Belial_69699
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Hey guys! Been awhile! I always came here for advice and input here on EVGA because you guys always had a lot of knowledge and experience to share. So here I am once again, debating whether to build a new rig because my current one is coming up 7 years old very soon. So I've been doing a lot of thinking and a lot of dreading (not a fan of Windows 10 at all, too much spyware..) but I'm still not sure what route to go, Ryzen or Intel?
I mainly use my rig for gaming, web browsing, watching movies and listening to music. I do not do any video editing, streaming or rendering. The games I play include but not limited to World of Warcraft, Final Fantasy XIV, Star Wars The Old Republic, World of Tanks, various Blizzard games, Battlefront II. I used to be a big fan of AMD until they kind of went through their dry spell but I've been hearing and reading so many good things about Ryzen cpu's recently. Just wondering if there's any real reason(s) to go with one or the other. Looking forward to hearing from you guys and getting your input! As usual thank you in advance and I'll be checking this post frequently! :)
"It's not who I am underneath, but what I do that defines me."
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rjohnson11
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Re: Ryzen or Intel build?
2019/08/28 23:55:50
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Well personally I recommend AMD Ryzen especially if you want save cash on both processor and motherboard. You need to also choose a good graphics card if you game at 1440p or higher. You can also wait a little while if you want to try 3rd gen Threadripper as that is coming soon. In September/October AMD releases the Ryzen 9 3950X with 16 cores.
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Vlada011
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Re: Ryzen or Intel build?
2019/08/29 01:19:30
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I agree, AMD have excellent offers now and for rendering and for gaming, no matter what you need.
But something now allow me to abandon Intel yet. If they success to catch AMD with PCI-E 4.0 Interface on new generations OK.
If not my feelings will completely change and AMD will be only logic and possible option.
Intel really really need 10 core CPU up to 500$, PCI-E 4.0 Interface and nice Turbo Boost.
Even 10% faster then AMD I'm satisfied even ready to pay some extra cash to stay on Intel-NVIDIA.
Somehow I have impression that they are more stable with less problem, but owners of AMD know better,
most of them now complain on AMD platform.
PCI-E 3.0 Interface stop me to recommend i9-9900K to everyone who will keep platform several years.
Except that i9-9900K is great for gaming. My only wish is to replace my i7-5820K with i7-6950X.
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Belial_69699
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Re: Ryzen or Intel build?
2019/08/29 01:51:45
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I've started to create some build lists, for both Ryzen and Intel. To start with my Intel choice for cpu and motherboard is the i7 9700K and an MSI MEG Z390 ACE. For my Ryzen build I was thinking either the Ryzen 3700X or 3800X and an ASUS X570 TUF or MSI MEG X570 ACE (I think this particular motherboard would be overkill for what I use my rig for though..) Good point on the 9900K! I heard the 9900K and the 9700K are great for gaming.
I do have a question concerning both cpu's, is it true that Ryzen motherboards are future-proof? What I mean is when the next generation of Ryzen cpu's come out that you don't have to get a whole new motherboard just to use the new cpu? While with Intel if you wanted the newest Intel cpu you'd have to get a new series motherboard?
Concerning the graphics card, I have a EVGA 970 FTW, plan on eventually upgrading that to a 2070.
"It's not who I am underneath, but what I do that defines me."
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Vlada011
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Re: Ryzen or Intel build?
2019/08/29 02:07:47
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I believe 3800X and X570 TUF are better choice now, not 3700X. X570 motherboard will last probably more then Z390. But I read somewhere AMD prepare new chipset X590. I check on Newegg, price between ASUS X570 TUF Plus Wi-Fi and MSI MEG ACE is huge. You should decide how much you want to pay for motherboard, if you agree with price of MSI ACE then you should look and ASUS Crosshair VIII Hero X570. That's high class motherboard with nice price and no useless features for some gamers as motherboards worth 700$. I would go on Crosshair VIII Hero and it's one of most attractive motherboards for AM4. I always check few video clips on youtube of good motherboards...  AMD is now good choice. And its' hard to believe that Intel could give them so strong punch to owners feel sorry because didn't wait Intel innovation in 2020. Intel fans now should hope that Intel will be same with same new features as AMD, not to dominate as before 5-6 years.
post edited by Vlada011 - 2019/08/29 02:16:59
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aka_STEVE_b
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Re: Ryzen or Intel build?
2019/08/29 05:27:46
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AMD & Intel are within a few % points of one another right now in gaming , and AMD is blowing them away in almost all multi-threaded usage....
Then consider the new X570 is more 'future-proof' than the very aged Intel platform.....
I obviously researched it also and chose AMD this time for many reasons ...
