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XCOM 2 (update vids)

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El-Dubya
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2015/08/08 07:41:16 (permalink)
This hasn't been updated for awhile here, and the original thread seems to have dropped off the face of the forum. This vid seems to explain quite a bit more with the new sequel coming soon for those interested.
 

post edited by El-Dubya - 2015/08/20 08:11:01
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    El-Dubya
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    Re: XCOM 2 (update vid) 2015/08/20 08:10:14 (permalink)
    Starting to look better and better...
     

     
    #2
    aka_STEVE_b
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    Re: XCOM 2 (update vid) 2015/08/20 08:22:30 (permalink)
    good stuff , I keep getting my butt kicked in the first one after like 10 missions in.....
     
    Oh, the horror of losing my entire team of highly trained specialists..

    AMD RYZEN 9 5900X  12-core cpu~ ASUS ROG Crosshair VIII Dark Hero ~ EVGA RTX 3080 Ti FTW3~ G.SKILL Trident Z NEO 32GB DDR4-3600 ~ Phanteks Eclipse P400s red case ~ EVGA SuperNOVA 1000 G+ PSU ~ Intel 660p M.2 drive~ Crucial MX300 275 GB SSD ~WD 2TB SSD ~CORSAIR H115i RGB Pro XT 280mm cooler ~ CORSAIR Dark Core RGB Pro mouse ~ CORSAIR K68 Mech keyboard ~ HGST 4TB Hd.~ AOC AGON 32" monitor 1440p @ 144Hz ~ Win 10 x64
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    El-Dubya
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    Re: XCOM 2 (update vid) 2015/08/20 08:31:26 (permalink)
    ^This is probably the only game in a loooong time where I've felt like throwing the keyboard at the screen and yet I keep begging for more haha. Not to mention XCOM:EU was the first turn-based strategy game I've ever played. I just love how I can take my time calculating my every move, even if 95% of the time it ends in my defeat.   
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    Brad_Hawthorne
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    Re: XCOM 2 (update vid) 2015/08/22 20:38:10 (permalink)
    Looks like the ship plays as though it's the ipad game Fallout Shelter with graphic enhancements and plotline.
    post edited by Brad_Hawthorne - 2015/08/22 20:48:13
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    TECH_DaveB
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    Re: XCOM 2 (update vid) 2015/08/25 13:53:27 (permalink)
    I saw a long interview with the devs on XCOM2 recently.  I have still not lost a game of XCOM, but apparently I have a VERY different approach to  my game play as others as I found out form a convo with EVGATech_DarrellM, who is also a big fan.  The interesting thing I found form the interview was that he said when Enemy Unknown came out there was a ton of feedback and over half the people who played it failed their first game (even on easy), so they are approaching XCOM2  with that in mind, that the XCOM initiative failed in defending against the invasion, so this is now guerrilla warfare.  So I am very curious to see how the tech and the overall feel of the war goes form there, and it should really have this vibe of desperation, which from a couple of the clips and interviews I have seen it is doing that.
     
    @OP,
    if this is your first Tactical turn based strategy game, you should know this was a reboot, you can get the old DOS and Win 9x games through www.gog.com which were great if you don't have a problem with dated (REALLY dated on the oldest of them) graphics, but the strategic elements were brilliant, and BRUTALLY hard.  Also the UFO series was pretty good if you like these types of games.
     
    For anyone interested, I am playing the Long War mod for the original with the xpac, it REALLY bumps the challenge level up, and gives many more missions and a lot more different tech and class options as well.  I am enjoying having more classes to pick from and a just more in depth granular game play this time through.  Heavy's still can't hit crap unfortunately.
     
    @OP or Steve, if you have questions for the original, I'd be glad to offer advice if you are stuck on a mission type.  I will also send this to Darrell, I know he will likely jump in on this too, and can offer suggestions form a VERY different gameplay style than me.  Sign of a great game, he and I play as polar opposites stylistically, and we are both equally successful as the strategy and tactics for both are sound.
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    El-Dubya
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    Re: XCOM 2 (update vid) 2015/08/26 20:44:46 (permalink)
    Hey, thanks EVGATech_DaveB for the info and offer. To be straightforward, as much as I have lost when I first started playing; after putting in over 700+ hours on EU and EW and making it through Classic Ironman a couple times (forget long war or impossible !) that's about all the punishment I'm willing to take lol. I'm by no means a competitive player (in any game really), and I have that much time in XCOM mostly because I play very relaxed on the couch and take my sweet time.
     
