Brad_Hawthorne
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/08 11:54:54
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ty_ger07 I heard that RTX/DXR supports time travel. They are just waiting for proper operating system, game developer, and theoretical physicist support. Some day (TM).
There I fixed it.
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HaywireHaywood
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/08 12:12:23
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What something is worth is purely subjective and is dependent on personal wants and needs. Just because something isn't worth the cost to one person doesn't mean that it isn't worth it to anyone else. It's quite pointless to discuss (argue about) it.
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panzlock
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/08 12:19:10
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HaywireHaywood What something is worth is purely subjective and is dependent on personal wants and needs. Just because something isn't worth the cost to one person doesn't mean that it isn't worth it to anyone else. It's quite pointless to discuss (argue about) it.
Wrong. When deciding on a purchase you need to be objective. I will not purchase Chryslers because they are inherently flawed despite their decent MSRP. Someone else, however, might prefer them because of aesthetics or they developed an emotional attachment that dates back years. That is a subjective, and poor way to make financial decisions. Such a mentality is very much like a Chrysler.
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HaywireHaywood
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/08 12:53:56
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In your example, aesthetics is a quality that is valued by the person in question and has more value to that person than reliability. Value is subjective to the person making the evaluation.
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panzlock
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/08 13:12:29
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HaywireHaywood In your example, aesthetics is a quality that is valued by the person in question and has more value to that person than reliability. Value is subjective to the person making the evaluation.
Valuing trivial qualities leads to poor financial decisions. Again, subjective thinking can get people in alot of trouble.
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joeymir
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/08 13:35:13
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Gosh I love this forum! Free entertainment All I know is, RTX cards are priced high due to this new tech, and this is what people are buying these cards for, Hec this is why prices of Flagship GPU's have climbed over 140% since let's say 2003. Seriously think about that. We consumers are paying more than DOUBLE! what we used to for a Flagship GPU(2080 Ti) hec I won't even bring into discussion the TITAN lineup which is truly a questionable card since it's introduction in 2013. Anyway to my point, if I were to say going out to buy a car, and let's say I am paying so much extra for a particular feature, let's say collision avoidance detection, yet this system only works about 10% of the time? But may get better overtime. Was this feature worth the initial cost? NO it's not worth a damn until it's fully functional. I know it's probably not a fair analogy, but the same principle stands. Yes gaming GPU's are indeed a hobby and I do agree technological advancement does have a price given R&D, and can't advance if nobody "consumes" but at what point do we let the price hikes of "new tech" stop? Hec I know prices of everything in our world has increased dramatically, but dang! $1200+ for a single GPU, just to play a video game(also very counter productive activity in life) that has features upon release that hardly function? It's just out of control is all. Just like the rest of the world P.S. I think it's very important to forget about the naming scheme of GPU's and simply remember what term FLAGSHIP stands for in all aspects. It's the best, the most desirable, the most sought after, the thing everyone wants, the bees knees. This is where the Titan always confused me It was heavily advertised as a gaming card, even so Nvidia directly compared it to the GTX 680. https://www.geforce.com/whats-new/articles/introducing-the-geforce-gtx-titanNot a Quadro card. Nvidia has played us all for fools, and here we sit forking out more and more money to them along with AMD and their $700 GPU, but at at least you know it's their Flagship.
post edited by joeymir - 2019/02/08 13:56:15
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transdogmifier
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/08 14:03:09
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panzlock
HaywireHaywood What something is worth is purely subjective and is dependent on personal wants and needs. Just because something isn't worth the cost to one person doesn't mean that it isn't worth it to anyone else. It's quite pointless to discuss (argue about) it.
Wrong. When deciding on a purchase you need to be objective. I will not purchase Chryslers because they are inherently flawed despite their decent MSRP. Someone else, however, might prefer them because of aesthetics or they developed an emotional attachment that dates back years. That is a subjective, and poor way to make financial decisions. Such a mentality is very much like a Chrysler.
