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Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money.

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Timpster-GPU_Nvidia_660Ti
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2014/08/01 18:56:11 (permalink)
Light pollution is a big deal.  You may not think so, but let me explain.
It literally benefits NOBODY - it actually screws up the uh, food chain rhythm.
It kills COUNTLESS - HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS of birds, confuses and kills turtles, affects frogs feeding and mating patterns, and so many other things like that, that aren't popping into my brain right now.  In fact, I don't want to think about the rest of it.
 
It wastes BILLIONS of dollars, in light that points UPWARD - you know all those orange street lamps, (high pressure sodium), well look very closely, and if it's near a tree, you see parts of the tree ABOVE THE LIGHT being lit up.  
 
Not to mention it affects our own human health (and safety, which I'll get into a bit later).
We humans, along with a bunch of other animals, have literally evolved around the Sun.
It gets bright in the daytime, and it gets dark at night.  It's that simple -- well not anymore.
 
Seeing bright light at night, like that from white lights from gas stations, shopping areas, and other places, really screws up your sleep, and it can trick your body into believing that it's daytime, just because the light is closer to that of daytime (but actually looks nothing like it, because so far I haven't seen a light that accurately displays daylight.)  and so your sleep will then be delayed -- so what you sleep a bit later.
 
Well it's actually not that damn simple.  When y-- hold on, let me make my monitor more night friendly by turning on Darkroom mode in f.lux, black background and red text... WOAH!  That's nice, now I can actually think better.
 
When you start to get sleepy, a hormore called melatonin starts ramping up it's production to lull you into sleepyness, but it does SO MUCH MORE!
 
This hormone actually can suppress and even KILL cancerous cells, edit -- maybe not all of them, and it's surely not always a miracle worker, but as far as I know it's the only natural line of defense from cancers.
THIS MEANS YOU NEED TO SLEEP VERY WELL IF YOU ARE AT RISK FOR CANCER, OR HAVE IT.
Do your own research, it's good for you, and you'll find more that way, I've done enough reading about all this as it is. (not trying to be rude).
EDIT: the following link may help a little:
http://www.justgetflux.com/research.html
This makes sleep extremely important, and there's probably a lot more that melatonin does that I'm not familiar with at all, so if you find something, please share it!
 
So we've covered wildlife disruption, sleep, and cancer risks, so if you live in an area with a lot of light pollution, not only will you not sleep as well, but it can give you a higher rate of cancer (what it cancer anyway?).
 
BUT WAIT - THERE'S MORE!
Not only does all this negative arise from light pollution, there's one more thing that very few people are aware of, and this is something that I just learned about 2 - 3 days ago.

 
Naturally there are some form of ... I think it's called nitrate, anyway, some substance, that in darkness, will clear away some of the smog--actually it will PREVENT some air particles from turning into smog and other pollutants, but ONLY IF IT IS DARK.
So now, you not only have, killed wildlife, disrupted ecosystems, human health hazards, wasted money, but now you ALSO have more air pollution.

 
Have I said enough or do you want me to keep going because I think I left one or two things out that I can't think of at the moment -- but you hopefully get my point. 
 
Edit, whoops missed the safety part, well I get on that tomorrow, it's... about 10 PM so,
i'll take a break from this post.  When I come back, I want some great feedback!
 
TL;DR: LIGHT POLLUTION IS REALLY REALLY BAD - and the best thing about it is, it's the EASIEST form of pollution to fix: Point light DOWN instead of UP!
So why don't we go ahead and fix it? 
------------------------------------------------------------
Discussed in this thread are also topics such as the brightness of a light, and the fact that, bright is NOT always better at night, for seemingly obvious reasons.
------------------------------------------------------------
 
What are your thoughts?
post edited by Timpster-GPU_Nvidia_660Ti - 2014/08/03 07:14:25

If you use a computer at night, check out f.lux
Research: https://justgetflux.com/research.html
Download: https://www.justgetflux.com/
This reduces how blue (6500k) the screen is and looks better once you get used to it - the getting used to may take up to a week!
  Your screen will be "more orange" at night but it's for the best. In about 20 minutes your eyes won't even notice.  A white paper should match your screen, maybe play with the monitor settings to get it closer.