AMD RYZEN 9 5900X 12-core cpu~ ASUS ROG Crosshair VIII Dark Hero ~ EVGA RTX 3080 Ti FTW3~ G.SKILL Trident Z NEO 32GB DDR4-3600 ~ Phanteks Eclipse P400s red case ~ EVGA SuperNOVA 1000 G+ PSU ~ Intel 660p M.2 drive~ Crucial MX300 275 GB SSD ~WD 2TB SSD ~CORSAIR H115i RGB Pro XT 280mm cooler ~ CORSAIR Dark Core RGB Pro mouse ~ CORSAIR K68 Mech keyboard ~ HGST 4TB Hd.~ AOC AGON 32" monitor 1440p @ 144Hz ~ Win 10 x64
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transdogmifier
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Re: Ryzen or Intel build?
2019/08/29 05:35:48
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The Ryzen platform is an incredible choice these days....right up there with Intel's current offerings.
Better (as aka_Steve_b said) at multithreaded tasks as well.
Can't go wrong either way, but were I building right now I'd probably take a 3900X (Yeah, I know the 3800X is probably better for 'gaming'....but..the 3900X...I like it..a lot)
AMD Ryzen 7900x3d Deepcool LT720 Gigabyte Aorus Elite AX X670 (Might change..don't like this board) eVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 Ultra Gaming (Hybrid kit on it) Asus ROG Swift PG43UQ 4k Monitor eVGA 1600W Supernova T2 PSU 32GB Kingston 6000 DDR5 (2x16GB) Fury Corsair MP600 Pro 2TB (Boot) Corsair MP600 2TB (Games/Data) Phanteks P500A Case
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RainStryke
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Re: Ryzen or Intel build?
2019/08/29 06:28:09
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With your listed usage, I would actually recommend to go with an Intel i7 9700K. With AMD you save a decent amount on the processor but pay more for the motherboard. Mainly for the PCI-E 4.0 feature that video cards don't even fully utilize yet. Also, the memory controller on RAM is stronger with Intel, so if you go this route, get some 4GHz+ RAM. AMD is getting a lot better now that they have put a lot more effort into better integration with Windows. But... they still have a long ways to go before they have the integration that Intel has.
Main PC | Secondary PC
Intel i9 10900K | Intel i7 9700KMSI MEG Z490 ACE | Gigabyte Aorus Z390 MasterASUS TUF RTX 3090 | NVIDIA RTX 2070 Super32GB G.Skill Trident Z Royal 4000MHz CL18 | 32GB G.Skill Trident Z RGB 4266MHz CL17SuperFlower Platinum SE 1200w | Seasonic X-1250Samsung EVO 970 1TB and Crucial P5 1TB | Intel 760p 1TB and Crucial MX100 512GBCougar Vortex CF-V12HPB x9 | Cougar Vortex CF-V12SPB-RGB x5 3DMark Results:Time Spy|Port Royal
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Vlada011
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Re: Ryzen or Intel build?
2019/08/29 09:40:44
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RainStryke
With your listed usage, I would actually recommend to go with an Intel i7 9700K. With AMD you save a decent amount on the processor but pay more for the motherboard. Mainly for the PCI-E 4.0 feature that video cards don't even fully utilize yet. Also, the memory controller on RAM is stronger with Intel, so if you go this route, get some 4GHz+ RAM. AMD is getting a lot better now that they have put a lot more effort into better integration with Windows. But... they still have a long ways to go before they have the integration that Intel has.
DO YOU WANT TO STOP TO TALK ABOUT PCI-E 4.0 IMPROVEMENTS ON GPU. NO ONE CARE FOR SMALL GPU IMPROVEMENTS ON PCI-E 4.0. BUT EVERYONE CARE BECAUSE PCI-E 4.0 SSD M.2 START TO SHOW UP AND THEY SPEED IS MUCH FASTER THEN BEST M.2 DRIVES ON INTEL PLATFORM. And that's just beginning, race in speed on PCI-E 4.0 Interface will start very soon. Eight M.2 PCI-E 3.0 drives on Intel X299 platform in RAID 0 reach 11.6GBps. On AMD X570 Four M.2 PCI-E 4.0 in RAID reac 15.5GBps Read and 15.5GBps write. One M.2 PCI-E 4.0 reach 5000/4300 speed. Best PCI-E 3.0 Samsung 970 PRO reach 3300/2800. People forgot that now OS depend of PCI-E Interface, they are still in period when PCI-E 3.0 bring nothing to GPU sections and people installed system on SATA III Controller. This is reason because it's PCI-E 4.0 important. OS is installed on this performance. And that's just beginning, same as Samsung 950 before 3-3.5 years. First Gen 4.0 M.2 on AMD platform. Before Intel show up with PCI-E 4.0 results will be even better.  No benefits for gamers, no bigger fps on PCI-E 4.0, it's not important for gaming... Who care about gaming. It's not USB speed, everything is on that drive. Imagine someone to sell you SATA II and other to sell you SATA III and you people constantly repeat its not bigger fps on SATA III. We can love Intel or not, to wait because they have no full competitive platform or not, but ignoring these facts is foolish because buyers are people who try hard to follow last technology and buy best available hardware. They will not get firmware upgrade when Intel launch PCI-E 4.0 compatible platform, they will stay on PCI-E 3.0 years, you always need to go with possibility that period could be 5 years because some reason. 2025 on PCI-E 3.0 sound bad. If AMD or Intel adopt PCI-E 5.0 on same way as PCI-E 4.0, same period after specifications are presented then PCI-E 5.0 will show up probably somewhere around 2023/2024.
