IonstormEU
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Re: 2070 Super XC Ultra Power Limit
2020/02/25 07:02:05
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I have a new BIOS from support, I will update later.
Also: people have modified power limits on Pascal, I knew that from before. If they've modified the BIOS further for Turing to stop that... Well I wouldn't be shocked at all.
Whilst I do understand some reasons to why they encrypt the BIOS and make it so difficult to mod, if they striaght up wasn't total idiots to start with and allowed all gpus to use said power limits there wouldn't be a need for people to hack away.. Of course there's always those who will.
Again I'll update when I've had a chance to flash the new BIOS.
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IonstormEU
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Re: 2070 Super XC Ultra Power Limit
2020/02/25 21:34:20
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The new BIOS initially looked promising as it forced stock boost to 1900mhz and all the memory speeds and fill rates were much higher on GPUz, however the card sticks at 2025mhz now instead of the 2040 it was at... So strange.
Also with the new BIOS just like the old, it still doesn't recover from a bad OC, normally on my 2080 you'd go too high on the +clocks it would crash under load and reset back to stock speeds, or if you pushed too far it would blink a few times and be stock.
This GPU doesn't, its instant black screens that need a reset.
What's also strange is +119 on the GPU is 90% stable as was a low +5, but if you were to go +120 then boom! Instant crash and you need a reset! Quite annoying!
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the_Scarlet_one
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Re: 2070 Super XC Ultra Power Limit
2020/02/26 02:50:26
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Overclocking is never guaranteed. NVidia says that you can overclock, but they are doing most of the leg work with GPU Boost 4.0. After that, they don’t really care too much about the consumers wants.
Turing is far stricter than pascal or any previous generation.
A new bios does not mean a card is 100% compatible with the bios. That is why all board manufacturers test with the bios they are shipping before they ship it. The only thing about getting a new bios after you have the card is that you are the only one that can test it to see how compatible it is.
While it may be annoying, make sure you try different graphics drivers with the new bios as well. And older driver may be more stable with the new bios.
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IonstormEU
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Re: 2070 Super XC Ultra Power Limit
2020/02/26 12:57:02
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Stability isn't an issue, boosting is. And I'm not sure why support would send a new BIOS that boosts slower to a customer complaining about boost speeds.
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kevinc313
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Re: 2070 Super XC Ultra Power Limit
2020/02/26 13:27:53
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IonstormEU
I'm kind of disgusted that partners are still power limiting GPUs.
What's more disgusting is they're doing it on a XC Ultra, what's the point of getting a pre binned GPU, having a custom pcb and power... And then nurfing it in to the ground with limits?
There is legit people with 2070 supers at £50 less getting over 2.1ghz and I struggle to maintain 2ghz.
What's the deal? Because support doesn't give a crap, which isn't looking promising for future EvGA purchases.
The card you're looking for is the FTW3 2070S or 2080S, they both have high limits. I've been warning people for months about the Super's lower power limits vs. the FTW3.
post edited by kevinc313 - 2020/08/18 20:54:56
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IonstormEU
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Re: 2070 Super XC Ultra Power Limit
2020/02/26 13:58:55
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My 2080 was also power limited, I had read that EVGA was releasing BIOSs to unlock said limits on theirs.
Anyway, the new BIOS from support is actually giving me a 60+ point lower 3DMark TimeSpy Graphics score.
Best I've had so far is 10,942 on the new BIOS.
Previous was consistently hitting 11,062.
Again this is the graphics score not overall.
At 11,062 it's not that much at all slower than my RTX 2080 until I managed to get 2080mhz on it.
These super cards really did so a number on early adopters.. Smh!
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IonstormEU
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Re: 2070 Super XC Ultra Power Limit
2020/02/26 14:10:53
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Just to add too.
No ones managed to tell me why adding 1mhz to the overclock thats tested to 90% stable full on crashes the entire system.
Or why the driver / gpu doesn't recover like the 2080 did.
According to X1 the GPU was running 30-70mhz faster on the new BIOS than the Afterburner OC, but it scored more than 100pts less at 10,848... Really don't see how it's performing so much worse using X1...
Also when I use the boost button, adding voltage doesn't change the voltage on the GPU at all, it sits at 2055 @ 1038mV which is about 25mV less than the old BIOS.
