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Hot!Help planning for first loop.

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4STAR
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2018/12/24 15:27:28 (permalink)
So I'm doing my first loop because the ftw3 2080ti is just to hot and loud. If I knew I was going to WC I would of saved a few hundred bucks and got something else.....womp womp womp. 
 
So I like the idea of an external rad for easier maintenance and I can pretty much keep the inside of my PC case super tidy and transition back to air easier if need be.
 
I have some questions about D5 pumps in series. I like the idea of redundancy, being able to run the pump at a quieter setting and the increased head pressure if I decide to use QDC. Also, not to sure about temp and flow sensors placement.
 
 
 
Case - Fractal design s2
GPU block - evga hydrocopper ftw3 2080 ti
CPU block - Heatkiller pro iv
Rad - heatkiller MO-RA3 pro 420 
Rad Fans - 4 or 8 noctua nf-a20
Tubing - 10/16 non glossy black tubing
Fittings - barrow 10/16
Pump/res combo - Heatkiller with D5 pump
Second pump - d5 pump with heatkiller top
PCI passthrough in the vertical bracket mount.
 
Here is my first draft of the general idea....I'm still learning, but would appreciate some feedback. 
 
What do you think so far ?
 
https://imgur.com/eqej40g
 
post edited by 4STAR - 2018/12/24 15:43:03
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    Cool GTX
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    Re: Help planning for first loop. 2018/12/24 16:18:26 (permalink)
    moving to Overclocking, Cooling and Benchmarking

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    Cool GTX
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    Re: Help planning for first loop. 2018/12/24 16:24:25 (permalink)
    1 D5 will have no issues with your loop.  If your not running the PC unattended 24x7 you could just "stock" a spare pump.

    This is a Huge external radiator, that you picked out  Heatkiller MO-RA3 pro 420


    I find the 45mm & 60mm thick radiators to be the better ones from a cooling point of view. 
    (I would never use a thinner radiator unless forced to by the case lacking room for 45mm thick radiator, I'd probable just buy a bigger case)
     
    Basic rule of thumb: one 120mm X 45mm space per device +1
     
    So, 1-GPU + 1-CPU = 2 + 1 spare = 360mm X 45mm as the minimum radiator
     
    RTX & More than 8 CPU Cores I would go +2 as these generate more heat
     
    140mm wide radiators have much more surface area & if they fit your case, you should consider using them. (I know your looking at external radiator)

    Typical 3 slot radiator compare:
      Width 120mm - Length 360mm radiator = 43,200 mm^2
      Width 140mm - Length 420mm radiator = 58,800 mm^2  (+36% area increase)
     
    Radiator Summery by Fan layout
     
    Radiator Size Estimator


    You will find a lot of good info in the links in this thread:
    Ready to try water cooling. Where to start? Library of links-basics to expert 

    Place a drain at the low point in your loop - makes maintenance much easier 

    Plan for easy of filling the loop.

    Some people like the quick disconnects and with an external radiator they may be useful if you ever want to move the PC.



     

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    4STAR
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    Re: Help planning for first loop. 2018/12/24 17:01:31 (permalink)
    Cool GTX
    1 D5 will have no issues with your loop.  If your not running the PC unattended 24x7 you could just "stock" a spare pump.

    This is a Huge external radiator, that you picked out  Heatkiller MO-RA3 pro 420


    I find the 45mm & 60mm thick radiators to be the better ones from a cooling point of view. 
    (I would never use a thinner radiator unless forced to by the case lacking room for 45mm thick radiator, I'd probable just buy a bigger case)

    Basic rule of thumb: one 120mm X 45mm space per device +1

    So, 1-GPU + 1-CPU = 2 + 1 spare = 360mm X 45mm as the minimum radiator

    RTX & More than 8 CPU Cores I would go +2 as these generate more heat

    140mm wide radiators have much more surface area & if they fit your case, you should consider using them. (I know your looking at external radiator)

    Typical 3 slot radiator compare:
    Width 120mm - Length 360mm radiator = 43,200 mm^2
    Width 140mm - Length 420mm radiator = 58,800 mm^2  (+36% area increase)

    Radiator Summery by Fan layout

    Radiator Size Estimator


    You will find a lot of good info in the links in this thread:
    Ready to try water cooling. Where to start? Library of links-basics to expert 

    Place a drain at the low point in your loop - makes maintenance much easier 

    Plan for easy of filling the loop.