Not really. Making a purchase is subjective. What I think is worth it, you might completely disagree with. Are you suggesting that you know how to spend my money better than I do? I think not. Normally I don't bristle at things like this, but the mere suggestion that you think I can't make a purchasing decision correctly simply because YOU think it's not worth it is absolutely ludicrous..and make no mistake...that's exactly what you're suggesting by inferring that by my purchasing Nvidia I wasn't objective (in your opinion). Nope. Wrong. I'm objective from my point of view and within the bounds of my experience. Speak for yourself. Never speak for me or anyone else. Thank you.
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atfrico
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/08 14:13:09
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I am subjective to my own opinion and spending to realtime tech usage and not phony lies and tech that is not being used. If anyone disagrees please refer those disagreements to my assistance below, if he cares to listen to you:
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kram36
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/08 14:15:22
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joeymir P.S. I think it's very important to forget about the naming scheme of GPU's and simply remember what term FLAGSHIP stands for in all aspects. It's the best, the most desirable, the most sought after, the thing everyone wants, the bees knees. This is where the Titan always confused me It was heavily advertised as a gaming card, even so Nvidia directly compared it to the GTX 680.
Yes, let's do compare the FLAGSHIP cards. Last gen Nvidia's FLAGSHIP gaming card was the Titan XP and it sold for $1,200. Now Nvidia's FLAGSHIP gaming card is the RTX 2080 Ti and it sells for $1,200, but it kills the Titan XP in performance and has more features. Sorry, what was your argument again?
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joeymir
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/08 14:24:08
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I think you completely missed my point there bud. Simple and short, a Flagship GPU is actually a staggering $2500. Where as in 2003, and FX 5950 Ultra was $500. All I am saying THATS A 400% INCREASE IN PRICE FOR A FLAGSHIP GPU I was really just trying to say Nvidia's true flagship GPU is actually still the Titan, no matter the lies and sales tactics they use to convince you otherwise. P.S.(again sorry) before someone says something daft like " But the RTX Titan isn't a gaming card". The fact it has more of everything than a RTX 2080 Ti and PWNS the RTX 2080 Ti in every benchmark, and is of the same architecture, I completely and utterly beg to differ. That is your true "Flagship" card.
post edited by joeymir - 2019/02/08 14:49:31
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LittleGuy
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/08 14:53:42
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kram36
joeymir P.S. I think it's very important to forget about the naming scheme of GPU's and simply remember what term FLAGSHIP stands for in all aspects. It's the best, the most desirable, the most sought after, the thing everyone wants, the bees knees. This is where the Titan always confused me It was heavily advertised as a gaming card, even so Nvidia directly compared it to the GTX 680.
Yes, let's do compare the FLAGSHIP cards. Last gen Nvidia's FLAGSHIP gaming card was the Titan XP and it sold for $1,200. Now Nvidia's FLAGSHIP gaming card is the RTX Titan and it sells for $2500 but it kills the Titan XP in performance and has more features. Sorry, what was your argument again?
Fixed your error on flagship cards.
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kram36
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/08 15:53:27
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joeymir I think you completely missed my point there bud. Simple and short, a Flagship GPU is actually a staggering $2500. Where as in 2003, and FX 5950 Ultra was $500. All I am saying THATS A 400% INCREASE IN PRICE FOR A FLAGSHIP GPU I was really just trying to say Nvidia's true flagship GPU is actually still the Titan, no matter the lies and sales tactics they use to convince you otherwise. P.S.(again sorry) before someone says something daft like " But the RTX Titan isn't a gaming card". The fact it has more of everything than a RTX 2080 Ti and PWNS the RTX 2080 Ti in every benchmark, and is of the same architecture, I completely and utterly beg to differ. That is your true "Flagship" card.
LittleGuy
kram36
joeymir P.S. I think it's very important to forget about the naming scheme of GPU's and simply remember what term FLAGSHIP stands for in all aspects. It's the best, the most desirable, the most sought after, the thing everyone wants, the bees knees. This is where the Titan always confused me It was heavily advertised as a gaming card, even so Nvidia directly compared it to the GTX 680.
Yes, let's do compare the FLAGSHIP cards. Last gen Nvidia's FLAGSHIP gaming card was the Titan XP and it sold for $1,200. Now Nvidia's FLAGSHIP gaming card is the RTX Titan and it sells for $2500 but it kills the Titan XP in performance and has more features. Sorry, what was your argument again?