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    XrayMan
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/01 18:58:37 (permalink)
     
    Locking for review.
     
     
    EDIT: Foul language was removed. Unlocking. (OP you have a PM)
    post edited by XrayMan - 2014/08/01 19:17:29

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    BF3PRO
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/01 20:00:03 (permalink)
    Melatonin cannot kill cancerous cells if thats the case my grandmother never should have gotten caner... Can I see scientific evidence? Otherwise good editorial...
    post edited by BF3PRO - 2014/08/01 20:30:47

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    knightsilver
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/01 20:21:26 (permalink)
    We're all doomed, oh no's!

    Who let Doctor Doom out of his cell this time?
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    Timpster-GPU_Nvidia_660Ti
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/01 20:26:46 (permalink)
    I'm very sorry, I have re typed that area of the post so it's more realistic and more honest.
    post edited by Timpster-GPU_Nvidia_660Ti - 2014/08/03 07:15:06

    If you use a computer at night, check out f.lux
    Research: https://justgetflux.com/research.html
    Download: https://www.justgetflux.com/
    This reduces how blue (6500k) the screen is and looks better once you get used to it - the getting used to may take up to a week!
      Your screen will be "more orange" at night but it's for the best. In about 20 minutes your eyes won't even notice.  A white paper should match your screen, maybe play with the monitor settings to get it closer.

    #5
    Porpoise Hork
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/01 23:32:51 (permalink)
    I remember in my youth I used to look up at the stars in my back yard at night and there was no way I could ever count them all. You could even see the center of our galaxy depending on the time of year.
     
    Now during the day the sky is no longer the deep blue of my youth but on most days a milky white from all the aerosols they have and are continuing to spray in the stratosphere. At night I can go out and the moon looks to have a brownish tinge to it with a hazy halo and all I can count the starts I can see now in a few minutes. It's something that pains me on a daily basis. It's only when I visit the in-law's property a few hundred miles out of town in the middle of no where do I see a night time sky that reminds me of the night sky of my youth. It's not the same sky, but it's close to what I remember and nothing like that back at home. 
     
    My wife wonders why when we go I will stretch out in a lawn chair and stare at the stars for a few hours. All I can say in response is I miss the stars, and I miss my deep blue sky.
    post edited by Porpoise Hork - 2014/08/01 23:36:14
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    Timpster-GPU_Nvidia_660Ti
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/02 06:50:59 (permalink)
    It really is sad. We have people that are obsessed with those green pieces of paper, and don't care at all to preserve the earth and keep the air clean. The governments hasn't seemed to step in at all to help us with light pollution and the pharmaceutical industry might care more about money than health. I bet if THEY could see the night sky like we used to, -- you used to, because I haven't, I truly think it would help bring us all a little bit closer.

    We have only had electric light since... I always forget the year, maybe around 1880 or something. So that's about 130 years, and we've had it for that long, but we still don't understand or CARE that light should not go UP, or at any angle above 90 if the light is pointing down, which it should be.
    post edited by Timpster-GPU_Nvidia_660Ti - 2014/08/03 07:15:48

    If you use a computer at night, check out f.lux
    Research: https://justgetflux.com/research.html
    Download: https://www.justgetflux.com/
    This reduces how blue (6500k) the screen is and looks better once you get used to it - the getting used to may take up to a week!
      Your screen will be "more orange" at night but it's for the best. In about 20 minutes your eyes won't even notice.  A white paper should match your screen, maybe play with the monitor settings to get it closer.

