ObscureEmpyre

kram36

atfrico
Have you tried folding with the GPU Kram to see if you get the same results? I am a bit curious about the wattage🤔

Well, that's interesting, however folding is nothing like gaming. It's only using a 88% GPU load and 4% Memory load, which doesn't required over 264w.
 

 

Do you have HWiNFO installed? If so, what’s the power reading from that? I’ve heard GPU-Z can be inaccurate. Also, have you run MSI Kombustor? That maxes out my card’s power, so it’d be sure to max out yours.

when I tested, GPUz and HWinfo gave near identical readings. less than 1% variance. GPUz isnt inaccurate. 
 
the only load that maxes my card is the DX12 raytracing benchmark.
 
Kombustor runs like 320W on my GPU.

atfrico
What bios you have? Can you post bios info
And GPU info from GPUZ like revision, memory clocks, etc

the stock 3080 Ti XC3 Hydrocopper BIOS. I forget the exact version number.
 
but it's all stock. not reflashed with any other card's BIOS. 
19Gbps memory, stock PL = 350W, configurable up to 366W max.
 
using the latest GPUz v2.40

kram36

gsrcrxsi

kram36
 
Again, I can't touch 350w with ether of my cards, ever, lucky to average 300w. If EVGA says 350w I want my 350w. I didn't pay over $1,500 for a 3080 Ti XC3 Hydro Copper to have it performing more like a 3080 Super card. EVGA sold me the cards saying they are 350w cards, my issues is with EVGA, not Nvidia.

what power draw do you see running the DX12 raytracking benchmark?

I can't currently run that benchmark. Went to run it and it said I needed to update Windows. I can't update Windows at the moment, my pc is busy doing other things.

will be interesting to see once you update. since that was the only test to get it to the real limit. I suspect other people will see similar results.

gsrcrxsi

atfrico
What bios you have? Can you post bios info
And GPU info from GPUZ like revision, memory clocks, etc

the stock 3080 Ti XC3 Hydrocopper BIOS. I forget the exact version number.
 
but it's all stock. not reflashed with any other card's BIOS. 
19Gbps memory, stock PL = 350W, configurable up to 366W max.
 
using the latest GPUz v2.40

Can you post the info whenever you have the chance?
Some GPUs specs differ from others id seen this trust me that is the reason i would like you to post this because i want to compare it with krams.
Kram already posted bencmark results with wattage, so my alternative is to see the specs through GPUZ

atfrico

gsrcrxsi

atfrico
What bios you have? Can you post bios info
And GPU info from GPUZ like revision, memory clocks, etc

the stock 3080 Ti XC3 Hydrocopper BIOS. I forget the exact version number.
 
but it's all stock. not reflashed with any other card's BIOS. 
19Gbps memory, stock PL = 350W, configurable up to 366W max.
 
using the latest GPUz v2.40

Can you post the info whenever you have the chance?
Some GPUs specs differ from others id seen this trust me that is the reason i would like you to post this because i want to compare it with krams.
Kram already posted bencmark results with wattage, so my alternative is to see the specs through GPUZ

what information do you want specifically?
 
my BIOS id is different than krams air cooled card, but exactly the same as his HC since he has the same sku. all of the BIOS parameters are the same otherwise.
 
 

gsrcrxsi

atfrico

gsrcrxsi

atfrico
What bios you have? Can you post bios info
And GPU info from GPUZ like revision, memory clocks, etc

the stock 3080 Ti XC3 Hydrocopper BIOS. I forget the exact version number.

but it's all stock. not reflashed with any other card's BIOS. 
19Gbps memory, stock PL = 350W, configurable up to 366W max.

using the latest GPUz v2.40

Can you post the info whenever you have the chance?
Some GPUs specs differ from others id seen this trust me that is the reason i would like you to post this because i want to compare it with krams.
Kram already posted bencmark results with wattage, so my alternative is to see the specs through GPUZ

what information do you want specifically?
 
my BIOS id is different than krams air cooled card, but exactly the same as his HC since he has the same sku. all of the BIOS parameters are the same otherwise.
 
 

Not all silicons are the same, we all know that, my question is if kram can use the same bios you have, then his GPU can perform the same as yours?
That is the question

ObscureEmpyre

gsrcrxsi

ObscureEmpyre

kram36

atfrico
Have you tried folding with the GPU Kram to see if you get the same results? I am a bit curious about the wattage🤔

Well, that's interesting, however folding is nothing like gaming. It's only using a 88% GPU load and 4% Memory load, which doesn't required over 264w.

Do you have HWiNFO installed? If so, what’s the power reading from that? I’ve heard GPU-Z can be inaccurate. Also, have you run MSI Kombustor? That maxes out my card’s power, so it’d be sure to max out yours.

when I tested, GPUz and HWinfo gave near identical readings. less than 1% variance. GPUz isnt inaccurate. 
 
the only load that maxes my card is the DX12 raytracing benchmark.
 