Fixed your error on flagship cards.
You're both incorrect. Nvidia markets the Titan RTX for AI researchers, deep learning developers, data scientists, and content creators, not gaming. I'd like to also mention not only is the RTX 2080 Ti killing the Titan XP in performance with more features at the same price, the RTX 2080 Ti cost Nvidia more money to produce.
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joeymir
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/08 16:13:14
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kram36
joeymir I think you completely missed my point there bud. Simple and short, a Flagship GPU is actually a staggering $2500. Where as in 2003, and FX 5950 Ultra was $500. All I am saying THATS A 400% INCREASE IN PRICE FOR A FLAGSHIP GPU I was really just trying to say Nvidia's true flagship GPU is actually still the Titan, no matter the lies and sales tactics they use to convince you otherwise. P.S.(again sorry) before someone says something daft like " But the RTX Titan isn't a gaming card". The fact it has more of everything than a RTX 2080 Ti and PWNS the RTX 2080 Ti in every benchmark, and is of the same architecture, I completely and utterly beg to differ. That is your true "Flagship" card.
LittleGuy
kram36
joeymir P.S. I think it's very important to forget about the naming scheme of GPU's and simply remember what term FLAGSHIP stands for in all aspects. It's the best, the most desirable, the most sought after, the thing everyone wants, the bees knees. This is where the Titan always confused me It was heavily advertised as a gaming card, even so Nvidia directly compared it to the GTX 680.
Yes, let's do compare the FLAGSHIP cards. Last gen Nvidia's FLAGSHIP gaming card was the Titan XP and it sold for $1,200. Now Nvidia's FLAGSHIP gaming card is the RTX Titan and it sells for $2500 but it kills the Titan XP in performance and has more features. Sorry, what was your argument again?
Fixed your error on flagship cards.
You're both incorrect. Nvidia markets the Titan RTX for AI researchers, deep learning developers, data scientists, and content creators, not gaming.
I'd like to also mention not only is the RTX 2080 Ti killing the Titan XP in performance with more features at the same price, the RTX 2080 Ti cost Nvidia more money to produce.
Well I won't argue with you on this one anymore. If you truly believe this and every other word that Nvidia spews out, then you truly are lost. Funny how Nvidia had sent so many review samples to so many different reviewers to compare the original Titan to other gaming cards, even going as far as publicly comparing it to their GTX 680 at the time on there own website?(not the Quadro). Either way flagship is flagship. Until the 2080 Ti grows 256 more Cude Cores, 32 more Tensor Cores, 4 more RT cores, 384-Bit memory interface, and 13GB more VRAM, ect, ect, the RTX 2080 Ti is still not a flagship GPU. Oh and hey what about Titan V? I am not the first person to slam Nvidia on this and see through their deceptive marketing strategies and ploy's. TITAN series simply should not exist. Back on topic though. The RTX 2080 and the Radeon VII both offer outstanding performance, and more then enough performance to give a fluid gaming experience. Both have there trade-off's it's just a matter of what one's personal preference. Ray-Tracing and DLSS or 16GB of dedicated GPU HBM2 memory. Both are awesome cards, both are expensive, both need driver enhancements & some more TLC.
post edited by joeymir - 2019/02/08 16:52:30
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kram36
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/08 17:37:22
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joeymir Well I won't argue with you on this one anymore. If you truly believe this and every other word that Nvidia spews out, then you truly are lost. Funny how Nvidia had sent so many review samples to so many different reviewers to compare the original Titan to other gaming cards, even going as far as publicly comparing it to their GTX 680 at the time on there own website?(not the Quadro). Either way flagship is flagship. Until the 2080 Ti grows 256 more Cude Cores, 32 more Tensor Cores, 4 more RT cores, 384-Bit memory interface, and 13GB more VRAM, ect, ect, the RTX 2080 Ti is still not a flagship GPU. Oh and hey what about Titan V? I am not the first person to slam Nvidia on this and see through their deceptive marketing strategies and ploy's. TITAN series simply should not exist. Back on topic though. The RTX 2080 and the Radeon VII both offer outstanding performance, and more then enough performance to give a fluid gaming experience. Both have there trade-off's it's just a matter of what one's personal preference. Ray-Tracing and DLSS or 16GB of dedicated GPU HBM2 memory. Both are awesome cards, both are expensive, both need driver enhancements & some more TLC.