    #7
    Timpster-GPU_Nvidia_660Ti
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/02 06:56:11 (permalink)
    Come back to this thread and read what "Porpoise Hork" has typed.
    post edited by Timpster-GPU_Nvidia_660Ti - 2014/08/03 07:16:20

    If you use a computer at night, check out f.lux
    Research: https://justgetflux.com/research.html
    Download: https://www.justgetflux.com/
    This reduces how blue (6500k) the screen is and looks better once you get used to it - the getting used to may take up to a week!
      Your screen will be "more orange" at night but it's for the best. In about 20 minutes your eyes won't even notice.  A white paper should match your screen, maybe play with the monitor settings to get it closer.

    #8
    Timpster-GPU_Nvidia_660Ti
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/02 08:31:04 (permalink)
    Alright, this is more or less a bump but it shows how light pollution can be fixed. You all like reddit right?
    http://www.reddit.com/r/A...s_for_light_pollution/

    also I want to show you a picture that shows you what we are missing.
    post edited by Timpster-GPU_Nvidia_660Ti - 2014/08/03 07:16:51

    Attached Image(s)


    If you use a computer at night, check out f.lux
    Research: https://justgetflux.com/research.html
    Download: https://www.justgetflux.com/
    This reduces how blue (6500k) the screen is and looks better once you get used to it - the getting used to may take up to a week!
      Your screen will be "more orange" at night but it's for the best. In about 20 minutes your eyes won't even notice.  A white paper should match your screen, maybe play with the monitor settings to get it closer.

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    bcavnaugh
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/02 09:10:56 (permalink)
    Most of what I have found is people want to make the night time as bright daylight to fell safe, sad our world has come to this.
    Most of my Neighbors run BRIGHT WHITE Porch Lights and all our street Lights go straight up into the sky and are white as well, our HOA states it is for Safety. Most US States could care less about night sky's and stars and this will never ever change.

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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/02 12:05:09 (permalink)
    I have family doing these "aerosol" cloud seeding and the media has really done it's best to scare people... When we hear these stories we hear from activists not true scientists scientists do not have time to go away from their important work to educate people... It all started with the "crack baby" that never existed....

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    Timpster-GPU_Nvidia_660Ti
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/02 13:13:01 (permalink)
    bcavnaugh
    Most of what I have found is people want to make the night time as bright daylight to fell safe, sad our world has come to this.
    Most of my Neighbors run BRIGHT WHITE Porch Lights and all our street Lights go straight up into the sky and are white as well, our HOA states it is for Safety. Most US States could care less about night sky's and stars and this will never ever change.


    If they REALLY knew anything about safety / security and actually CARED about it, they'd actually do some .... testing and see if it actually worked -- but they don't care enough about it to do that.
     
    Here is an example -- at night when it's relatively dark outside, (hopefully you have windows in your room, EVERY room should have at least one window...) turn on your room light and stand back -- look out the window.
     
    What can you see?  (yes the reflection will really screw you over, but this is a nice test.)  Are you having difficulties seeing ANYTHING at all?  That's because
    A.  Your light is reflecting off of your window,
    B.  Your eyes have adjusted to the brighter lights in the room.
     
    OK how about this, instead of a window, use your door that goes outside.
     
    Turn on your lights, open that door, and stand back a good 20 - 30 feet.
    How well can you see outside?  I would imagine it's much harder, and it's for the same reason as mentioned above.
    That's why 
    BRIGHTER LIGHTS ARE NOT ALWAYS BETTER -- ESPECIALLY FOR THE PERSON STANDING IN THE BRIGHTER LIGHT.  THIS WILL LIMIT YOUR ABILITY TO SEE IN THE DARKER AREAS BY A NUMBER OF YARDS.
    Explanation below!
     
    Far too many people believe that brighter light is better / safer for them -- if you're one of those people, please speak up, I would really like to know why.  I want this thought to really be THOUGHT about by the people who believe it.

     
    It's not safe for you -- in fact it makes your LESS SAFE because think about this:
    Let's say some person was hiding in the woods near a tree, and you're standing under / near a bright security light.  Guess who's gonna see who first.  THAT is the problem, and I think way too few people think about that, and it NEEDS to be stopped, immediately.  So I said I'd get on the safety topic, and you all brought it up - thank you, because I forgot about it, so there's that!
     