post edited by Vlada011 - 2019/08/29 09:52:11
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rjohnson11
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Re: Ryzen or Intel build?
2019/08/29 10:02:31
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Vlada011
I agree, AMD have excellent offers now and for rendering and for gaming, no matter what you need.
But something now allow me to abandon Intel yet. If they success to catch AMD with PCI-E 4.0 Interface on new generations OK.
If not my feelings will completely change and AMD will be only logic and possible option.
Intel really really need 10 core CPU up to 500$, PCI-E 4.0 Interface and nice Turbo Boost.
Even 10% faster then AMD I'm satisfied even ready to pay some extra cash to stay on Intel-NVIDIA.
Somehow I have impression that they are more stable with less problem, but owners of AMD know better,
most of them now complain on AMD platform.
PCI-E 3.0 Interface stop me to recommend i9-9900K to everyone who will keep platform several years.
Except that i9-9900K is great for gaming. My only wish is to replace my i7-5820K with i7-6950X.
Intel CPUs already run hot and 10 cores with a 14nm chip would require some really innovative cooling.
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RainStryke
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Re: Ryzen or Intel build?
2019/08/29 10:29:55
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Vlada011
RainStryke
With your listed usage, I would actually recommend to go with an Intel i7 9700K. With AMD you save a decent amount on the processor but pay more for the motherboard. Mainly for the PCI-E 4.0 feature that video cards don't even fully utilize yet. Also, the memory controller on RAM is stronger with Intel, so if you go this route, get some 4GHz+ RAM. AMD is getting a lot better now that they have put a lot more effort into better integration with Windows. But... they still have a long ways to go before they have the integration that Intel has.
DO YOU WANT TO STOP TO TALK ABOUT PCI-E 4.0 IMPROVEMENTS ON GPU.
NO ONE CARE FOR SMALL GPU IMPROVEMENTS ON PCI-E 4.0. BUT EVERYONE CARE BECAUSE PCI-E 4.0 SSD M.2 START TO SHOW UP AND THEY SPEED IS MUCH FASTER THEN BEST M.2 DRIVES ON INTEL PLATFORM.
And that's just beginning, race in speed on PCI-E 4.0 Interface will start very soon.
Eight M.2 PCI-E 3.0 drives on Intel X299 platform in RAID 0 reach 11.6GBps. On AMD X570 Four M.2 PCI-E 4.0 in RAID reac 15.5GBps Read and 15.5GBps write. One M.2 PCI-E 4.0 reach 5000/4300 speed. Best PCI-E 3.0 Samsung 970 PRO reach 3300/2800.
People forgot that now OS depend of PCI-E Interface, they are still in period when PCI-E 3.0 bring nothing to GPU sections and people installed system on SATA III Controller.
This is reason because it's PCI-E 4.0 important. OS is installed on this performance.
And that's just beginning, same as Samsung 950 before 3-3.5 years.
First Gen 4.0 M.2 on AMD platform.
Before Intel show up with PCI-E 4.0 results will be even better.
No benefits for gamers, no bigger fps on PCI-E 4.0, it's not important for gaming... Who care about gaming.
It's not USB speed, everything is on that drive. Imagine someone to sell you SATA II and other to sell you SATA III and you people constantly repeat its not bigger fps on SATA III.
We can love Intel or not, to wait because they have no full competitive platform or not, but ignoring these facts is foolish because buyers are people who try hard to follow last technology and buy best available hardware. They will not get firmware upgrade when Intel launch PCI-E 4.0 compatible platform, they will stay on PCI-E 3.0 years, you always need to go with possibility that period could be 5 years because some reason. 2025 on PCI-E 3.0 sound bad.
