Upgraded to 980X and SSDs - Weird Stuttering/Freezing

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jasonanderson
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Re:Upgraded to 980X and SSDs - Weird Stuttering and Keyboard Issues 2011/02/20 04:05:46 (permalink)
Ok, EVGA Support asked me to wipe the drives and install them in RAID 0 using the JMicron ports.  I have done that and so far no freezing, but the performance is awful (see AS SSD bench below).  I used the latest JMicron drivers.  Is JMicron just that inferior?  Heck, my RAID 0 HDDs outperformed this.
 

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CPU: i7 5930K, 4.5 (125x36) with Corsair H100i | MB: Asus Rampage V Extreme (1401 Bios) | GPU: 2x EVGA GTX 980 SC ACX 2.0 | RAM: Corsair Vengeance 32 GB DDR4 2666MHz (4x8GB) | Storage:  Crucial MX100 512 GB SSD (OS & Apps), 2 Seagate 1TB Serial ATA HD 7200/32MB/SATA-3G (Data - RAID 1) | PSU: Corsair HX1000W | Chassis: Cooler Master HAF X | OS: Win 8.1 Pro x64

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maniacvvv
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Re:Upgraded to 980X and SSDs - Weird Stuttering and Keyboard Issues 2011/02/20 06:52:11 (permalink)
wow
 
Ok, uninstall the drivers for the keyboard (Logitech drivers are known issue makers) and let windows just use the default driver. Be sure to change Windows settings to NOT install drivers automaticly.
Lets take the keyboard out of this nitemare for the time being...
 
Now, your SSD's
Look at your test results bro! your SSD's are showing the "Classic" overwrite symtoms for drives that have been run in RAID without trim.... and all of your OS installs and removing them from RAID... but FAILING to restore them each time.
 
SSD's are NOT hard drives and cannot be treated as such. The are NAND flash modules with a controller to "fakeout" the OS into beliveing they are a hard drive... they are NOT.
 
You need to go to the Crucial website and either get the tool (if they have one) or learn how to "Sanitary Erase" your SSD's yourself.
 
You also need to learn how to "setup" your SSD's to work with windows7, to reduce unneeded drive calls, bandwith use and to extend the time between need to "restore" the SSD's with a Sanitary Erase.
 




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maniacvvv
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Re:Upgraded to 980X and SSDs - Weird Stuttering and Keyboard Issues 2011/02/20 07:02:30 (permalink)
AFTER you have gone to the Cruical website and learned how to properly CLEAN ERASE each of your SSD's to restore them to "Factory New" condition...
--->and HAVE DONE SO FOR EACH OF YOUR DRIVES...
 
Go here--->  the link for PROPERLY setting up SSD's to work with Windows 7
http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=82516
 
You will then get the performance you paid for without the studdering
 
 
EDIT: the Cruical website suggests HDD ERASE be used for restoring c300 SSD's to factory performance
Here is that link   
http://cmrr.ucsd.edu/people/Hughes/SecureErase.shtml
read the notes on how to use it properly, then use it to restore your SSD's prior to a new Win7 install
Do not use the JMicron ports, use only the Intel ports. 
  
 
-->You -must- restore your drives and re-install Windows7
-->and follow (ALL) the Win7 setup guides in the corsair link I gave you (do not skip/change any of them).
 
 
 
post edited by maniacvvv - 2011/02/20 07:27:25




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EleSSaRBLS
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Re:Upgraded to 980X and SSDs - Weird Stuttering and Keyboard Issues 2011/02/20 07:04:18 (permalink)
Sounds crazy, but I had the same exact issue with my wifes computer, unplug the cd/dvd rom whatever you have and see if it helps any.....Just humor me cause I chased this same bug around for a week and started pulling stuff out and when I pulled the dvd rom out the hd light went off and the keyboard started working properly. It ended up being a bad dvd rom and for whatever reason I guess cause it was hooked up sata and on the same controller as the hardrives it was affecting it somehow.

 
 
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jasonanderson
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Re:Upgraded to 980X and SSDs - Weird Stuttering and Keyboard Issues 2011/02/20 07:04:28 (permalink)
maniacvvv

wow

Ok, uninstall the drivers for the keyboard (Logitech drivers are known issue makers) and let windows just use the default driver. Be sure to change Windows settings to NOT install drivers automaticly.
Lets take the keyboard out of this nitemare for the time being...

Now, your SSD's
Look at your test results bro! your SSD's are showing the "Classic" overwrite symtoms for drives that have been run in RAID without trim.... and all of your OS installs and removing them from RAID... but FAILING to restore them each time.

SSD's are NOT hard drives and cannot be treated as such. The are NAND flash modules with a controller to "fakeout" the OS into beliveing they are a hard drive... they are NOT.

You need to go to the Crucial website and either get the tool (if they have one) or learn how to "Sanitary Erase" your SSD's yourself.

You also need to learn how to "setup" your SSD's to work with windows7, to reduce unneeded drive calls, bandwith use and to extend the time between need to "restore" the SSD's with a Sanitary Erase.



Thanks for you suggestions.
 
I have resolved the keyboard issue fortunately a while back.  It was a loose connection.  Keyboard issue has not re-ocurred since then.  I will see if I can update the thread subject (never tried it before).
 
I believe these recent poor readings have something to do with the JMircon drivers.  Prior setups with them in and out of RAID on the Intel RAID ROM gave me sequential reads in the 250 range non RAID and 450+ in RAID 0.  I think the 4K writes are so bad because I cannot find a way in the JMicron drivers to enable write-back cache.
 