    I really like this thread, thank you to all contributors, if you can bring in some people to this, because I want to read peoples opinions on the "bright(er) light = safer" idea.
    post edited by Timpster-GPU_Nvidia_660Ti - 2014/08/03 07:17:48

    If you use a computer at night, check out f.lux
    Research: https://justgetflux.com/research.html
    Download: https://www.justgetflux.com/
    This reduces how blue (6500k) the screen is and looks better once you get used to it - the getting used to may take up to a week!
      Your screen will be "more orange" at night but it's for the best. In about 20 minutes your eyes won't even notice.  A white paper should match your screen, maybe play with the monitor settings to get it closer.

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    wrinvert
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/02 13:15:18 (permalink)
    this post made me leave the porch light on all night last night. and its a old 100watt incandescent bulb.


     
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    Timpster-GPU_Nvidia_660Ti
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/02 13:44:03 (permalink)
    wrinvert
    this post made me leave the porch light on all night last night. and its a old 100watt incandescent bulb.


    But you didn't sit directly under it did you? (is the light in front of you - I mean shining forward from where you are sitting?)
    If you're on the porch, does the light seemingly let you see farther into what would otherwise be the darkness?  (and when the light from the bulb stops -- meaning the ground is dark again where the light can't get to, how far can you see beyond that?
     
    Also I absolutely LOVE Incandescent bulbs, and I do have a 100 watt that I will occasionally turn on in the daytime, and WOW is it beautiful.
    I would recommend a 40 watt at night though, just so it's not as bright, and it's a warmer color.  I really want you to run a couple tests at night, with your bulb on and off.
    Leave it on, and see just how CLEAR you can see into the darkness - I know that's not the right word to use, but could you see well enough to see a person / animal.
     
    Turn it off, and compare how much you can see after 10 minutes (or more) of just looking into the darkness, how well could you see a person / animal in the distance?
    Let me know in a few days please, it would really help clear up this matter for millions of people.  We could use this thread as a reference for those that are unaware of this.
    post edited by Timpster-GPU_Nvidia_660Ti - 2014/08/03 07:18:47

    If you use a computer at night, check out f.lux
    Research: https://justgetflux.com/research.html
    Download: https://www.justgetflux.com/
    This reduces how blue (6500k) the screen is and looks better once you get used to it - the getting used to may take up to a week!
      Your screen will be "more orange" at night but it's for the best. In about 20 minutes your eyes won't even notice.  A white paper should match your screen, maybe play with the monitor settings to get it closer.

    #14
    bcavnaugh
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/02 13:54:20 (permalink)
    wrinvert
    this post made me leave the porch light on all night last night. and its a old 100watt incandescent bulb.


    That is what my Neighbors have installed as well.

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    Timpster-GPU_Nvidia_660Ti
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/02 14:03:54 (permalink)
    Well, I've made a bunch of post so be sure to read through them!
     
    Yeah, about the bright lights (AT LEAST they are Incandescent, a nice yellow / white, and not a bluish white!)  Dimmer is better at night, for YOUR safety - and it makes "the bad guy" LESS safe, because it makes it harder for them to see (well and then you could "blind" them with the bright light, but the problem there, is you might blind yourself, so don't do that.
     
    In fact a key element in these security lights is where is the light pointed.
     
    I'm not an expert in this area for security lights but I might get some time and do some testing.
    Generally, I would think you want the light pointed towards the ground - and NOT horizontally.
     
    Also A BIG thing to make sure of is that when YOU walk towards the security light, is that you have *FULL* VISIBILITY.  What I mean is that you don't have to put your hand over your eyes to help you see -- that's worse than ANYTHING you could do, when setting up a security light.
     