If AMD or Intel adopt PCI-E 5.0 on same way as PCI-E 4.0, same period after specifications are presented then PCI-E 5.0 will show up probably somewhere around 2023/2024.
The OP cares about gaming, web browsing and watching movies. Belial_69699
I mainly use my rig for gaming, web browsing, watching movies and listening to music. I do not do any video editing, streaming or rendering.
Main PC | Secondary PC
Intel i9 10900K | Intel i7 9700KMSI MEG Z490 ACE | Gigabyte Aorus Z390 MasterASUS TUF RTX 3090 | NVIDIA RTX 2070 Super32GB G.Skill Trident Z Royal 4000MHz CL18 | 32GB G.Skill Trident Z RGB 4266MHz CL17SuperFlower Platinum SE 1200w | Seasonic X-1250Samsung EVO 970 1TB and Crucial P5 1TB | Intel 760p 1TB and Crucial MX100 512GBCougar Vortex CF-V12HPB x9 | Cougar Vortex CF-V12SPB-RGB x5 3DMark Results:Time Spy|Port Royal
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jfw06013
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Re: Ryzen or Intel build?
2019/08/29 11:11:19
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I wanted a Ryzen setup because it was cheaper than an Intel setup (1151 socket) but am having some trouble actually getting a AM4 motherboard that works out of box. I'm on my 3rd motherboard (just got this one today) and the first 2 were: 1: ASRock B450M Pro4. 2: MSI B450M VHD (I think that's right). Both boards would not boot up with a Ryzen 2200G, Corsair 2400MHz 4x4 GB memory, EVGA 500W power supply. I did all the usual testing (no video card, no hard drive, and tested all memory). No beeps, no video (my monitor say's no source). So today I just received a ASRock B450M Steel Legend and I got a AMD A6 9500 cpu to try on it. If that works then I will try the 2200G. If that doesn't work I'm shipping all of it back and going with a EVGA 1151 motherboard and the cheapest Intel cpu (I'll be running Windows XP and don't need the horse power). Last chance AMD, I'm tired of playing games!   
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Hoggle
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Re: Ryzen or Intel build?
2019/08/29 11:19:25
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Vlada011
RainStryke
With your listed usage, I would actually recommend to go with an Intel i7 9700K. With AMD you save a decent amount on the processor but pay more for the motherboard. Mainly for the PCI-E 4.0 feature that video cards don't even fully utilize yet. Also, the memory controller on RAM is stronger with Intel, so if you go this route, get some 4GHz+ RAM. AMD is getting a lot better now that they have put a lot more effort into better integration with Windows. But... they still have a long ways to go before they have the integration that Intel has.
DO YOU WANT TO STOP TO TALK ABOUT PCI-E 4.0 IMPROVEMENTS ON GPU.
NO ONE CARE FOR SMALL GPU IMPROVEMENTS ON PCI-E 4.0. BUT EVERYONE CARE BECAUSE PCI-E 4.0 SSD M.2 START TO SHOW UP AND THEY SPEED IS MUCH FASTER THEN BEST M.2 DRIVES ON INTEL PLATFORM.
And that's just beginning, race in speed on PCI-E 4.0 Interface will start very soon.
Eight M.2 PCI-E 3.0 drives on Intel X299 platform in RAID 0 reach 11.6GBps. On AMD X570 Four M.2 PCI-E 4.0 in RAID reac 15.5GBps Read and 15.5GBps write. One M.2 PCI-E 4.0 reach 5000/4300 speed. Best PCI-E 3.0 Samsung 970 PRO reach 3300/2800.
People forgot that now OS depend of PCI-E Interface, they are still in period when PCI-E 3.0 bring nothing to GPU sections and people installed system on SATA III Controller.
This is reason because it's PCI-E 4.0 important. OS is installed on this performance.
And that's just beginning, same as Samsung 950 before 3-3.5 years.
First Gen 4.0 M.2 on AMD platform.
Before Intel show up with PCI-E 4.0 results will be even better.
No benefits for gamers, no bigger fps on PCI-E 4.0, it's not important for gaming... Who care about gaming.
It's not USB speed, everything is on that drive. Imagine someone to sell you SATA II and other to sell you SATA III and you people constantly repeat its not bigger fps on SATA III.
We can love Intel or not, to wait because they have no full competitive platform or not, but ignoring these facts is foolish because buyers are people who try hard to follow last technology and buy best available hardware. They will not get firmware upgrade when Intel launch PCI-E 4.0 compatible platform, they will stay on PCI-E 3.0 years, you always need to go with possibility that period could be 5 years because some reason. 2025 on PCI-E 3.0 sound bad.