    Some people like the quick disconnects and with an external radiator they may be useful if you ever want to move the PC.



     




     
     
    What's important to me is the silence from oversizing my rad requirements(I know there's a point of diminishing returns). I was going to go with (2) 360 rads in the case and was concerned about keeping things quiet as possible with 1k rpm fan speed or less. I have never heard fans through a rad so I don't know what to expect. I saw this mo-ra3 and it just made more sense from a noise and ease of maintenance perspective .
     
    My pc is on my desk and the rad will be practically on the floor, that's going to introduce longer tubing than typical builds and increase the amount of height the pump has to overcome. Since I have never worked with any of these products I don't know what to expect. I just do not want to have to run that pump at full speed, again noise.
     
    Does my diagram make sense ? Mainly for running the pumps in series. Ill be sure to have a drain port at the bottom. Where would you put temp and flow sensors in my diagram ?
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    Cool GTX
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    Re: Help planning for first loop. 2018/12/24 17:22:55 (permalink)
    You can buy dual D5 pump tops also
     
    Cleaning the radiators will probably need to happen more often, unless you figure out how to use filters - especially if placing it on the floor
     
    Flow indicator anywhere it is easy to see.
     
    Many people will use dual temp sensors to understand how well the loop is cooling after any adjustments to fans or pumps. 

    If you measure both the Hot before the radiator & the "cold" after the radiator you will see how the adjustment affects your system
     
    I personally do not use them - I just monitor the hardware temps

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    GGTV-Jon
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    Re: Help planning for first loop. 2018/12/25 00:17:44 (permalink)
    Fluid dynamics is a funny thing, ignore pumping pressure needs on anything below the pump. Anything below the pump might add flow resistance through fittings and radiator resistance but the fluid will try to equalize in height so in reality you are not pumping from the floor up. Pressure required is for anything above the pump head + fitting resistance. Reservoir volume / height above the pump will add to pump inlet pressure and affect possible pump pressure output
     
    I could see maybe running the pumps in parallel for volume because if you only have the blocks above the pump you will not need a bunch of pressure, in series they would be overkill pressure wise which might lead to undue leaks
    If you were running multiple radiators and smaller tubing with a bunch of 90deg fittings then pressure might become and issue
    That 1 big radiator is built like a vehicle radiator and in reality is not going to have a bunch of inherent resistance.
    Looked at the pictures from the link above and it is more like and early AC evaporator core on an vehicle.
     
    Read this page - http://thermalbench.com/2016/09/12/watercool-heatkiller-mo-ra3-420-pro-radiator/3/
     

    There is no question here: The MO-RA3 420 is an extremely restrictive radiator to liquid flow, and you will need to get a good pump to run this in a loop with CPU/GPU blocks in it. The reason it is so restrictive has been discussed previously, but as a reminder it is because of the 20 pass tubing here which is not overcome by the use of the round, thick tubing split 4 ways in parallel. The biggest factor though is simple- it is a huge 9×140 radiator.

     
    I can now see why you were concerned about flow. But it still stands as far as having the radiator below the pump - the fluid will naturally want to equilize and you will only be fighting the inherent resistance of flow through the tubes
     
    They had a chance to make something really cool and then fell short with this design

     
    post edited by GGTV-Jon - 2018/12/25 12:02:39

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    4STAR
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    Re: Help planning for first loop. 2018/12/26 15:27:35 (permalink)
    Man, im going to have to wait over a week to get an answer to such simple questions from watercool….holiday schedules.
     
    I need to know if I can fit 2 res adapters to the mo-ra3. I think that will determine if I go for 2 pumps or not, because even if the mounting holes do not fit, ill just drill holes in it. Ill get the 200 size res if I go single pump, but Ill have to get maybe the 100 res if I go 2 pumps.....just dunno. https://imgur.com/X9DL0Sl   https://imgur.com/kYDhOve Anyone know the dimensions of the adapter and d5 pump mount by chance ? ;p so far cant find it. 
     