    Even though I did know these were reboots, I've yet to check out the originals, so thanks for that. If you record your gameplay at all, I would mind taking a look. All-in-all, I just hope this sequel (which comes out the same month as Fallout 4, yikes!) entertains just as much or even more so than EU/EW.      
     
         
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    TECH_DaveB
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    Re: XCOM 2 (update vid) 2015/08/27 10:13:39 (permalink)
    El-Dubya
    Hey, thanks EVGATech_DaveB for the info and offer. To be straightforward, as much as I have lost when I first started playing; after putting in over 700+ hours on EU and EW and making it through Classic Ironman a couple times (forget long war or impossible !) that's about all the punishment I'm willing to take lol. I'm by no means a competitive player (in any game really), and I have that much time in XCOM mostly because I play very relaxed on the couch and take my sweet time.
     
    Even though I did know these were reboots, I've yet to check out the originals, so thanks for that. If you record your gameplay at all, I would mind taking a look. All-in-all, I just hope this sequel (which comes out the same month as Fallout 4, yikes!) entertains just as much or even more so than EU/EW.      
     
         


    WOW you got a lot of hours in XCOM!  I wasn't aware you got past the slump early on of keyboard tossing and losing, you apparently don't need any help form me  :)  aka_STEVE_b if you ever have questions if you never got through it all the way, I'm always happy to help. 
    I take a slow pace too, I think and plot out all my moves, almost never dash unless there is a good reason, wait until all my cooldowns are up before breaching a door that has me a bit worried.  So yeah, I take my time too, and that game is a massive time sink, I mean that in the best possible way, kinda like GalCiv2/3, Cybermancy or Absolute Corruption mod for SW:EaT, they chew up a LOT of time and a patient play style makes it that much longer.
     
    I think you described well something many modern games are missing these days: 
    El-Dubya
    ^This is probably the only game in a loooong time where I've felt like throwing the keyboard at the screen and yet I keep begging for more haha.......

    The challenge that makes the reward of winning so much better.  I don't care about 90% of the Steam achievements (granted some are pretty funny) but overall, they are useless fluff to me with a few exceptions, but a game like this, where when you are good at it if you make a bad decision you can lose and getting through an entire game without "corpse-dragging"  feels awesome, because it was HARD.  There is no reward for beating an easy game, sure games like the original Sacred were fun because they were well written and the characters/story was fun, but the game was so painfully simple that when I won there was no sigh of relief that I beat something hard.  I know a lot of youth these days will not stick with a game that kicks their posterior hard enough their grand kids will have a limp, but I started in the 80's and played heavily into the 90's, and those were UNFORGIVING games, and I missed the challenge.  Granted original XCOM was frankly WAY harder!  I hope with the next one that we have a couple changes, I would really love to see camera controls like say Warhammer 40k DOW, and for controls, I would prefer the way the DOS XCOMs did it where there are movement points, like firing your rifle is 5 points, 1 movement square is 1 point, throwing a grenade was 8 points, you have 15 action points so run 3 squares, toss a grenade and run 4 squares into full cover, it allowed more freedom, but I suppose the approach from the reboot was more about committing to an action.
     
    As for game recordings, I haven't recorded any gaming in YEARS, I think 2007 or 2008 was the last time I recorded anything.  Yeah, XC2 and FO4 coming at the same time those are tough decisions right there!
    #8
    El-Dubya
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    Re: XCOM 2 (update vid) 2015/08/28 12:43:56 (permalink)
    Update: XCOM 2 delayed until Feb. 2016 (source)
    Well, guess the decision between playing FO4 or XCOM 2 in Nov. just got a lot easier.
     