If AMD or Intel adopt PCI-E 5.0 on same way as PCI-E 4.0, same period after specifications are presented then PCI-E 5.0 will show up probably somewhere around 2023/2024.
With the specs for PCIe 5.0 already released I wouldn't say PCIe 4.0 is really going to get a lot of traction. Intel is likely to go right to 5.0 and a lot of companies will release 5.0 with backwards support for 4.0 and 3.0.
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flyinion
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Re: Ryzen or Intel build?
2019/08/29 11:48:34
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Belial_69699
I've started to create some build lists, for both Ryzen and Intel. To start with my Intel choice for cpu and motherboard is the i7 9700K and an MSI MEG Z390 ACE. For my Ryzen build I was thinking either the Ryzen 3700X or 3800X and an ASUS X570 TUF or MSI MEG X570 ACE (I think this particular motherboard would be overkill for what I use my rig for though..) Good point on the 9900K! I heard the 9900K and the 9700K are great for gaming.
I do have a question concerning both cpu's, is it true that Ryzen motherboards are future-proof? What I mean is when the next generation of Ryzen cpu's come out that you don't have to get a whole new motherboard just to use the new cpu? While with Intel if you wanted the newest Intel cpu you'd have to get a new series motherboard?
Concerning the graphics card, I have a EVGA 970 FTW, plan on eventually upgrading that to a 2070.
They're supposed to be future proof to a degree. I forget the exact number but it was either 4 or 5 years. Next year could be the last gen on AM4, (assuming they don't switch early) or 5xxx chips could be depending on what happens. I took a gamble vs. Intel that they were keeping AM4 for the 4xxx chips and am hoping to upgrade my 3700X to a higher core count with hopefully higher clocks after they refine their 7nm process for 4xxx and then that will be my last upgrade for a while probably unless 5xxx chips fit and are significantly better. For boards, anything in the price range of the Meg Ace is definitely going to work well for the Ryzen chips, they all have pretty overkill VRM's for that 7nm process apparently according to Buildzoid. On the Intel side, you might look at Gigabyte's Master or Ultra if you're not opposed to them. VRM matters a lot more on the 9700 and 9900K from what I was reading when I nearly went with one and the Gigabyte boards have the best VRM right now for Intel. If all you're doing is gaming and nothing else, the 9700K probably would be your best choice. Intel is still pulling ahead in 1080p benchmarks there. BIOS and driver improvements might close it some but probably not all the way on Ryzen 3xxx. At 1440p and above you won't notice though and it's down to features and price of the boards basically at that point. Oh, one other thing. Many review sites are adding extra value for AMD over the 9700/9900 chips due to an included cooler. I would not take that into consideration. I'm currently using the stock cooler on my 3700X (water cooling loop going in this weekend) and while it does indeed cool the chip, if I wasn't going water I'd definitely be putting something else on it like a Noctua or something. It's loud and doesn't cool all that well under heavy multithread loads. I hit 83C a few minutes into a 1080p handbrake h.265 render before I shut it down. Even using the Nvidia h.265 encoding option it still used a lot of CPU and hit upper 70's to 80C.
post edited by flyinion - 2019/08/29 11:51:27
AMD Ryzen 5950X | Asus Crosshair VIII Hero | Gigabyte Gaming OC 4090 w/EK Vector2 | GSkill Trident Z Neo 2x16GB DDR4-3600 | WD SN850 2TB | Samsung 970 EVO Plus 500GB & 860 Evo 2TB | Phanteks Enthoo 719 | Seasonic Prime Ultra Gold 1000W | Steelseries M750 TKL | SteelSeries Prime Wireless | SteelSeries Arctis Pro + GameDAC | Kanto YU2 + Yamaha sub | Schiit Magni 2 Uber & Modi 2 Uber | LG 34GN850 | Asus PG279Q | Win 11 Pro | Custom water loop
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Vlada011
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Re: Ryzen or Intel build?
2019/08/29 13:17:32
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rjohnson11
Vlada011
I agree, AMD have excellent offers now and for rendering and for gaming, no matter what you need.
But something now allow me to abandon Intel yet. If they success to catch AMD with PCI-E 4.0 Interface on new generations OK.
If not my feelings will completely change and AMD will be only logic and possible option.
Intel really really need 10 core CPU up to 500$, PCI-E 4.0 Interface and nice Turbo Boost.
Even 10% faster then AMD I'm satisfied even ready to pay some extra cash to stay on Intel-NVIDIA.
Somehow I have impression that they are more stable with less problem, but owners of AMD know better,
most of them now complain on AMD platform.