    Also, I thought the pwm d5 was solely controlled/powered by the mobo header, but its powered by molex (guys I know NOTHING about WC lol). I have a unused PSU that Ill use to cycle or leak test my system. If I connect a pwm d5 to molex power without the pwm being connected, will the pump run full speed ? If not I will probably get the vario.
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    GGTV-Jon
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    Re: Help planning for first loop. 2018/12/26 20:31:40 (permalink)
    The d5's that EK sells will run at full speed with just the molex connected. With this setup all pump power is pulled through the molex so the fan headers on the motherboards do not have to carry the current, they just have the tach wire and PWM wire going to the fan header
     
    The setup you are looking at with the pump going to be fairly close top the bottom of the radiator and floor then yes - you will need a bit of pressure. Might want to check with them to see what the max rated pressure for the unit it (by what I have seen of the construction it should be well over anything you create pressure wise) but you will have to keep an eye on what the blocks and fittings are rated for.
     
    It would be interesting to see what the pressures were at the inlet and outlet of the pump versus the highest point on the loop as this is a closed loop. What are the affects of the head pressures on the pump from the vertical volume on the pump outlet versus what is at the pump inlet from the returning fluid. With it being a closed loop is it static (outside of flow resistance due to loop components)?
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    GTXJackBauer
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    Re: Help planning for first loop. 2018/12/30 06:54:58 (permalink)
    You're going to spend a good amount for a external setups plus external setups are eye sores unless you're looking to move it around often OR the case just doesn't support a full custom setup.

    I'm not sure if its been said but have you bothered looking at a EVGA AIO Kit just to keep the temps cooler on the GPU in hopes the sound goes down a bit as well?  Much cheaper option otherwise if you're still dead on in custom liquid cooling, try getting a bigger case to house everything in it and make it look nice but again it's all personal preference so if external is your thing, have at it and keep us posted.
     
    Also make sure you understand airflow and dust.  Don't want that external rad caking in dust over time on that floor.
     
    Last but not least, read up on custom water cooling for beginners around the web before just diving in if you haven't.  Lots to great reads to understand it all and the maintenance involved.
    post edited by GTXJackBauer - 2018/12/30 06:57:49

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    4STAR
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    Re: Help planning for first loop. 2018/12/30 11:36:55 (permalink)
    GTXJackBauer
    You're going to spend a good amount for a external setups plus external setups are eye sores unless you're looking to move it around often OR the case just doesn't support a full custom setup.

    I'm not sure if its been said but have you bothered looking at a EVGA AIO Kit just to keep the temps cooler on the GPU in hopes the sound goes down a bit as well?  Much cheaper option otherwise if you're still dead on in custom liquid cooling, try getting a bigger case to house everything in it and make it look nice but again it's all personal preference so if external is your thing, have at it and keep us posted.
     
    Also make sure you understand airflow and dust.  Don't want that external rad caking in dust over time on that floor.
     
    Last but not least, read up on custom water cooling for beginners around the web before just diving in if you haven't.  Lots to great reads to understand it all and the maintenance involved.


     
     
     
     
    AIO's just do not do it for me, plus I have a D15 and I do not want hot air blowing into the AIO (sorta defeats the purpose of less noise/thermals) or the AIO taking fresh air from the D15 - depending on placement.  I have a s2 and was going to put (2) 360 rads, but this external rad should much quieter - more surface area and no mesh filters to overcome.
     
    The rad wont literally be on the floor, but it will be below the computer. I just said the floor in worse case scenario in regards to overcoming more head pressure. Didn't know if it would make that much of a difference or not - or if it was even an issue. Also Im a dust freak, so dust has no chance with me ;p !
     
     
    I think I might put the rad at another location (only other option) that will be basically level with my desk...
     
     
     
     
     
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    4STAR
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    Re: Help planning for first loop. 2018/12/30 13:06:01 (permalink)
    My biggest concern is hooking all this up and the pump noise being louder than I thought - that's why I wanted 2 pumps. I have very, very good hearing.
     
    This user on another forum with the same rad states "cpu, gpu and AC usb highflowmeter I had about 210l/h at 100%.
    Radiator is a mo-ra3 420. tube is EK ZMT 16/10 (or 5/8 x 3/8)". 
     
    I think im just going to go for 1 D5 after all. He added a bunch of stuff like a filter and QDC, more 90 degree fittings and it brought down flow to 80l/h with a 3c delta.....so I guess without all of that, running a single D5 pump at 50% would still net a better flow rate than that.
     
     
     
     
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    Re: Help planning for first loop. 2018/12/30 13:17:05 (permalink)
    4STAR
    My biggest concern is hooking all this up and the pump noise being louder than I thought - that's why I wanted 2 pumps. I have very, very good hearing.
     