    There was also a video interview in the source link (not sure if it's the same that EVGATech_DaveB was talking about, but was dated Aug. 14th):
     

     
     
     
     
     
     
     
     
     
     
    #9
    blacksapphire08
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    Re: XCOM 2 (update vid) 2015/09/01 06:58:13 (permalink)
    Yeah im guessing this one wont sell nearly as well as the first. I just started the first one and its nothing but cheating AI. The key to a good RTS is difficult but fair which is why Starcraft is so successful. Someone at Fireaxis hasnt got a clue.

     
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    El-Dubya
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    Re: XCOM 2 (update vid) 2015/09/01 08:58:50 (permalink)
    blacksapphire08
    Yeah im guessing this one wont sell nearly as well as the first. I just started the first one and its nothing but cheating AI. The key to a good RTS is difficult but fair which is why Starcraft is so successful. Someone at Fireaxis hasnt got a clue.



    Lol I think everyone and their grandma has made this comment while playing the game. While I can agree with perhaps making things seem more fair (as in 90% shots that actually hit most of the time), apparently EU/EW does use a proven random/seed generator that has been discussed in length since the game came out.
     
    Personally, I've never played beyond Classic difficulty, but there are strategies that you'll catch on to that will make play throughs a lot more predictable (hint: use full cover/hunker down like crazy in the beginning.)
     
    As far as sells, well....as much as I love the game, pitting it up against Fallout 4's release was not a smart move to begin with. I really think it'll sell just as well or better just on the current fan base alone. 
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    blacksapphire08
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    Re: XCOM 2 (update vid) 2015/09/01 09:48:41 (permalink)
    Hey I like the game but the randomness takes away a lot of the fun. I feel like it's 70% luck and 30% strategy. I've messed with the difficulty and it doesnt seem to make any difference on how hard it is.

     
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    El-Dubya
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    Re: XCOM 2 (update vid) 2015/09/01 10:32:25 (permalink)
    Most would agree with you on that, no doubt. For me, the randomness did add frustration but also whole new level of strategy. It forces you to look beyond an individual move, expect a possible failed shot, and therefore have 2,3,4 back-up plans in case () really hits the fan (of course early on, those back-up plans would probably just feel like "lucky" shots as well).     
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    TECH_DaveB
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    Re: XCOM 2 (update vid) 2015/09/01 14:38:40 (permalink)
    blacksapphire08
    Yeah im guessing this one wont sell nearly as well as the first. I just started the first one and its nothing but cheating AI. The key to a good RTS is difficult but fair which is why Starcraft is so successful. Someone at Fireaxis hasnt got a clue.



    Not arguing for or against, but I am curious as the the specifics of your claim.
    I enjoy the game, but there are some frustrations, a Heavy can't hit anything, ever, for any reason, EVER, regardless of accuracy.  Or being shot through heavy cover when they guy that hits you has no LOS.  In general I rather enjoy it, but it is not perfect.
    What specifically did you witness that drove you off?  I have been annihilated by the RNG before, but I assume it is more than that.
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    blacksapphire08
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    Re: XCOM 2 (update vid) 2015/09/02 06:30:33 (permalink)
    EVGATech_DaveB
    blacksapphire08
    Yeah im guessing this one wont sell nearly as well as the first. I just started the first one and its nothing but cheating AI. The key to a good RTS is difficult but fair which is why Starcraft is so successful. Someone at Fireaxis hasnt got a clue.



    Not arguing for or against, but I am curious as the the specifics of your claim.
    I enjoy the game, but there are some frustrations, a Heavy can't hit anything, ever, for any reason, EVER, regardless of accuracy.  Or being shot through heavy cover when they guy that hits you has no LOS.  In general I rather enjoy it, but it is not perfect.
    What specifically did you witness that drove you off?  I have been annihilated by the RNG before, but I assume it is more than that.

    A lot of the reasons you already listed. Im not one to give up easily. I had all the available upgrades for my soldiers (armor/laser weapons/etc) and replayed the same level for 4 hours and kept dying over and over again. That was on normal difficulty and the switched to easy. It made no difference. In fact I noticed that the outcomes of each move were the same if you repeated them.

    Example: I would put 3 high rank soldiers in heavy cover in a flanking position. Another would be in heavy cover on overwatch. The aliens made the same moves, my overwatch guy fired and missed everytime. 3 spider things came at me, hit them with a rocket an the other 2 would kill them off (sometimes, 50% of the time they missed which is BS when its 80+% to hit). In the end they always killed at least one of my guys.