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ty_ger07
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Re: 2070 Super XC Ultra Power Limit
2020/02/26 14:43:30
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IonstormEU
No ones managed to tell me why adding 1mhz to the overclock thats tested to 90% stable full on crashes the entire system.
That's normal. Ever heard of the saying "the straw that broke the camel's back"? The card doesn't actually boost at 1 MHz increments. It extrapolates your request to the nearest available "boost bin" or "step", and one bin or step is obviously your limit, and the next is too high. You will always notice this condition. The limit varies from card to card, but they all have a limit.
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IonstormEU
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Re: 2070 Super XC Ultra Power Limit
2020/02/26 17:03:08
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No, thats not at all how it works, gpus don't just become unstable after being solid after 1mhz gain, it would become unstable to 60 or worst case 40%.
Never in my years of OCin have I seen a stable clock and then increase by 1mhz and get a crash not even on a 200mhz cpu.
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ty_ger07
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Re: 2070 Super XC Ultra Power Limit
2020/02/26 17:27:36
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IonstormEU
No, thats not at all how it works, gpus don't just become unstable after being solid after 1mhz gain, it would become unstable to 60 or worst case 40%.
Never in my years of OCin have I seen a stable clock and then increase by 1mhz and get a crash not even on a 200mhz cpu.
Sorry, but yes, that is how it works. AGAIN, you are not increasing it my only 1 MHz. You are increasing it by 15 MHz. It's a boost bin. Let's say that at between + 35 and + 50 MHz core overclock setting, it's running at one boost bin of 2015 MHz. Then, you increase the overclock setting to +51 MHz. Now, that is enough for it to round up to the next boost bin of 2030 MHz. Now, your GPU isn't stable. It's called silicon lottery. That is to be expected. At some overclock setting, the GPU will become unstable. That is guaranteed. It's even more telling that you say that it is 90% stable at one boost bin, and then 0% stable at the next boost bin. This means that you can already see for yourself that 30 MHz down is 100% stable, 15 MHz up from that point is 90% stable, and then an additional 15 MHz up is 0% stable. 30 MHz is NOT 1 MHz!!! Quit saying that it is becoming unstable with a change of only 1 MHz! See for yourself. Lower your overclock offset down 1 MHz. Did it change? No. Lower it 2 MHz. Did it change? No. Lower it 3 MHz. Did it change? No. Keep going down far enough, and now it will drop to the next lower boost bin. When you find the edge of a boost bin where it will jump up to the next highest boost bin, it seems like it is becoming unstable by only changing the overclock by 1 MHz, but that is not the case. It is actually jumping 15 MHz. You will ALWAYS find one boost bin where it is stable, and the next higher boost bin will be unstable. That is guaranteed. Your logic is simply flawed by thinking that there is only 1 MHz between those two settings. It is actually 15 MHz difference between those two settings. EDIT: Fixed the math after Sajin corrected me.
post edited by ty_ger07 - 2020/02/26 17:57:14
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Sajin
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Re: 2070 Super XC Ultra Power Limit
2020/02/26 17:50:33
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+1 to what ty_ger07 is saying, and it's actually 15 mhz steps for 20 series cards.
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IonstormEU
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Re: 2070 Super XC Ultra Power Limit
2020/02/26 21:40:28
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This only applies in X1, Afterburner actually changes alot more often. X1 Does large chunks for me. Also, going to +120 in X1 is an instant crash, going +140 works for a while (up to 20mins) then crashes and recovers. Adding voltage in X1 doesn't work for either bios. I can get the gpu to hit 2070+ speed in x21 but its slower than 2025 from Afterburner for 3dmark. Also, that doesn't explain, and kinda Invalidates your whole post rant. Since +119 or on this new BIOS is running much lower boost than the old one in afterburner. It would easily equate to a +125-135 difference. So if your crashathlm theory is correct the new BIOS should do +120 just fine. Interesting eh. Perhaps the higher stepping gives more voltage and thats why doing +125 or +140 actually works for a while compared to +120 being a hard crash.
post edited by IonstormEU - 2020/02/26 21:51:14
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kevinc313
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Re: 2070 Super XC Ultra Power Limit
2020/02/27 05:38:27
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IonstormEU
This only applies in X1, Afterburner actually changes alot more often. X1 Does large chunks for me.
Also, going to +120 in X1 is an instant crash, going +140 works for a while (up to 20mins) then crashes and recovers.
Adding voltage in X1 doesn't work for either bios.