Since the freezing issue happened on the first install and also have a clean all RAID 0 install I don't think it is due to overwrite.  I do recognize all these clean all's are adding wear to the drive, but not sure how else to test and isolate the issue.  I really think it is a MB issue at this point.  EVGA Support seems to be leaning that way as well.
 
For the last 4 or 5 tests I have done a wipe between each itteration using diskpart's clean all.  Crucial does not make a wipe utility that I can find anywhere.

 
 
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jasonanderson
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Re:Upgraded to 980X and SSDs - Weird Stuttering and Keyboard Issues 2011/02/20 07:34:03 (permalink)
maniacvvv

AFTER you have gone to the Cruical website and learned how to properly CLEAN ERASE each of your SSD's to restore them to "Factory New" condition...
--->and HAVE DONE SO FOR EACH OF YOUR DRIVES...

Go here--->  the link for PROPERLY setting up SSD's to work with Windows 7
http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=82516

You will then get the performance you paid for without the studdering


EDIT: the Cruical website suggests HDD ERASE be used for restoring c300 SSD's to factory performance
Here is that link   
http://cmrr.ucsd.edu/people/Hughes/SecureErase.shtml
read the notes on how to use it properly, then use it to restore your SSD's prior to a new Win7 install
Do not use the JMicron ports, use only the Intel ports. 
 

-->You -must- restore your drives and re-install Windows7
-->and follow (ALL) the Win7 setup guides in the corsair link I gave you (do not skip/change any of them).




 
Thanks for the additional information.  I did not see that Secure Erase info before.  I will try that rather than diskpart clean all.  EVGA Tech support were the ones that asked me to try to JMicron ports since the stuttering/freezes only occur when I am running RAID 0 on the Intel ports.  I will use this information to ensure better cleaning, but I don't think it is the root of my problem unfortunately.  The problem started with a fresh install.  And, I had done most of the temps in that guide you posted.  But, I do like some of the other suggestions (such as moving temp folders).  But, again, my problems started on the first day of a clean install on a clean SSD so i don't think that is my issue.
 
I am currently debating two options:
 
1) Just using the SSDs out of RAID and have the OS on one and games on the other.
2) Going out and buying a Rampage III Extreme board since I have been wanting to upgrade and EVGA Classified3's are MIA at the moment.

 
 
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#36
maniacvvv
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Re:Upgraded to 980X and SSDs - Weird Stuttering and Keyboard Issues 2011/02/20 07:47:33 (permalink)
+1 on your choices
 
Sorry to have gone all caps and bold on you..
I agree that C300's in RAID is problematic on a 758 MB (and I dont run that config) as per reports.
Really sorry your having problems, you have some killer hardware there.
 
Good Luck




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jasonanderson
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Re:Upgraded to 980X and SSDs - Weird Stuttering and Keyboard Issues 2011/02/20 07:56:26 (permalink)
maniacvvv

+1 on your choices

Sorry to have gone all caps and bold on you..
I agree that C300's in RAID is problematic on a 758 MB (and I dont run that config) as per reports.
Really sorry your having problems, you have some killer hardware there.

Good Luck


No problem.
 
I do appreciate the info.  Downloading a bootable CD from www.ultimatebootcd.com right now.  I found it searching on the erase program.  It has a ton of ultilities on it.  A cool find.
 
I like most of the advice on that corsair forum posting, but totally disagree with the advice to disable the defrag service.  That is pointless with Win 7 in my opinion.  Win 7 knows to not defrag SSDs but you still want it running to defrag your data HDDs.  The prefetch stuff seems to sort it self out over time from what I have read in OCZ forums.  It is interesting that I don't think it suggested any indexing changes.  I guess there are many opinions.
 
I think for now I am going to go with my option #1 and run the C300s out of RAID.  That will give me TRIM support and will still be much faster than my old HDDs.  I really hate to abandon EVGA as they have great support (never dealt with ASUS), but that Rampage III extreme is temping.  Maybe the Classified3 will get back on the market soon.  This option also lets me get moving on to the project I really want to do which is to OC my new 980X.

 
 
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#38
jasonanderson
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Re:Upgraded to 980X and SSDs - Weird Stuttering and Keyboard Issues 2011/02/20 11:23:30 (permalink)
Ok, went with my option #1 for now.
 
Used the HDD Erase tool.  That works much faster than diskpart's clean all.
 
Installed the OS onto one of the C300s and will put games on the other.  Did all the steps in the corsair forum except for disabling defrag (confirmed Windows will not run it on the SSDs) and disabling prefetch.
 
Here my my AS SSD benchmark now:
 

Uploaded with ImageShack.us
 
I think that is much more in-line with what I should get.
 
Now I will just keep my fingers crossed that this continues to work.

 
 
CPU: i7 5930K, 4.5 (125x36) with Corsair H100i | MB: Asus Rampage V Extreme (1401 Bios) | GPU: 2x EVGA GTX 980 SC ACX 2.0 | RAM: Corsair Vengeance 32 GB DDR4 2666MHz (4x8GB) | Storage:  Crucial MX100 512 GB SSD (OS & Apps), 2 Seagate 1TB Serial ATA HD 7200/32MB/SATA-3G (Data - RAID 1) | PSU: Corsair HX1000W | Chassis: Cooler Master HAF X | OS: Win 8.1 Pro x64

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