    This user on another forum with the same rad states "cpu, gpu and AC usb highflowmeter I had about 210l/h at 100%.
    Radiator is a mo-ra3 420. tube is EK ZMT 16/10 (or 5/8 x 3/8)". 
     
    I think im just going to go for 1 D5 after all. He added a bunch of stuff like a filter and QDC, more 90 degree fittings and it brought down flow to 80l/h with a 3c delta.....so I guess without all of that, running a single D5 pump at 50% would still net a better flow rate than that.
     
     
     
     




    Sorry if you posted this above but exactly which pump are you looking at? Link?
     
    The pumps are generally rubber mounted to their carrier housing. I made an aluminum bracket to mount the carrier housing of my EK-XRes 140Evo directly to the floor of my case.
    Pump running at 100% and no noise. I too was concerned that there might be noise from vibration transfer - nada - completely silent
    #12
    GTXJackBauer
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    Re: Help planning for first loop. 2018/12/31 01:38:31 (permalink)
    4STAR
    My biggest concern is hooking all this up and the pump noise being louder than I thought - that's why I wanted 2 pumps. I have very, very good hearing.
     
    This user on another forum with the same rad states "cpu, gpu and AC usb highflowmeter I had about 210l/h at 100%.
    Radiator is a mo-ra3 420. tube is EK ZMT 16/10 (or 5/8 x 3/8)". 
     
    I think im just going to go for 1 D5 after all. He added a bunch of stuff like a filter and QDC, more 90 degree fittings and it brought down flow to 80l/h with a 3c delta.....so I guess without all of that, running a single D5 pump at 50% would still net a better flow rate than that.
     



    Yeah, that rad is great as it will literally handle anything you throw at it.  Those noctua fans are nice as well.  One thing I will say, the 120mm rad and fan versions usually perform optimally while the 140mm is out there but not as standard as the 120.  The Noctua NF-A12x25 are one of newest and best rad fans in the market therefore, I would highly recommend the MO-RA3 360 PRO to go along with those newer NF-A12x25 Noctuas.  I can't stand their color schemes but nothing like a MORA fan grill couldn't fix.  
     
    Just make sure you've considered a self powering PWM fan hub that powers from the PSU while getting it's PWM signal from the MB PWM header and only has a single RPM single lead coming back to it for accurate readings.  I think the Swiftech 8-way PWM splitter or Silverstone can do that job.  You might need two splitters since you might be running two pumps (in serial config. I hope) or you can grab the much cheaper Swiftech PWM splitter cable, that's if you're running two PWM pumps in serial and want them sync'd.  So we're clear, you'd have the CPU PWM header for the two pumps on PWM splitter and presumable a secondary CPU or PWM fan header on the MB for the rad fans.  You'll probably need PWM extension cables to run it out the back and vise versa.  Just hope the PWM signals are strong enough for it all.
     
    While the DDC pumps like the MCP35X have more head pressure to push through the loop, the D5s are much quieter.  Either or is fine but a single D5 should do you justice and having two is great too.  Most users have told me over the years once you head to setting 4 of 5 (Vario version) and higher is when you might start hearing the pump but again, D5 are the quieter pumps of the 2 premium pumps so I think you're good on that front.


    As for the pump reservoir combo, I think you're set on that front.  I know I've seen some wicked setups with the pump/res long tube combos attached to the MORA.  Not sure if I've seen dual pump in serial as of yet but that would be interesting for sure.
     
    As for tubing, check out PrimoChill Advanced LRT.  Best tubing around.

    Fittings, I always advise to possibly grab a few angle fittings just in case based on your blue print where you think you might need one as there's no need to stress the tubing or the fittings.
     
    Other than that, I think you have it figured out so far and if we don't speak, have a Happy New Year and see you in 2019!

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    4STAR
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    Re: Help planning for first loop. 2019/01/01 15:16:16 (permalink)
    GGTV-Jon
    4STAR
    My biggest concern is hooking all this up and the pump noise being louder than I thought - that's why I wanted 2 pumps. I have very, very good hearing.
     
    This user on another forum with the same rad states "cpu, gpu and AC usb highflowmeter I had about 210l/h at 100%.
    Radiator is a mo-ra3 420. tube is EK ZMT 16/10 (or 5/8 x 3/8)". 
     
