 2 DIMM Dual-Channel (up to 64GB) DDR4 4800MHz+" on the specs. If they did a good enough job testing all sorts of memory up to that point and everything works great, than I don't see an issue with it. If there are 25 kits in the world that run 4800MHz and only 1 of them is compatible...yeah...no good. I think the execution is the important part and we can only wait to see how that goes.

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ty_ger07
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Re: Memory support 2021/03/29 14:11:36 (permalink)
Nike_7688
ty_ger07
Nike_7688
"You should be fine with those :) Actually going forward the QVL memory lists will be retired, no real known compatibility issues with memory that falls under spec."

That's a pretty lazy approach. The purpose of QVL is to verify that the memory works and so that the motherboard manufacturer has a chance to work with the memory and optimize the board's sub-timings. If the QVL is retired, memory compatibility could suffer and memory performance could suffer.



It depends on how they do it, really.
 
For example, if you look at the z490, it says "Memory Support – 2 DIMM Dual-Channel (up to 64GB) DDR4 4800MHz+" on the specs. If they did a good enough job testing all sorts of memory up to that point and everything works great, than I don't see an issue with it. If there are 25 kits in the world that run 4800MHz and only 1 of them is compatible...yeah...no good. I think the execution is the important part and we can only wait to see how that goes.


What does that have to do with testing, validating, and optimizing board sub-timings?
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HeavyHemi
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Re: Memory support 2021/03/29 14:56:56 (permalink)
Nike_7688
ty_ger07
Nike_7688
"You should be fine with those :) Actually going forward the QVL memory lists will be retired, no real known compatibility issues with memory that falls under spec."

That's a pretty lazy approach. The purpose of QVL is to verify that the memory works and so that the motherboard manufacturer has a chance to work with the memory and optimize the board's sub-timings. If the QVL is retired, memory compatibility could suffer and memory performance could suffer.



It depends on how they do it, really.
 
For example, if you look at the z490, it says "Memory Support – 2 DIMM Dual-Channel (up to 64GB) DDR4 4800MHz+" on the specs. If they did a good enough job testing all sorts of memory up to that point and everything works great, than I don't see an issue with it. If there are 25 kits in the world that run 4800MHz and only 1 of them is compatible...yeah...no good. I think the execution is the important part and we can only wait to see how that goes.


When you eliminate standards, which is what a QVL is, they have a way of eroding. Depending upon 'testing random memory sticks' and putty a happy face 'everything works great' seems ad hoc and unprofessional. There is the point though, that QVL's become less useful (for memory) unless frequently updated after a board is released. Interestingly enough I was 5 seconds away from pulling the trigger on  that same memory, 32GB, on my X99 to 'upgrade' from my Dominator C16 3200. Decided it just wasn't worth it. Waiting for the release of the 3080 Ti.

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B0baganoosh
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Re: Memory support 2021/03/29 15:30:58 (permalink)
ty_ger07
Nike_7688
ty_ger07
Nike_7688
"You should be fine with those :) Actually going forward the QVL memory lists will be retired, no real known compatibility issues with memory that falls under spec."

That's a pretty lazy approach. The purpose of QVL is to verify that the memory works and so that the motherboard manufacturer has a chance to work with the memory and optimize the board's sub-timings. If the QVL is retired, memory compatibility could suffer and memory performance could suffer.



It depends on how they do it, really.
 
For example, if you look at the z490, it says "Memory Support – 2 DIMM Dual-Channel (up to 64GB) DDR4 4800MHz+" on the specs. If they did a good enough job testing all sorts of memory up to that point and everything works great, than I don't see an issue with it. If there are 25 kits in the world that run 4800MHz and only 1 of them is compatible...yeah...no good. I think the execution is the important part and we can only wait to see how that goes.


What does that have to do with testing, validating, and optimizing board sub-timings?

Literally everything. If they test and validate a wide enough range of memory, do they really need to call out specific skus? What happens if a year after they put out a qvl, there are 100 new skus out there. Should they test all of them? Where/when does it end? I'm not even saying you're entirely wrong (or even wrong at all) with your concerns, I'm just saying if they're thorough enough, I don't care if there's a specific list of narrowed down parts when many others will work just as well.

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HeavyHemi
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Re: Memory support 2021/03/29 17:36:13 (permalink)
Nike_7688
ty_ger07
Nike_7688
ty_ger07
Nike_7688
"You should be fine with those :) Actually going forward the QVL memory lists will be retired, no real known compatibility issues with memory that falls under spec."

That's a pretty lazy approach. The purpose of QVL is to verify that the memory works and so that the motherboard manufacturer has a chance to work with the memory and optimize the board's sub-timings. If the QVL is retired, memory compatibility could suffer and memory performance could suffer.



It depends on how they do it, really.
 
For example, if you look at the z490, it says "Memory Support – 2 DIMM Dual-Channel (up to 64GB) DDR4 4800MHz+" on the specs. If they did a good enough job testing all sorts of memory up to that point and everything works great, than I don't see an issue with it. If there are 25 kits in the world that run 4800MHz and only 1 of them is compatible...yeah...no good. I think the execution is the important part and we can only wait to see how that goes.


What does that have to do with testing, validating, and optimizing board sub-timings?