    The game started off fun but throw in spider things and aliens with hoverpacks that can jump to any part of the map really turned me off. I still want to play it but feel like it would be more wasted time playing the same scenario over and over.

     
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    TECH_DaveB
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    Re: XCOM 2 (update vid) 2015/09/02 11:43:44 (permalink)
    There are a couple meat grinder missions in the game, I am playing Long War mod right now and good lord it increases the difficulty, but yeah Temple Ship can be a meat grinder, as can the first battle ship mission, the train/timebomb if you have had a cash flow problem, and a couple others.  But I have never had a mission hit me THAT bad, but then again according to the guys on XCOM forums I use "crutches" Titan armor, chitin plating, the neck thingy that adds hp and prevents strangulation.  Frankly the best thing for my survival in game I ever did was just stop using Heavies, once I did that, I stopped a lot of problems.  The guys either jumping across the map or spawning directly behind you in a place you already secured I thought was BS. 
    Spider things, you mean the ones that basically facerape civilians and turn them into Zombies in terror missions?  Those are tough, once you get Plasma weapons they become much less of an issue. 
    There are things that I just adapted to because I felt they never worked right.  Until most of my team is 85% I don't bother with overwatch, as they always miss, I use Hunker Down and I really reduce incoming damage like that.  The Cyberdisks can be a major pain, as can those AT-ST's (they aren't that big, but that's what they made me think of) late game are terrible as well.  The all metal ones can be a real pain. 
    I think they need to remove the over the top mobility or give it something to balance, sure make a bug that moves like the Fiend from the original quake but it needs to be squishy with very little mitigation.  Make flyers with crazy range, but make them unable to get cover or LOS defensive bonus's, especially with the huge amount of HP they have.  Just don't spawn things directly behind me after I cleared the area.  The RNG needs some work, but you are right, there are definite flaws but I enjoy it, and am looking forward to the sequel.
     
    Just wish they would go back to the movement system form the DOS game.
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    DarrelM
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    Re: XCOM 2 (update vid) 2015/09/02 13:06:59 (permalink)
    blacksapphire08
    Hey I like the game but the randomness takes away a lot of the fun. I feel like it's 70% luck and 30% strategy. I've messed with the difficulty and it doesnt seem to make any difference on how hard it is.




    Luck can affect your game as little or as much as you let it. In an ideal situation, I will take whatever shots I can to kill as many enemies I have in sight, then disable or suppress all remaining enemies to reduce the chance of being hit.
     
    I forget the exact numbers, since I've been playing the long war mod as well, but in the vanilla EW/EU, you would still have a 20-40% chance to hit someone, in cover from a medium distance. I imagine it's the same for when they shoot back, so I if I have to, I'll provide cover smoke for troops that are being shot at, even if they're in cover.
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    TECH_DaveB
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    Re: XCOM 2 (update vid) 2015/09/02 13:27:18 (permalink)
    And Darrel made a solid point, also shows one reason I really like it.  He and I could not play more differently, and we both still make it work.  I usually run 1 support decked out as a medic and either 3 assaults and 2 snipers, or 3 snipers and 2 assaults.  Rarely on places like temple ship I go for 2 medics.  I do have terrible luck with the RNG.  I wish there was some stat/roll option where you could see what you rolled, like Neverwinter Nights, still sucks having a sniper with 95% accuracy and missing, but then I could at least SEE why I missed.
     
    But I will disagree with one part,
    EVGATech_DarrelM
    Luck can affect your game as little or as much as you let it......

    Because no amount of skill and strategy can protect you from rolling misses on every XCom agent for 2 consecutive turns......  Like when I lost a game of Risk once in like 4 or 5 turns.....I rolled one 3 once, everything else was 2's or 1's.
     
    I have learned to swear by Hunker down.... such a huge help, more so in Long War.
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    DarrelM
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    Re: XCOM 2 (update vid) 2015/09/02 14:31:51 (permalink)
    Yeah, theres times where luck can still play a large factor. I've lost a troop the other day because he got shot at by someone who was being suppressed and still managed to land a hit.
     
    There are many ways reduce the impact that luck can have in your game though.
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