    I think im just going to go for 1 D5 after all. He added a bunch of stuff like a filter and QDC, more 90 degree fittings and it brought down flow to 80l/h with a 3c delta.....so I guess without all of that, running a single D5 pump at 50% would still net a better flow rate than that.
     
     
     
     




    Sorry if you posted this above but exactly which pump are you looking at? Link?
     
    The pumps are generally rubber mounted to their carrier housing. I made an aluminum bracket to mount the carrier housing of my EK-XRes 140Evo directly to the floor of my case.
    Pump running at 100% and no noise. I too was concerned that there might be noise from vibration transfer - nada - completely silent




     
    I do not have a specific D5 pump in mind yet. I was just wondering if the pwm pumps ran at full speed without the pwm signal telling it what to run at, for bleeding purposes. That's good to hear about noise and vibrations. Some discussions about that going on at OC dot net right now. I hear so many contradicting experiences.
     
    Sometimes I wonder when people say they cant hear the pump, if its because other parts of their computer are making more noise, like the fans....noise is so subjective and it also depends on other factors that may not have been shared when reading others experience.
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    4STAR
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    Re: Help planning for first loop. 2019/01/01 15:36:08 (permalink)
    GTXJackBauer
    4STAR
    My biggest concern is hooking all this up and the pump noise being louder than I thought - that's why I wanted 2 pumps. I have very, very good hearing.
     
    This user on another forum with the same rad states "cpu, gpu and AC usb highflowmeter I had about 210l/h at 100%.
    Radiator is a mo-ra3 420. tube is EK ZMT 16/10 (or 5/8 x 3/8)". 
     
    I think im just going to go for 1 D5 after all. He added a bunch of stuff like a filter and QDC, more 90 degree fittings and it brought down flow to 80l/h with a 3c delta.....so I guess without all of that, running a single D5 pump at 50% would still net a better flow rate than that.
     



    Yeah, that rad is great as it will literally handle anything you throw at it.  Those noctua fans are nice as well.  One thing I will say, the 120mm rad and fan versions usually perform optimally while the 140mm is out there but not as standard as the 120.  The Noctua NF-A12x25 are one of newest and best rad fans in the market therefore, I would highly recommend the MO-RA3 360 PRO to go along with those newer NF-A12x25 Noctuas.  I can't stand their color schemes but nothing like a MORA fan grill couldn't fix.  
     
    Just make sure you've considered a self powering PWM fan hub that powers from the PSU while getting it's PWM signal from the MB PWM header and only has a single RPM single lead coming back to it for accurate readings.  I think the Swiftech 8-way PWM splitter or Silverstone can do that job.  You might need two splitters since you might be running two pumps (in serial config. I hope) or you can grab the much cheaper Swiftech PWM splitter cable, that's if you're running two PWM pumps in serial and want them sync'd.  So we're clear, you'd have the CPU PWM header for the two pumps on PWM splitter and presumable a secondary CPU or PWM fan header on the MB for the rad fans.  You'll probably need PWM extension cables to run it out the back and vise versa.  Just hope the PWM signals are strong enough for it all.
     
    While the DDC pumps like the MCP35X have more head pressure to push through the loop, the D5s are much quieter.  Either or is fine but a single D5 should do you justice and having two is great too.  Most users have told me over the years once you head to setting 4 of 5 (Vario version) and higher is when you might start hearing the pump but again, D5 are the quieter pumps of the 2 premium pumps so I think you're good on that front.


    As for the pump reservoir combo, I think you're set on that front.  I know I've seen some wicked setups with the pump/res long tube combos attached to the MORA.  Not sure if I've seen dual pump in serial as of yet but that would be interesting for sure.
     
    As for tubing, check out PrimoChill Advanced LRT.  Best tubing around.

    Fittings, I always advise to possibly grab a few angle fittings just in case based on your blue print where you think you might need one as there's no need to stress the tubing or the fittings.
     
    Other than that, I think you have it figured out so far and if we don't speak, have a Happy New Year and see you in 2019!