Kombustor runs like 320W on my GPU.

That’s interesting. When running the DirectX Raytracing benchmark, the highest my power draw ever got to was 381.2W. I have a FTW3 card, and I’ve seen it go right up to 450W using Kombustor.

It can depend on your polling rate, the card will have spikes here and there to 445-450W, but it won't sustain or go close to 450W. 
 

kram36

KingEngineRevUp

kram36
 
Again, I can't touch 350w with ether of my cards, ever, lucky to average 300w. If EVGA says 350w I want my 350w. I didn't pay over $1,500 for a 3080 Ti XC3 Hydro Copper to have it performing more like a 3080 Super card. EVGA sold me the cards saying they are 350w cards, my issues is with EVGA, not Nvidia.

Having conversations with you is very frustrating sometimes. You're not understand what I'm trying to say so I won't bother anymore. 

You're making excuses that I don't except. EVGA advertised this card as a 350w, configurable up to 366W max card. I'm not getting what I paid for, nothing even close to what I paid for on either card. The issue is with EVGA, not Nvidia. If the cards can't do what EVGA advertised them as because of Nvidia, then that's false advertising. If I have cards that where manufactured incorrectly, then EVGA should replace the cards at their cost.

NO I AM NOT! That's the point and my problem with your buffoonery. Either you're purposely being disrespectful and not actually reading my post or have some kind of weird selective reading issue. I believe it is the latter. 
 
 

Guys stop bickering. Lets focus in the bios version for now.
Kram is doing all in his power to find a solution to keep his GPUs. I think i found one and that is finding the right bios to use

KingEngineRevUp

atfrico
Guys stop bickering. Lets focus in the bios version for now.
Kram is doing all in his power to find a solution to keep his GPUs. I think i found one and that is finding the right bios to use

No **** really? That was part of the bickering I was trying to get at. 
 
If the Ventus, Eagle and Zotac cards are hitting their 350W easily, then use those BIOses, but we wont' really know unless someone tries it or we talk to one of these guys and get test on their cards done. 

He tried the zotac already and he cant keep using the bios it is not EVGA supported.
Kram needs to find a EVGA bios that can work with his gpu.
He already did what you told him to do before you said it and that is trying another bios

atfrico

KingEngineRevUp

atfrico
Guys stop bickering. Lets focus in the bios version for now.
Kram is doing all in his power to find a solution to keep his GPUs. I think i found one and that is finding the right bios to use

No **** really? That was part of the bickering I was trying to get at. 
 
If the Ventus, Eagle and Zotac cards are hitting their 350W easily, then use those BIOses, but we wont' really know unless someone tries it or we talk to one of these guys and get test on their cards done. 

He tried the zotac already and he cant keep using the bios it is not EVGA supported.
Kram needs to find a EVGA bios that can work with his gpu.
He already did what you told him to do before you said it and that is trying another bios

he's tried other EVGA BIOSes already. they are the same (aside from fans and RGB). all of the BIOS's from 3080Ti XC3 cards are more or less identical except for how they report the specific model and fan/rgb layout. 
 
there is no other EVGA BIOS he can try. flashing a FTW3 bios not only wont work (lower effective power caps due to 3plug/2plug scaling), but also increases the chances of flash problems IMO.
 
and yes he tried the Zotac 385W BIOS already with no change in behavior.
 
on my pre-RMA card, I also flashed the hybrid BIOS, as well as a HC bios from an identical card that someone else uploaded to TPU. neither made any difference, they performed identically and exhibited identical power limiting behavior to pre-flash.

KingEngineRevUp
 
Has he tried another card with a 350W limit like I listed above? Like I stated earlier, there might be 3 different type of reference designs. If the Eagle or Ventus can sustain 350W in all loads, then that says something. 
 

It's worth a try to rule out cases. but I'm 99% certain it wont make any difference and he'll see near identical performance with another BIOS from MSI or Gigabyte

atfrico

KingEngineRevUp

atfrico
Guys stop bickering. Lets focus in the bios version for now.
Kram is doing all in his power to find a solution to keep his GPUs. I think i found one and that is finding the right bios to use

No **** really? That was part of the bickering I was trying to get at. 
 
If the Ventus, Eagle and Zotac cards are hitting their 350W easily, then use those BIOses, but we wont' really know unless someone tries it or we talk to one of these guys and get test on their cards done. 

He tried the zotac already and he cant keep using the bios it is not EVGA supported.
Kram needs to find a EVGA bios that can work with his gpu.
He already did what you told him to do before you said it and that is trying another bios

Correct, I did run the Zotac AMP Holo Black bios on my card just for test runs. I did get a slightly better score. Do you not remember responding to the post?
 

KingEngineRevUp

kram36

I read it and replied to it and then gsrcrxsi started taking you to task on that post, so I did not interrupt your and his discussion from then on.
 
