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1660ti custom water cooled power consumption

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12ianma
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2021/05/10 21:14:20 (permalink)
I recently have been messing around with lower model graphics cards as I cannot buy any of the higher end models I’d like. Recently I put an AIO on my 1660ti, soldered lower resistance to the power sense shunts, and was able to clock high enough to score the port royal 1660ti record. I was wondering if anyone has experience in custom bios etc to make this card actually utilize more power as while it sense lower consumption it still draws exactly the same.
post edited by 12ianma - 2021/05/10 21:17:23

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    ty_ger07
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    Re: 1660ti custom water cooled power consumption 2021/05/11 07:12:58 (permalink)
    If it isn't power limited and doesn't need more power, you can't just tell it to use more power. To make it use more power, increase utilization (if bottlenecked below 99% utilization [unlikely in this case], increase CPU performance), increase the core frequency, or increase the core voltage.

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    12ianma
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    Re: 1660ti custom water cooled power consumption 2021/05/11 10:10:05 (permalink)
    There seems to be some limiter on what it’s willing to draw. Changing frequency or voltage will not allow it to draw more. I would love to give it more voltage than the software allows currently which is why I asked about bios. It may just be a hard limit there. Because if you cannot draw more than max voltage it won’t ever draw more current as it’s virtually the same load.
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    ty_ger07
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    Re: 1660ti custom water cooled power consumption 2021/05/11 10:54:49 (permalink)
    What is the "perfcap reason" in GPU-z sensor tab while the video card is under load?

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    12ianma
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    Re: 1660ti custom water cooled power consumption 2021/05/11 12:32:33 (permalink)
    That’s something I can look into. I apologize for being so new to the whole thing. What should I look for and expect when investigating the specified reason? I won’t be back at my computer for a couple days. Also I have a 2060 with exact same modifications in now, and having same thing happen so I could try on either. I have the 2060 in port royal top 10 for 2060 but would love to try and best it
    post edited by 12ianma - 2021/05/11 12:34:23

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    ty_ger07
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    Re: 1660ti custom water cooled power consumption 2021/05/11 12:36:05 (permalink)
    12ianma
    What should I look for and expect when investigating the specified reason?



    You look at the reason, and they you tell us.  There's nothing more to it.  What should you expect?  It's impossible to say.  That's why I asked.  I expect that it won't say PWR, because I don't think that you are power limited.  But you could prove me wrong.
     
    Once you know the reason it displays, you can make adjustments to try to minimize that being the reason it isn't boosting higher.  Until you know why it isn't boosting higher, you can only guess.  Guessing is an inefficient way to overcome an obstacle.
    post edited by ty_ger07 - 2021/05/11 12:37:09

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    12ianma
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    Re: 1660ti custom water cooled power consumption 2021/05/11 12:45:07 (permalink)
    Hey boss I more meant what codes pop up. you seem offended I would ask. It will boost to whatever I specifically put for clock etc. it never thermal throttles. Stays at whatever max specified is for duration of load. If clock is too high it will lock up as expected. I’m wondering how to gain headroom somewhere. I think it’s voltage which in turn is also more power.
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    ty_ger07
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    Re: 1660ti custom water cooled power consumption 2021/05/11 12:50:41 (permalink)
    12ianma
    Hey boss I more meant what codes pop up.

    I'm not offended.  Just annoyed.  You want to argue about whether the card is being power limited, but provide no evidence that it is being power limited.  If you want to know all the possible perfcap reasons, you can get the answer in seconds just by using Google.
     
    PerfCap Reasons [GPU-z] | Overclock.net
     
    It really doesn't matter what possible reasons could be displayed.  It more matters what reason is displayed.
     
    It sounds to me that the card is not power limited.  If you want to overclock it higher, I would recommend getting it colder.
    post edited by ty_ger07 - 2021/05/11 12:57:01

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    12ianma
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    Re: 1660ti custom water cooled power consumption 2021/05/11 13:12:46 (permalink)
    Correct me if I’m wrong but I thought the 2 ways to stabilize higher clocks are with temperature or voltage best being both if possible?

    Cost of higher voltage being more temp more risk of instability and also throttling?