     
    Oh ya, those nf-a12's are the ones I would get if going 120mm.  Noctua says they're coming out with black ones at the end of this year. I think they're coming out with a 140mm varient as well. I ended up putting a classic nf-f12 colored scheme back on my u12s temporarly and I actually like it. I've owned 2 noctua coolers and have always used their black fans, but I actually kinda liked the original color. Personally would take that over RGB ;p
     
    Im just going to go for one pump after all, so that simplifies things for me with wondering if everything will fit onto the rad and I can get the 200 sized tube. My case has a fan hub that looks like it can be connected to the PSU. I'm only going to be using (4) A20's (.08 amps per fan) so I think 1 fan header will handle that no problem. I heard putting the pump in the cpu fan header is a good idea, because if the pump fails you get your MOBO telling you that you do not have a fan RPM, so then you can know its the pumps fault for shutting your pc down. What say you ?
     
    I seem to recall that people had problems with that brand of tubing with it gunking up their loop. Do not know if it was the non glossy tubing though (what ill use).
     
    Think im going barrow all the way with fittings and ill be sure to get some extras of each and some other types to give me some options if I need it.
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    4STAR
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    Re: Help planning for first loop. 2019/01/01 17:10:36 (permalink)
    I know I asked about the pump being adequate for head pressure if I choose to put the radiator under my desk. What about length of tubing. lets say 15ft ? would that decrease my flow ? This time the rad would be at the same height as my PC, just on the other side of the room.
    #16
    GTXJackBauer
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    Re: Help planning for first loop. 2019/01/02 02:24:14 (permalink)
    4STARIm just going to go for one pump after all, so that simplifies things for me with wondering if everything will fit onto the rad and I can get the 200 sized tube. My case has a fan hub that looks like it can be connected to the PSU. I'm only going to be using (4) A20's (.08 amps per fan) so I think 1 fan header will handle that no problem. I heard putting the pump in the cpu fan header is a good idea, because if the pump fails you get your MOBO telling you that you do not have a fan RPM, so then you can know its the pumps fault for shutting your pc down. What say you ?

     
    You should be ok with one fan header but make sure you don't add too many on one channel as most MB fan channels will be 1 Amp rated.
     
    As for the CPU fan header, that's correct.  If there are no readings, the MB could initiate a shutdown but that could be set in the BIOS as most if not all MBs have this feature.  I forgot if mine does that or not but I use a control and monitoring software of my whole loop where I've set up alarms for pump speed, liquid temps, etc.
     
    4STARI seem to recall that people had problems with that brand of tubing with it gunking up their loop. Do not know if it was the non glossy tubing though (what ill use).
     
     

     
    They used to sell an older product of tubing that would leech plasticize but have since fixed these issues unless someone gets very unlucky but so far, many of us haven't had any issues.  Just make sure you're not purchasing that old stock which should be completely cleared out by now as thjis was many years ago.
     
    4STAR
    I know I asked about the pump being adequate for head pressure if I choose to put the radiator under my desk. What about length of tubing. lets say 15ft ? would that decrease my flow ? This time the rad would be at the same height as my PC, just on the other side of the room.



    That's surely going to push your flow to it's limits with everything you'll have with another 15 feet of tubing.  I would try and lessen it if possible but the pump should be able to handle that at max setting but not sure what the flow will be like.  I have my flow set to 0.8-1.0 GPM on average.  The standard of a efficient flowing loop is between 1.0-1.5 GPM as anything more than that you're pretty much diminishing returns.

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    maxfly
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    Re: Help planning for first loop. 2019/01/09 04:37:52 (permalink)
    you may be able to get away with a single d5 with the added footage but i doubt it. it will be audible at 100% so you may want a second pump to avoid any headaches. tbh i have never needed to run any of my d5s at less than 100% even with my current dual pumps. my noctuas at 700rpm are almost silent but they are all i can hear. i have to touch the pumps to be certain they are on lol. i would pick up a cheap ddc 3.2(frozencpu $49.99 non/pwm). to help with the fill bleed process. if you still need it to maintain the 1+gph you want. itll be easy to integrate if you run 3/8in. id tubing. using voltage control with that type of ddc is easy as pie. i agree with Jack, the primochill lrt is definitely the best soft tubing you can get. gl and enjoy the build!

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    #18
    4STAR
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    Re: Help planning for first loop. 2019/02/06 20:02:45 (permalink)
    Ah man, that D5 pump admits a high pitched noise at every setting - WC Vario pump. I’m starting to reach the conclusion this is normal, I hope not though. If it was just the motor hum without the high frequency then I would bo ok with it, but it’s like tenittus. My dad can’t hear the noise because he can’t hear that range.