I can get the gpu to hit 2070+ speed in x21 but its slower than 2025 from Afterburner for 3dmark.
Also, that doesn't explain, and kinda Invalidates your whole post rant.
Since +119 or on this new BIOS is running much lower boost than the old one in afterburner. It would easily equate to a +125-135 difference. So if your crashathlm theory is correct the new BIOS should do +120 just fine. Interesting eh.
Perhaps the higher stepping gives more voltage and thats why doing +125 or +140 actually works for a while compared to +120 being a hard crash.
I'm sure if you email evga, msi and Nvidia, they'll be happy to change the bios and program behavior for you.
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IonstormEU
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Re: 2070 Super XC Ultra Power Limit
2020/02/27 05:44:31
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EVGA have already sent me an alternative BIOS. Thank you for your useful, insightful contribution.
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kevinc313
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Re: 2070 Super XC Ultra Power Limit
2020/02/27 07:35:30
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IonstormEU
EVGA have already sent me an alternative BIOS. Thank you for your useful, insightful contribution.
Sounds like I was spot on, you're welcome.
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Sam680
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Re: 2070 Super XC Ultra Power Limit
2020/02/27 22:28:18
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GTXJackBauer
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Re: 2070 Super XC Ultra Power Limit
2020/02/27 22:39:39
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Sam680
I know he isnt saying it excatly the right way but I do get what lonstorm is trying to say, if you max out the power limit on the XC ultra you can get up to 240w power draw from the card when you can get 260w from a founders edition even though both of them have the same PCB. It would be nice to have a bois from evga that would at least match the reference card as they are both the same PCB.
That's why they have different SKUs with different power limits.
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Sam680
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Re: 2070 Super XC Ultra Power Limit
2020/02/27 22:49:00
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GTXJackBauer
That's why they have different SKUs with different power limits.
Yes I know, my point is that if this card has the same PCB as reference should it not have the same power limit, heck the cooler is better than reference, why have a lower power limit?
post edited by Sam680 - 2020/02/27 22:52:09
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IonstormEU
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Re: 2070 Super XC Ultra Power Limit
2020/02/28 03:45:47
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Cos Ngreedia want you to buy the FE to make them more money. Which is why I can't understand why partners put up with this crap to be perfectly honest.
Then again, I don't know how anyone would want to make or retail an AMD GPU right now either /sigh
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ty_ger07
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Re: 2070 Super XC Ultra Power Limit
2020/02/28 05:15:22
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IonstormEU
Then again, I don't know how anyone would want to make or retail an AMD GPU right now either /sigh
Because of the performance per dollar. It's a real good deal and that's what the mainstream wants.
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IonstormEU
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Re: 2070 Super XC Ultra Power Limit
2020/02/28 05:30:42
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Could have all the performance in the world *BRB Black screen*, but if you're playing D3 hardcore and you're *BRB Black screen* dead because of bad hardware or play CSGO and start winning ranked *BRB Black screen* oh and get a cool down, so you start destroying in overwatch competitive, and you pop your ultimate to seal the win *BRB Black screen*.
See where we're going? I couldn't even use any of the features on my 5700XT as it caused black screens, the only thing I refused to disable was FreeSync, which wouldn't work at OCd 155hz on my Dell QHD, but did on gsync compatible. Oh and another *BRB Black screen* for a good measure.
Yeah buy cheap pay twice *BRB Black screen*.
;p
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ty_ger07
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Re: 2070 Super XC Ultra Power Limit
2020/02/28 11:46:48
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I am not sure if it is wise to correlate your experiences with the experiences of others. Yes, AMD continues to have driver issues with their GPUs, but possibly more importantly is that AMD continues to sell cards with quite terrible blower coolers. From what I can tell, the majority of people who have had the black screen issue are those who bought the blower version, were unhappy with the cooling, and have used wattman to adjust their card's fan profile. From what I can tell, the majority of people who bought the card, installed it, and haven't performed any official or unofficial tweaks, are enjoying those cards.
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IonstormEU
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Re: 2070 Super XC Ultra Power Limit
2020/02/28 12:35:21
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Simply is not correct. I'm guessing you have no first hand experience. I had 2x of the most recommended and the fastest 5700XTs, the Sapphire Nitro+ Special Edition. Both had issues, my friend bought himself a partner 5700XT and both of theirs had issues, and I have plenty of people in my wow guild with the same story.
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