PCI-E 3.0 Interface stop me to recommend i9-9900K to everyone who will keep platform several years.
Except that i9-9900K is great for gaming. My only wish is to replace my i7-5820K with i7-6950X.
Intel CPUs already run hot and 10 cores with a 14nm chip would require some really innovative cooling.
I have liquid custom loop ready, only I need is i7-6950X. OK I need little more money to add second 360mm radiator but my CPU, Mobo VRM and GPU are under active liquid cooling.
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Belial_69699
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Re: Ryzen or Intel build?
2019/08/29 19:53:03
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Great input so far guys, really appreciate all the info! Let's keep it civil though, no need to get any tempers up! XD I agree with most of you saying its so close and kind of a hard decision with Ryzen making some actual vast improvements and becoming an actual competitor now vs. Intel. I've used Intel for so many years since AMD fell behind but now, wow!
I'd like to add, couple of you mentioned the issue of heat with the cpu's. I always use an AIO water cooler so that shouldn't be a problem. Voltage shouldn't be a problem either, I've used Corsair cpu's for years and always get one that has more than plenty of power than what I need just in case (650-750 watt range). For RAM I'm a veteran user of Corsair Dominator Platinum, great memory and never have had a problem with it dying nor any compatibility issues!
The Crosshair mentioned is a pretty nice looking board, can't argue with that! Price range is about the same as the ACE too. I didn't know about the 4.0 PCI-E lanes either but that was certainly informative. Money really isn't a problem but I don't necessarily need an overkill machine (I'm no KINGPIN here my friends! ;) ) but I do want a rig that's gonna handle everything I throw at it and is a bit future proof and will last a long time.
Keep the info coming, I am really doing my research and taking what you all have to say into consideration! :)
"It's not who I am underneath, but what I do that defines me."
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AngryAce
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Re: Ryzen or Intel build?
2019/08/29 21:04:21
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Belial_69699
Great input so far guys, really appreciate all the info! Let's keep it civil though, no need to get any tempers up! XD I agree with most of you saying its so close and kind of a hard decision with Ryzen making some actual vast improvements and becoming an actual competitor now vs. Intel. I've used Intel for so many years since AMD fell behind but now, wow!
I'd like to add, couple of you mentioned the issue of heat with the cpu's. I always use an AIO water cooler so that shouldn't be a problem. Voltage shouldn't be a problem either, I've used Corsair cpu's for years and always get one that has more than plenty of power than what I need just in case (650-750 watt range). For RAM I'm a veteran user of Corsair Dominator Platinum, great memory and never have had a problem with it dying nor any compatibility issues!
The Crosshair mentioned is a pretty nice looking board, can't argue with that! Price range is about the same as the ACE too. I didn't know about the 4.0 PCI-E lanes either but that was certainly informative. Money really isn't a problem but I don't necessarily need an overkill machine (I'm no KINGPIN here my friends! ;) ) but I do want a rig that's gonna handle everything I throw at it and is a bit future proof and will last a long time.
Keep the info coming, I am really doing my research and taking what you all have to say into consideration! :)
I have a 9900k and Ryzen 3600x system which are powered by 1080 Ti GPUs. Games run fantastic on both. If AMD was going to be my main rig, then I'd have gone 3900x or wait for the 3950x later this year. I wanted to dabble with AMD again and the 3600x fit the bill and I am quite pleased with it, it boosts to 4250 on all cores with PBO in most cases. Under CPU intensive benchmarks like Prime95, it will drop to 4050 to 4100. I never owned a Radeon so I can't offer any input on their GPUs. I don't think you will be disappointed with either camp. I will admit I am having an intermittent issue with the Ryzen system that started yesterday. It gets stuck on post code 04 which Asus Crosshair x570 Hero VIII (WiFi) manual indicates a CPU issue. Hard to say if its the board or the CPU, difficult to troubleshoot this kind of stuff without extra components to swap out.
post edited by AngryAce - 2019/08/29 21:11:15
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Vlada011
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Re: Ryzen or Intel build?
2019/08/29 23:04:46
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Hoggle
Vlada011
RainStryke
With your listed usage, I would actually recommend to go with an Intel i7 9700K. With AMD you save a decent amount on the processor but pay more for the motherboard. Mainly for the PCI-E 4.0 feature that video cards don't even fully utilize yet. Also, the memory controller on RAM is stronger with Intel, so if you go this route, get some 4GHz+ RAM. AMD is getting a lot better now that they have put a lot more effort into better integration with Windows. But... they still have a long ways to go before they have the integration that Intel has.
DO YOU WANT TO STOP TO TALK ABOUT PCI-E 4.0 IMPROVEMENTS ON GPU.