    My gpu will probably get rma because without the stock fans blasting it has revealed pretty bad coil whine.

    Is there some sound dampening I can put over the pump ? I’m going to order another pump too I guess.

    Here’s a thread and a video that I started.https://www.overclock.net...ar-high-frequency.html

    If I can’t kill this high pitched noise, then I’ll probably go back to air. I traded loud fans for a loud dog whistle 😭

    My gpu temps hit 70c, but I think it’s a bad mount, so I’ll have to re-do it. Seem to recall another user that happened too with this block.

    Oh another thing is that my computer won’t let me post with my XMP ram profile now, so weird.
    post edited by 4STAR - 2019/02/06 20:07:42
    #19
    GTXJackBauer
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    Re: Help planning for first loop. 2019/02/08 12:22:18 (permalink)
    You sure it's not the GPU with coil whine because D5's are pretty silent.  I have 2 EK D5's with just over 90%+ speed and they are silent, heck even @ 100%.

    After checking your video, that is normal and the sound you're hearing is the fluid moving quickly.  No big deal as your fans should muffle that sound out like mine does.  If it still bothers you that much, just lower the speed of the pump to a tolerable one for you personally.
     
    If you go back to air, you will regret heavily if sound is an issue with you. lol
     
    Make sure you clear CMOS and keep everyone on stock settings because when I was upgrading my GPU, for some reason it wouldn't work but did work (EVGA X99 I/O MB plate grounding issue it seemed) and than once I got it to power on finally, it wouldn't want to post, etc.  It was a month of hell but this is the unfortunate territory to custom PC building and cooling. 
     
    Your GPU temps are pretty high for liquid of course unless it's a bad seat, TIM, etc.  Make sure there's no debris in the cooling channels and the flow is adequate. 
     
    Just stick through it, you can do it! attitude and don't give up.  It will eventually get sorted out.  Just make sure to simplify your look to work with is my suggestions to everyone to make it less painful.  Good luck and keep us posted.
     
    Edit:  Just realized there was a second video I missed.  It sounds like the noiser pump isn't flowing liquid and a bubble can be impeding it's impeller.  Make sure when doing that test again, you see liquid flowing through that small intake internal tube to see if it's working or not.
    post edited by GTXJackBauer - 2019/02/08 12:30:57

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    #20
    4STAR
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    Re: Help planning for first loop. 2019/02/09 13:27:30 (permalink)
    GTXJackBauer
    You sure it's not the GPU with coil whine because D5's are pretty silent.  I have 2 EK D5's with just over 90%+ speed and they are silent, heck even @ 100%.

    After checking your video, that is normal and the sound you're hearing is the fluid moving quickly.  No big deal as your fans should muffle that sound out like mine does.  If it still bothers you that much, just lower the speed of the pump to a tolerable one for you personally.
     
    If you go back to air, you will regret heavily if sound is an issue with you. lol
     
    Make sure you clear CMOS and keep everyone on stock settings because when I was upgrading my GPU, for some reason it wouldn't work but did work (EVGA X99 I/O MB plate grounding issue it seemed) and than once I got it to power on finally, it wouldn't want to post, etc.  It was a month of hell but this is the unfortunate territory to custom PC building and cooling. 
     
    Your GPU temps are pretty high for liquid of course unless it's a bad seat, TIM, etc.  Make sure there's no debris in the cooling channels and the flow is adequate. 
     
    Just stick through it, you can do it! attitude and don't give up.  It will eventually get sorted out.  Just make sure to simplify your look to work with is my suggestions to everyone to make it less painful.  Good luck and keep us posted.
     
    Edit:  Just realized there was a second video I missed.  It sounds like the noiser pump isn't flowing liquid and a bubble can be impeding it's impeller.  Make sure when doing that test again, you see liquid flowing through that small intake internal tube to see if it's working or not.




     
    Oh I am 1000% sure its the pump. The fluid moving and the normal pump noise itself is not what I have an issue with, its that high pitched noise its admitting - its unbearable. I would take loud fans over the sound of a high speed drill any day. You know in war movies when a grenade goes off near the actor and you hear that high pitched noise - its like that.
     