The Titan RTX was sent to reviewers to compare it to the Titan V, which is also marketed to AI researchers, deep learning developers, data scientists, and content creators, not gaming. Just because people are using them to game with does not make what Nvidia created the card for invalid. If you want to get into Nvidia's FLAGSHIP card, why don't you go all out with the QUADRO RTX 8000 card that cost $10,000? Once again, Nvidia's FLAGSHIP gaming card is the RTX 2080 Ti and it sells for $1,200, but it kills the Titan XP in performance and has more features that cost $1,200 and the RTX 2080 Ti cost more money for Nvidia to make.
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joeymir
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Vlada011
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/09 00:05:40
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I beat Radeon VII with GTX1080Ti Poseidon in every synthetic tests, 1080p and 4K. And I'm happy because of that. If I didn't had money for newest NVIDIA at least I beat 2.5 years newer Radeon with same power consumption. To beat Radeon VII you need GTX1080Ti with boost over 1900-1950MHz.
post edited by Vlada011 - 2019/02/09 00:08:00
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rjohnson11
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/09 00:42:37
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Vlada011 I beat Radeon VII with GTX1080Ti Poseidon in every synthetic tests, 1080p and 4K. And I'm happy because of that. If I didn't had money for newest NVIDIA at least I beat 2.5 years newer Radeon with same power consumption. To beat Radeon VII you need GTX1080Ti with boost over 1900-1950MHz.
OK but some GTX 1080ti cards won't boost that high. Anyway AMD needs to be more competitive in the GPU area to force NVIDIA to cut costs. AMD also needs their partners to be far more involved in 3rd party cooling and overclocking. Just my opinion.
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GTXJackBauer
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/09 03:35:07
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I think Lisa (AMD's CEO) being Jensen's (Nvidia CEO) niece is a massive conflict of interest if you ask me. What are the odds if she's purposely sabotaging AMD to give Nvidia that extra headroom. I'm not saying or speculating this is happening but just a odd ball thought. lol
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rjohnson11
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/09 03:51:57
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GTXJackBauer I think Lisa (AMD's CEO) being Jensen's (Nvidia CEO) niece is a massive conflict of interest if you ask me. What are the odds if she's purposely sabotaging AMD to give Nvidia that extra headroom. I'm not saying or speculating this is happening but just a odd ball thought. lol
I doubt that and she could risk prison time for such an act. AMD has stock holders who hold AMD accountable for its actions. You can't expect AMD's GPU division to catch up to NVIDIA in 1 year's time. AMD's CPU division has had more time to play catchup and Intel's issues with 10nm CPUs gave them (AMD) even more time. I believe AMD is headed in the right direction BUT I also believe they made some bad decisions such as: 1: Not allowing their partners to make better/quieter cooling solutions for Radeon 7 prior to release 2: Making sure overclocking was working properly prior to release 3: HBM2 memory is the most expensive part of the graphics card (for a gaming card). 12GB would have been enough and resulted in lower pricing. 4: Watercooling options for their partners would have been good at launch AMD still has more work for them to make a better graphics card but this is a good first step in my opinion and a significant improvement over the last gen AMD graphics card.
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Vlada011
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/09 05:06:28
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I didn't overclock my card. She boost on 1985MHz on Air and 2012MHz on Liquid Cooling. EVGA GTX1080Ti FTW have high boost as well.
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ty_ger07
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/09 06:41:29
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If the GTX 1080 Ti competes with the GTX 2080, the Radeon VII competes with the GTX 2080, then, yes the GTX 1080 Ti competes with the Radeon VII.
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HaywireHaywood
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/09 07:04:45
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About the HBM2, GN said that AMD went that route over power requirements. HMB2 uses much less power than GDDR6 and that savings was needed for the design.