NO ONE CARE FOR SMALL GPU IMPROVEMENTS ON PCI-E 4.0. BUT EVERYONE CARE BECAUSE PCI-E 4.0 SSD M.2 START TO SHOW UP AND THEY SPEED IS MUCH FASTER THEN BEST M.2 DRIVES ON INTEL PLATFORM.
And that's just beginning, race in speed on PCI-E 4.0 Interface will start very soon.
Eight M.2 PCI-E 3.0 drives on Intel X299 platform in RAID 0 reach 11.6GBps. On AMD X570 Four M.2 PCI-E 4.0 in RAID reac 15.5GBps Read and 15.5GBps write. One M.2 PCI-E 4.0 reach 5000/4300 speed. Best PCI-E 3.0 Samsung 970 PRO reach 3300/2800.
People forgot that now OS depend of PCI-E Interface, they are still in period when PCI-E 3.0 bring nothing to GPU sections and people installed system on SATA III Controller.
This is reason because it's PCI-E 4.0 important. OS is installed on this performance.
And that's just beginning, same as Samsung 950 before 3-3.5 years.
First Gen 4.0 M.2 on AMD platform.
Before Intel show up with PCI-E 4.0 results will be even better.
No benefits for gamers, no bigger fps on PCI-E 4.0, it's not important for gaming... Who care about gaming.
It's not USB speed, everything is on that drive. Imagine someone to sell you SATA II and other to sell you SATA III and you people constantly repeat its not bigger fps on SATA III.
We can love Intel or not, to wait because they have no full competitive platform or not, but ignoring these facts is foolish because buyers are people who try hard to follow last technology and buy best available hardware. They will not get firmware upgrade when Intel launch PCI-E 4.0 compatible platform, they will stay on PCI-E 3.0 years, you always need to go with possibility that period could be 5 years because some reason. 2025 on PCI-E 3.0 sound bad.
If AMD or Intel adopt PCI-E 5.0 on same way as PCI-E 4.0, same period after specifications are presented then PCI-E 5.0 will show up probably somewhere around 2023/2024.
With the specs for PCIe 5.0 already released I wouldn't say PCIe 4.0 is really going to get a lot of traction. Intel is likely to go right to 5.0 and a lot of companies will release 5.0 with backwards support for 4.0 and 3.0.
PCI-E 5.0 specifications are released, hardware is far from ready. PCI-E 4.0 specifications are presented 2016 or 2017 to us and now is end during 2020 will become widely used. We have and specifications for DDR5 but it's not here. Intel need to launch at least 2-3 generation in PCI-E 3.0 before PCI-E 5.0 become available. I will freaked if someone say again PCI-E 4.0 is nothing, no benefits in games. People buy system, install everything and then they reaction is like M.2 PCI-E 3.0 Gen 4 connected to PCI-E 2.0. Why so low read, write, copy... Because you don't have PCI-E 4.0 Interface. But people told me No benefits in games... why my System Drive is half slower. Because you listen people who think that Windows is still installed on SATA III Controller and buying Intel chipset now is like possessing of SATA II in period of SATA III. Situation for X299 and Z390 owners is much worse then mine on X99 compare to X299 and Z390. Mine Intel Chipset on X99 is Gen 2.0 but installing on M.2 on slot connected to CPU I got regular speed of Gen 3.0. On Intel Z390 and X299 people can't do nothing to reach speed of Gen 4.0. Only AMD could give them such performance.
post edited by Vlada011 - 2019/08/29 23:11:59
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Vlada011
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Re: Ryzen or Intel build?
2019/08/29 23:22:02
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I'm angry on self because PCI-E 4.0 show up just like that, suddenly and I didn't know to buy MP600 2TB. I would use him on speed of PCI-E 3.0, performance would be lower but I have better M.2 for next platform, that's 200 euro lost. Investing in platform limited to PCI-E 3.0, high end, expensive now is Sci-Fi from my perspective. Waiting with lower performance then I need is much better option then celebrate New Year Eve 2025 with PCI-E 3.0. I think waiting to Intel adopt new Interface is excellent information for company compare to suddenly investing in AMD. That's best Intel fans could do to avoid to be foolish because Intel didn't dropped price like AMD with Bulldozer, Intel is still think We are OK, no big deal, easy, next platform again PCI-E 3.0, What fps is same? Fact that AMD knock down Intel Xtreme performance with mainstream platform, that's successor of Phenom II X4, and Bulldozer is chaotic and months no answer from Intel. Imagine then Threadripper next platform with PCI-E 4.0, who knows how many PCI-E lanes, etc... Platform will have for sure place for two M.2 in RAID 0 for OS and one more M.2 for Gaming drive, all in PCI-E 4.0 speed with just few SATA III connectors.
post edited by Vlada011 - 2019/08/29 23:29:41
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RainStryke
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Re: Ryzen or Intel build?