So you're telling everyone a different bios would not help the issue? May I present to you my results using a two 8 pin Zotac bios on the XC3 that allows for more power. Not great, but better then the EVGA bios.
 
Port Royal
 
https://www.3dmark.com/pr/1137081
 
Compared. Notice the higher average clock speed? https://www.3dmark.com/compare/pr/1137081/pr/1136708# 
 
Time Spy
 
https://www.3dmark.com/fs/25942832
 
Compared. Notice the higher average clock speed? https://www.3dmark.com/compare/spy/21652985/spy/21648694
 
Fire Strike Extreme
 
https://www.3dmark.com/spy/21652985
 
Compared. Notice the higher average clock speed? https://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/25942832/fs/25941800
 
 

Again, all gsrcrxsi said was "I've used equipment too and I'm also an engineer." Never did he prove or do his own measurements to disprove the other engineers work.

And no, I said that there are fuses on the EVGA cards and we need to measure the power draw so if we do start finding alternative bios we don't blow those fuses and cause another mess.

The EVGA cards load balance is absolute crap. Pin 2 might be drawing more than Pin 1 on the XC3 like it is the FTW3.

XC3 owners might be in a worse situation than you already are and that's a bigger black eye on EVGA on these cards if true.

The reason some of this research came about was because the Galax bios gives the FTW3 card 1000W, so to safely use it, real power draw from cards should be measured to not risk blowing the fuses. Hardware measure power draw was higher than GPU-Z. Pin 2 was a lot higher than GPU-Z was reporting. So if anyone went off of GPU-Z, they would blow a fuse using the Galax bios.

How does this relate to the XC3, it's possible that EVGA screwed this up by setting a hardware limit on Pin 1 and 2 and they didn't load balance the pins correctly. When you're trying to draw 150W per a Pin (150+150+63), Pin 2 might actually be drawing more than it should and it can be the reason you can't go above 300W because once Pin 2 might be hitting the stop button even though Pin 1 and PCI-E are still game to draw more power.

Sorry, I had to edit this post a few times because of mobile and browser keeps refreshing.

KingEngineRevUp

gsrcrxsi

KingEngineRevUp
 
Has he tried another card with a 350W limit like I listed above? Like I stated earlier, there might be 3 different type of reference designs. If the Eagle or Ventus can sustain 350W in all loads, then that says something. 
 

It's worth a try to rule out cases. but I'm 99% certain it wont make any difference and he'll see near identical performance with another BIOS from MSI or Gigabyte

Any chance you can try them to see if there is any behavior changes in your power draw or scores? No pressure. 

I’m not interested in flashing my card at the moment. It’s busy running Linux crunching Einstein. So I’ll let someone else who’s not busy try it out and report back if it changes anything.

kram36

KingEngineRevUp
The Zotac Holo has a max TDP at around 385W, so that would fall in the Tier 2 group of cards like the TUF, Gaming, Vision, etc. The 3080 XC3 guys didn't have luck flashing from these groups of cards as an example. 
 
I'm curious how the Ventus bios would work on your card. I would try the Eagle second. The Ventus is closer to an XC3 from what I can see. 
 
If your card indeed does perform better with the Ventus or Eagle BIOs, then we know for a fact EVGA can fix this with a BIOs update of their own. 

I don't have access to the MSI Ventus or Gigabyte Eagle bios files, well at least not from techpowerup.

 
They are here. 

Here's the Eagle: https://www.techpowerup.com/vgabios/234508/234508
 
Here's the Ventus: https://www.techpowerup.com/vgabios/235592/235592
 
The Eagle looks almost close, instead of +5% (363W) it's +6% (370W).

gsrcrxsi
this is the zotac BIOS he tried. https://www.techpowerup.com/vgabios/234020/zotac-rtx3080ti-12288-210420
 
it has a default power limit of 350W. just like the others. having only +6% vs +10% seems inconsequential. these are the same class of power limits in my opinion. and likely makes no difference anyway since it can't even reach 350 due to the artificial lower power limit being enforced for certain workloads.

It sounds inconsequential BUT it is based off of the 3080 cards history. https://www.overclock.net/threads/official-nvidia-rtx-3080-owners-club.1753932/ this thread is quite mature. 
 
Even though this card has a start TDP at around 350W, the max TDP is what you really go off of that puts it in a certain tier and being around 385W puts it in that second tier. 
 
Go talk to 3080 owners. The Ventus and XC3 guys couldn't flash a Gaming, Vision, TUF BIOs to get anything more out of their card. Their cards couldn't go above 350W even though all cards were 2X 8-pin. But the Ventus guys did get a benefit from flashing a XC3 bios, they got 30W more for their cards. 
 
I don't have high hopes the Ventus and Eagle bios will do anything, but it's worth a shot. It's the only immediate thing I can think of right now that might get Kram more performance.