    I’m not arguing it’s power. I’m saying I’d like more headroom on voltage for more power to stabilize clock as I can’t reasonably get it any colder with an AIO (or anything else I have on hand). I do however have cooling sink headroom as I am not currently over powering my AIO

    I figured you had a suspicion and that’s why you were asking.
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    ty_ger07
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    Re: 1660ti custom water cooled power consumption 2021/05/11 13:27:28 (permalink)
    I have a suspicion that you are not power limited, and that you are up against silicon lottery at this point, until you get it colder.  Adding voltage might help, but usually doesn't help until you first get it colder.  Some examples of getting it colder are placing the AIO radiator directly in front of an AC outlet.  Or, placing the AIO radiator in a bucket of ice water.  Either method would require insulating/sealing the card against condensation damage.

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    Nisco3000
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    Re: 1660ti custom water cooled power consumption 2021/05/12 01:48:06 (permalink)
    12ianma
    That’s something I can look into. I apologize for being so new to the whole thing. What should I look for and expect when investigating the specified reason? I won’t be back at my computer for a couple days. Also I have a 2060 with exact same modifications in now, and having same thing happen so I could try on either. I have the 2060 in port royal top 10 for 2060 but would love to try and best it


    I like those Dual Turbo fans :D
    Are they audible at all?
    I have some plans to MOD my new GPU with backplate fans.
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    ty_ger07
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    Re: 1660ti custom water cooled power consumption 2021/05/12 10:38:48 (permalink)
    Nisco3000
    Are they audible at all?



    Look at the size of their hubs versus the length of their blades.  They are obviously designed to spin fast.  They must be quite loud.

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    wmmills
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    Re: 1660ti custom water cooled power consumption 2021/05/12 12:23:13 (permalink)
    ty_ger07
    Nisco3000
    Are they audible at all?



    Look at the size of their hubs versus the length of their blades.  They are obviously designed to spin fast.  They must be quite loud.


    +1.... Agreed!  ALL little fans like that are loud, theres no way around it and keep them effective. Until you get to 140mm fans its a wrestling match between effective cooling and Db's.

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    12ianma
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    Re: 1660ti custom water cooled power consumption 2021/05/13 20:27:20 (permalink)
    Ok during a bench the 2 reasons I get from gpu-z are power and voltage reliability. Both being quite constant. I guess it is not putting out it’s maximum hardware voltage based on codes given. Any ideas?also back to my original question, does anyone do custom bios?
    post edited by 12ianma - 2021/05/13 20:53:15
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    ty_ger07
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    Re: 1660ti custom water cooled power consumption 2021/05/13 22:27:43 (permalink)
    Voltage reliability just means that you need to give it more core voltage.  But the power limit is going to be a problem; because more core voltage is just going to give more of a power limit.
     
    That's not right.  You shouldn't be getting a power limit if you modified it correctly.
     
    Tell us about your power mod.  Do you have any pictures of the mod?  Can you show us a screenshot of GPU-Z?
     
    I would suspect that you either power-modded it wrong, or you only power-modded the external power plug and not the PCI-slot power (or vice-versa) and the non-power-modded input is power limiting you.  A GPU-Z screenshot would help clear that up.
     
    For comparison, here is my power-modded GTX 1080:

     

    ... while it sense lower consumption it still draws exactly the same.

    Please explain.  If it is sensing lower power consumption, how do you know that it is drawing exactly the same amount of power?  How are you monitoring power usage?  What hardware measurement are you using, and at what location?
    post edited by ty_ger07 - 2021/05/14 04:30:34

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    12ianma
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    Re: 1660ti custom water cooled power consumption 2021/05/14 07:00:36 (permalink)
    I cannot give it more core voltage, which is also odd I don’t pop the code for being at voltage limit. I modded the card’s power shunts correctly including the PCI slot one, as I was worried for the exact reason you posted.

    I know it’s still drawing exactly the same total power despite it reading lower, as I have a milliohm meter and know it’s new total resistance at each shunt, and when the math is done the power consumed is exactly the same as before.

    For example the new resistance total on my 2060 is ≈ 2.92 instead of 5.