Literally everything. If they test and validate a wide enough range of memory, do they really need to call out specific skus? What happens if a year after they put out a qvl, there are 100 new skus out there. Should they test all of them? Where/when does it end? I'm not even saying you're entirely wrong (or even wrong at all) with your concerns, I'm just saying if they're thorough enough, I don't care if there's a specific list of narrowed down parts when many others will work just as well.

"You should be fine with those :) Actually going forward the QVL memory lists will be retired, no real known compatibility issues with memory that falls under spec."
 
Marketing... I wonder if the engineering dept cleared that.

Okay, but you're literally arguing going forward, they do not need to do this. Of course, they literally do need to test compatibility for new memory and new boards as they are released. The issue is how long should one expect a manufacturer to maintain a QVL,  and how extensive should it be. Some of the top end board makers use the QVL as a selling point.
post edited by HeavyHemi - 2021/03/29 17:41:25

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EVGATech_LeeM
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Re: Memory support 2021/03/29 18:14:22 (permalink)
Perhaps you all might have read too far into Jacob's statement.  Jacob's statement referred to publicly posting lists of memory from the memory kits that were tested during development.
 
There are always dozens to hundreds of kits of memory that our engineering team will never be able to test (or may have available) during the life cycle of a product.  However, it is the very rare case that a kit of memory that falls within the listed specs of the motherboard will turn out to be unsupported at its rated speed. Either way, traditionally, we only post the kits of memory that pass testing and there are rarely any that fail (usually because of a bad stick).  Because of this, however, we get many calls and emails from people asking if a certain unlisted kit of memory will work on the motherboard, and the answer is that we expect it will work so long as it falls within the rated specs.
 
Our MB team will still do their due diligence to test memory throughout the engineering and qualification phases of a motherboard's design phase and it would be ludicrous to stop doing this.  It seems some of you think this is what Jacob meant.  We will still have an internal list of memory that were tested, along with the pass/fail data.  Going forward, instead of listing an incomplete and partial list of memory kits tested that will work on the motherboard, it will be far more efficient to list memory kits that are deemed to be incompatible with our motherboard.
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B0baganoosh
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Re: Memory support 2021/03/29 19:31:14 (permalink)
Thanks, Lee. That's pretty much exactly what I read from that.

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bk1887
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Re: Memory support 2021/10/02 09:09:59 (permalink)
Just wondering where the lists of ''deemed incompatible RAM" are. I'm unable to locate them.
 
I have come across people who have bought RAM not on the QVL that have had to run the RAM at JEDEC settings because they get things like blue screens when trying to run an XMP profile. And these are kits that are well inside spec on these boards. Note examples I have readily available are ASUS boards, I don't know of anything with EVGA boards though I would like to know what EVGA believes it does differently than other board manufacturers to ensure that virtually any kit inside spec will be compatible. Also what if the user community finds a kit that does not run stable with an XMP profile and must run at JEDEC settings? Do we contact support and let them know so it can be addressed in the next BIOS update?
 
Thanks in advance. I would really appreciate if someone from EVGA can respond to this. This is the single factor that is making me nervous about purchasing an EVGA board. If I know that EVGA has a good system in place for addressing memory incompatibility issues for kits that run well inside MB spec without any oddball's around the particular kit like Voltage out of spec with DDR4/5 (i.e. increased voltage on some kits to hit high frequencies) that would allay my concerns.
 
As a system builder I've always bought from the QVL and have never had a problem following this approach, I also recommend this approach to any new system builder. I don't feel that EVGA's messaging has adequately addressed the gap that having no QVL leaves. Ideally would also like to see this messaging made clear to consumers on the site.
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rblaes_99
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Re: Memory support 2021/10/04 15:38:18 (permalink)
bk1887
Just wondering where the lists of ''deemed incompatible RAM" are. I'm unable to locate them.
 
I have come across people who have bought RAM not on the QVL that have had to run the RAM at JEDEC settings because they get things like blue screens when trying to run an XMP profile. And these are kits that are well inside spec on these boards. Note examples I have readily available are ASUS boards, I don't know of anything with EVGA boards though I would like to know what EVGA believes it does differently than other board manufacturers to ensure that virtually any kit inside spec will be compatible. Also what if the user community finds a kit that does not run stable with an XMP profile and must run at JEDEC settings? Do we contact support and let them know so it can be addressed in the next BIOS update?
 
Thanks in advance. I would really appreciate if someone from EVGA can respond to this. This is the single factor that is making me nervous about purchasing an EVGA board. If I know that EVGA has a good system in place for addressing memory incompatibility issues for kits that run well inside MB spec without any oddball's around the particular kit like Voltage out of spec with DDR4/5 (i.e. increased voltage on some kits to hit high frequencies) that would allay my concerns.
 
As a system builder I've always bought from the QVL and have never had a problem following this approach, I also recommend this approach to any new system builder. I don't feel that EVGA's messaging has adequately addressed the gap that having no QVL leaves. Ideally would also like to see this messaging made clear to consumers on the site.




I think you are missing what the actual issue is.....   and the reason the QVLs by Mobo are getting scarce.....
 
The RAM results are based on the CPU IMC as much as the motherboard, and EVGA (or anyone else) can't guarantee anything.  This whole gear business is wild as well.  Nereus, Bobagannosh, and I all tested the SAME RAM kit on different EVGA 590 FTWs/Darks with different results....  We also have different 11900ks.....


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