2019/08/30 06:21:01
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Intel's roadmap doesn't show any improvements on PCI-E until late 2021 or early 2022 and it's expected to jump straight to PCI-E 6.0. The thing is, they do have Optane if you are looking to get an increase in your hard drive speeds and stay on Intel. They do have things like Rapid Storage Technology... It is similar to Windows superfetch but for SSD's. AMD still doesn't have anything like it. While AMD is making huge improvements all around, you are still going to get to take on all of the heart burn from being an early adopter. AMD still has a lot of refinement ahead.
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kougar
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Re: Ryzen or Intel build?
2019/08/30 06:29:53
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"Future proof" and computer technology are a fickle thing.  X570 should be compatible with Zen 3 in 2020. But I can tell you right now Zen 4 will not be compatible. Zen4 is due in 2021 and will be the first AMD chips to adopt the upcoming DDR5... this always requires a new socket change and given the age of the AM4 socket anyway it is guaranteed to change for Zen 4 chips.
 Have water, will cool.
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Vlada011
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Re: Ryzen or Intel build?
2019/08/31 17:32:53
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RainStryke
Intel's roadmap doesn't show any improvements on PCI-E until late 2021 or early 2022 and it's expected to jump straight to PCI-E 6.0. The thing is, they do have Optane if you are looking to get an increase in your hard drive speeds and stay on Intel. They do have things like Rapid Storage Technology... It is similar to Windows superfetch but for SSD's. AMD still doesn't have anything like it. While AMD is making huge improvements all around, you are still going to get to take on all of the heart burn from being an early adopter. AMD still has a lot of refinement ahead.
No thanks, I will left Intel Optane to others. I will use rather PCI-E 4.0 or 5.0 then PCI-E 3.0 Until 2021, if Intel stay on PCI-E 3.0 they will stay behind like SATA III SSD compared to first NVme drives.  Customers only should wait to Intel present new PCI-E 3.0 platform but if they wait that moment AMD price will increase after that. Anyway last 2 years that was not Road map, that's Intel's road to hell because with every new generation of AMD Ryzen they are less competitive. I think more people wait new Intel generations to confirm upgrade to AMD, then to buy Intel. From my perspective people who invest 1000-1500$ in motherboard, CPU, RAM should pay 200$ more for PCI-E 4.0 then PCI-E 3.0. Imagine same chipset, same memory, same number of cores, same performance of everything else, same power consumption only difference is PCI-E 4.0 and PCI-E 3.0 and off course speed of drives... It's worth to pay 200$ even little more just for that because that's impact on several other things. Performance of CPU and GPU stay same, OK. Only improvement in few other things worth more then 200$, now. When SATA III SSD was max situation was different. That's mine view.
post edited by Vlada011 - 2019/08/31 17:47:11
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Belial_69699
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Re: Ryzen or Intel build?
2019/08/31 18:22:58
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Using the builds I mentioned above, none of these builds would bottle-neck a newer gpu correct? I know some games rely more on a gpu while some games are more cpu intensive. Also some games don't fully utilize all cores while playing. I'm guessing an i7 or even the Ryzen 3700X, 3800X would be plenty of power for gaming without bottle-necking the video card?
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aka_STEVE_b
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Re: Ryzen or Intel build?
2019/08/31 18:44:58
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I can say in regards to gaming --> I was just using an i5-6600K before I finished this AMD Ryzen 3 build and the exact same games that were taxing the i5 to close to 99% usage while playing are now barely making my Ryzen go to 30% cpu usage... so the answer to your latest question is YES, the Ryzen 3600,3700,3800,etc...are great for gaming and are NOT going to bottleneck your video cards or games at all .
post edited by aka_STEVE_b - 2019/08/31 18:47:34
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Belial_69699
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Re: Ryzen or Intel build?
2019/08/31 19:08:00
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That's good to hear! A question regarding Intel, what's the difference between the K and the KF models? I know a regular (for example) i7 9700 is locked, a 9700K is unlocked for overclocking but what's the deal with the KF series?
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RainStryke
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Re: Ryzen or Intel build?
2019/08/31 21:02:06
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Belial_69699
That's good to hear! A question regarding Intel, what's the difference between the K and the KF models? I know a regular (for example) i7 9700 is locked, a 9700K is unlocked for overclocking but what's the deal with the KF series?
It does not have a integrated GPU. On average, it overclocks slightly better than the K series stuff.
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