    Fortunately at setting 1, I was able to greatly reduce the noise. Quoting myself from the other forum...
    "When I initially went through all the settings 1-5, I powered through them with my flat head. I cant visually see the dial and once I hooked up everything I was twisting the dial slower and once I hit a wall I stopped, however I could go further by twisting more. Fortunately at setting 1 it virtually goes away ! So after going back and forth with the dial and watching my pump RPM on the monitor it admits that high pitch noise starting at around 2300/2400 RPM and peaks at 2700RPM all the way to 4800RPM. At specifically 2100RPM the pump admits vibration, but only there."
     
    I remounted the block and I'm in the 40s now. 400mhz mem/ 100mhz core 124% power. It is nice to not have my stock GPU fans being possessed by randomly coming on full speed ! haha.
     
    Well I can post with the XMP profile now, I just set to default settings and redid my OC and everything like before. When I check the speed in task manager and CMD it says 21xxmhz instead of the 3200mhz its supposed to be. I did a run in firestrike and in the hardware section it shows 3200mhz. So I don't know what to believe, because the XMP profile is indeed on every time I go into my BIOS. I seem to recall task manager reporting 3200mhz before when I did my initial build, to make sure everything was running at the speeds I wanted.
    post edited by 4STAR - 2019/02/09 13:36:23
    #21
    GGTV-Jon
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    Re: Help planning for first loop. 2019/02/09 15:02:02 (permalink)
    Just watched your video - I had to turn both my system and you tube volume all the way up to hear that
     
    Is the pump / reservoir body hard mounted?
    I used the rubberized mounting base for My EK 140 pump/res combo - no such noises.
    Was also wondering if you had powered up the pump before any fluid was in the reservoir


    #22
    4STAR
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    Re: Help planning for first loop. 2019/02/09 16:20:24 (permalink)
    GGTV-Jon
    Just watched your video - I had to turn both my system and you tube volume all the way up to hear that
     
    Is the pump / reservoir body hard mounted?
    I used the rubberized mounting base for My EK 140 pump/res combo - no such noises.
    Was also wondering if you had powered up the pump before any fluid was in the reservoir




    The video doesn’t do it justice, it’s still there, but way louder in person. My parents can’t hear it at all, so they think I’m crazy Lol.
     
    I filled up res before turning on the pump. I’m starting to think this noise is a d5 pump version of    “coil“ whine.
     
    the pump/res is mounted to the radiator and decoupled.
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    GGTV-Jon
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    Re: Help planning for first loop. 2019/02/09 19:34:58 (permalink)
    not the same as "coil whine"
     
    If the pump body is hard mounted with no vibration dampers you will get more harmonic noise
    My D5 is so quite at 100% pump speed you need to put your hand on the res. to feel the vibration to tell that it is even running. Besides the fact the system is not overheating :P


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    GTXJackBauer
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    Re: Help planning for first loop. 2019/02/10 16:00:55 (permalink)
    GGTV-Jon
    not the same as "coil whine"
     
    If the pump body is hard mounted with no vibration dampers you will get more harmonic noise
    My D5 is so quite at 100% pump speed you need to put your hand on the res. to feel the vibration to tell that it is even running. Besides the fact the system is not overheating :P




    I also have two EK D5 G2 pumps in serial and since switching from my dual MCP35X DDC pumps, they don't even compare to the noise the DDCs were making.  I think the DDCs at 30%-40% PWM make the same amount of audibles the EK D5 G2 dual pumps @ 100% PWM.  I lost my mind at how silent they are compared to the DDCs and I believe because of the decoupling mechanisms in place that comes with the D5s is the reason why it's also this quiet.  Mind blowing in the audible but for head pressure, the DDCs are still the king.  I have gotten 1.6+ GPM in my complex loop with the DDCs while the new D5s can only get 1.2 GPM @ 100%*. 
     
    *I should note that I did add more bends to the loop since the switch as I did some rerouting since taking out the dual bay res/dual pump (DDC) out for a cylinder res combo'd with the EK Revo Dual D5 PWM.  I do miss having the head pressure but enjoy the audibles so that is the trade off between them two. 
     
    Also, draining and refilling is such a breeze the way my config is set up.  Much happier with it now compared to before. 

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    4STAR
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    Re: Help planning for first loop. 2019/02/11 16:53:22 (permalink)
    So just installed another vario d5 pump by aqua computer - same thing ! These pumps admit a high pitched electrical noise. I remember reading about pumps whining, but I thought that was a bad unit, but I'm pretty sure they all sound like this. Ill get a PWM pump next, so I can run it even slower while not gaming.
    #26
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