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ty_ger07
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/09 07:21:30
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HaywireHaywood About the HBM2, GN said that AMD went that route over power requirements. HMB2 uses much less power than GDDR6 and that savings was needed for the design.
Also, the GPU core is reused from a higher-end datacenter model and would have required redesign and manufacturing retooling to switch from HBM2 to GDDR6.
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Brad_Hawthorne
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/09 09:48:36
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GTXJackBauer I think Lisa (AMD's CEO) being Jensen's (Nvidia CEO) niece is a massive conflict of interest if you ask me. What are the odds if she's purposely sabotaging AMD to give Nvidia that extra headroom. I'm not saying or speculating this is happening but just a odd ball thought. lol
Collusion is typically mutually beneficial. Donno why you would infer it would favor one side. We've seen that sort of thing with panel, hard drive and memory manufacturers that have gotten caught in the last decade. Personally I find the idea silly though. It's as though AMD's CEO can't be as driven as Nvidia's?
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ssj92
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/10 11:38:54
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Actually from the reviews I saw, the VII didn't do that bad WHEN it was working. I agree with the reviewers that they should have waited longer to release to fix the driver issues. It seems with proper drivers it could have been a very good launch. It's not far behind 2080 and some tests slightly beat 2080. I don't understand though, if AMD knew about the issues, why didn't they push back the release date? They really shot themselves in the foot here.
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kram36
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/10 12:01:16
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ssj92 I don't understand though, if AMD knew about the issues, why didn't they push back the release date? They really shot themselves in the foot here.
What if there isn't a a simple driver fix for the issues?
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GTXJackBauer
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/10 15:38:13
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kram36
ssj92 I don't understand though, if AMD knew about the issues, why didn't they push back the release date? They really shot themselves in the foot here.
What if there isn't a a simple driver fix for the issues?
To be fair, there's always driver improvements no matter which side you're on.
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kram36
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/10 17:42:51
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GTXJackBauer
kram36
ssj92 I don't understand though, if AMD knew about the issues, why didn't they push back the release date? They really shot themselves in the foot here.
What if there isn't a a simple driver fix for the issues?
To be fair, there's always driver improvements no matter which side you're on.
Improvements, sure, but when was the last time you saw a card get released for review with this many issues?
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seth89
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/10 17:48:20
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kram36
GTXJackBauer
kram36
ssj92 I don't understand though, if AMD knew about the issues, why didn't they push back the release date? They really shot themselves in the foot here.
What if there isn't a a simple driver fix for the issues?
To be fair, there's always driver improvements no matter which side you're on.
Improvements, sure, but when was the last time you saw a card get released for review with this many issues?
It’s Chinese New Year and they said a lot of people are off for holiday, that the issues would be addressed when they come back to work...
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atfrico
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Re: AMD Radeon VII vs. Nvidia RTX 2080
2019/02/10 19:34:32
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This bickering between the new Radeon VII vs the short life expectancy RTX 2080 is so funny. FYI, the Radeon VII is the substitute of the GTX 1080Ti series since Nvidia cut the production for the 1080Ti. And the reason for AMD to release this GPU with no RT or DSS is due to the fact that many consumers are not happy with how hot the RTX 2080 runs, specially its dependability over time. Heck, people who are RMAing their 1080Ti GPUs are not happy they are getting the RTX 2080 at all. They rather get the same 1080Ti GPU due to the memory size and not to the RT feature in the RTX cards...and btw this is a fact, go to the RMA section of this forum not just 1 person but 2 are posting they are unhappy about that. If anyone of you find a person who wants to trade their Radeon VII for a GTX 1080Ti send her/him my way, i would not mind trading my SC2 Hybrid for the Radeon .
T hose who abuse power, are nothing but scumbags! The challenge of power is how to use it and not abuse it. The abuse of power that seems to create the most unhappiness is when a person uses personal power to get ahead without regards to the welfare of others, people are obsessed with it. You can take a nice person and turn them into a slob, into an insane being, craving power, destroying anything that stands in their way. Affiliate Code: 3T15O1S07G
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