    5/2.92 is ≈1.712x what reading is. Max reading ever is 68-70% power usage, which 70x1.712 = 120% power which is the setting cap on the card lol. Also worth noting if I set power target on card lower, it will indeed drop to that. Like 100%, it will drop to reading lower than 70% and limit to its previous exact same actual consumption as 100% would be.

    I know the mod is done correctly as it reads exactly as much lower as it should. I also know the solder is good because it’s been checked with my milliohm meter.


    Basically despite sensors all reading wattage consumption as lower than actual, it still draws up to the exact same wattage it was allowed to. I don’t understand lol. If the sensors are not what determines the cards logic, then what does? It could also calculate based on voltages somewhere else as a shunt or power sense is just reading a voltage differential. However I would be surprised they would even implement a sense system if it also used something else as the final check.
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    ty_ger07
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    Re: 1660ti custom water cooled power consumption 2021/05/14 07:57:07 (permalink)
    If it uses smart power stages (I don't know if it does), it could measure the power through the power stages even after shunt modding. You might have to mod by the chip which collects the data, instead of modifying the shunts.

    which is also odd I don’t pop the code for being at voltage limit.

    Yes you are. That is what vrel is. Vrel means that it could boost higher, but it isn't because the core voltage isn't enough to allow it. Basically, it is using a lookup table to determine that it wouldn't be stable at a higher boost clock at the present core voltage. That's what vrel means.

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    12ianma
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    Re: 1660ti custom water cooled power consumption 2021/05/14 08:23:44 (permalink)
    I’m talking about not being at VOp. That’s why I want a bios that allows a higher voltage setting.

    No one cares about these cards enough to have already made a bios, and I don’t personally know enough about the rest of the board to alter it further.

    So I’m hard limited at current results without a bios or further voltage modification, which is what I started this thread for
    post edited by 12ianma - 2021/05/14 08:28:05
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    12ianma
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    Re: 1660ti custom water cooled power consumption 2021/05/14 08:32:45 (permalink)
    You told me before I had no indication it was power limited, I gave that in the initial post, you assumed I was too ignorant to be correct about it. This isn’t something I have spent zero time on and I understand it fairly well. Would be nice if you could change your tone a bit with me.

    I do appreciate the perfcap tip off I didn’t know that was a thing. it’s confirms what I roughly thought.

    Question stands, does anyone know how to work a bios? I know the skill exists lol
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    ty_ger07
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    Re: 1660ti custom water cooled power consumption 2021/05/14 10:15:44 (permalink)
    Can you provide a GPU-Z sensor tab screenshot? It would be interesting to see the readings.

    I am sorry about not believing you. I simply don't trust anything at face value. I believe you now, but I would still find the GPU-Z screenshot interesting.

    I have volt-modded a lot of cards. Most didn't require a guide and were pretty easy to figure out. I even modded 2 laptops. The theory is simple for analog VRM with a FB signal. For smart digital VRM, it is more complicated and I have never had a chance to mod one.
    post edited by ty_ger07 - 2021/05/14 10:17:12

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    12ianma
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    Re: 1660ti custom water cooled power consumption 2021/05/14 11:35:26 (permalink)
    sure here is a very safe settings run for port royal. just to show gpu clock stays virtually constant. you can see i get right around 70% usage:
    post edited by 12ianma - 2021/05/14 11:41:22

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    ty_ger07
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    Re: 1660ti custom water cooled power consumption 2021/05/14 12:16:57 (permalink)
    Interesting. It is mostly limited by Vrel, so increasing the core voltage is a logical pursuit.

    Without the card in hand, I guess I can't be too helpful. I can only give general guidance. I am sorry that I haven't been helpful.

    If you are able to determine that they are smart power stages based on part number, you may find information about how to modify those power stages for voltage and power limit. It wouldn't necessarily even need to be related to the same video card.

    On the other hand, if you are able to determine that they are just dumb analog MOSFETs, volt modding them should be really simple. But that wouldn't explain how the card is able to figure out its power draw. If they are dumb MOSFETs, you should find this thread helpful:
    https://forums.evga.com/V...Volt-Mods-m572578.aspx
    Post #22 especially...
    post edited by ty_ger07 - 2021/05/14 12:21:44

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