    Also, if you have a problem with your neighbors lights, maybe they shine into your home / yard, then it's not only a nuisance for you, but it's both a waste and can be a huge security flaw for your neighbors because of what I have typed above.  So, I would STRONGLY suggest you talk to them about it, and by the time this thread hopefully get's two or more pages, you have the ability to explain to them that this is NOT safe, and it's also a waste of money, because the light isn't going where it's needed.
    post edited by Timpster-GPU_Nvidia_660Ti - 2014/08/03 07:19:17

    If you use a computer at night, check out f.lux
    Research: https://justgetflux.com/research.html
    Download: https://www.justgetflux.com/
    This reduces how blue (6500k) the screen is and looks better once you get used to it - the getting used to may take up to a week!
      Your screen will be "more orange" at night but it's for the best. In about 20 minutes your eyes won't even notice.  A white paper should match your screen, maybe play with the monitor settings to get it closer.

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    RainStryke
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/02 15:17:02 (permalink)
    A very interesting read, i'm going to have to try the screen f.lux setting. I have a friend that lived about 15 miles out of town, it's nice to go out there sometimes, the sky was extremely clear. A few things are a little annoying though... like the rooster that wouldn't shut up next door... and starts up at about 3-4AM every day. Sometimes you could hear a pack of coyotes tearing something up. In the winter you would get stuck in the snow if you didn't drive a all wheel drive vehicle. Snow plows didn't really take care of the gravel roads.

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    clo007
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/02 17:04:02 (permalink)
    1. Lose the huge font. no need for it.
    2. Many cities already have in place light pollution ordinances.
    3. Read #1 and #2 again



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    XrayMan
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/02 18:58:02 (permalink)
     
    Do not post in all Caps, as this is "Shouting," and is considered rude.   http://forums.evga.com/EVGA-Forums-Terms-of-Use-m4682.aspx
     
    BIG BOLD letters isn't nice either.
     

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    Timpster-GPU_Nvidia_660Ti
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/03 07:07:50 (permalink)
    Alright, I'll lose the bold, sorry, I guess that was getting old.
     
    I had the chance to test EXACTLY what I wanted to, celebrating my brothers birthday, at his house.
    He has 2 security lights, one that points straight out (like to the side just a bit), and a regular light on the corner of the house.
    I IMMEDIATELY noticed I could not see nearly as well in the darker areas, and it didn't take me 10 seconds to realize that.  Just because of those lights, it actually obscured the night sky, and when I was walking around it was harder to see for me at least, because the light was shining right towards my eyes.
     
    It's not something that's easy to implement, and I'm sure it will take more thought than you want to think about - but it will be worth it.
     
    I would think it would be better to have the light LOWER to the ground, and pointed slightly down (and maybe shielded but I don't know how that works) so it's not shining an ANYONE's eyes.  That seems the best solution -- would you all give that a try if at all possible and let me know? 
    Thank you all so much for the comments and feedback,
    Greatly appreciated,
     
    Tim
    post edited by Timpster-GPU_Nvidia_660Ti - 2014/08/03 07:20:11

    If you use a computer at night, check out f.lux
    Research: https://justgetflux.com/research.html
    Download: https://www.justgetflux.com/
    This reduces how blue (6500k) the screen is and looks better once you get used to it - the getting used to may take up to a week!
      Your screen will be "more orange" at night but it's for the best. In about 20 minutes your eyes won't even notice.  A white paper should match your screen, maybe play with the monitor settings to get it closer.

    #20
    Randolla
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/03 11:14:31 (permalink)
    I think I have an extra soapbox.......

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    #21
    Timpster-GPU_Nvidia_660Ti
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/03 17:07:43 (permalink)
    Randolla
    I think I have an extra soapbox.......

    That's just rude, I'm sure it was meant to be funny, that's fine.

    Light pollution is the easiest to fix though, I'm not doing this for nothing.

    If you use a computer at night, check out f.lux
    Research: https://justgetflux.com/research.html
    Download: https://www.justgetflux.com/
    This reduces how blue (6500k) the screen is and looks better once you get used to it - the getting used to may take up to a week!
      Your screen will be "more orange" at night but it's for the best. In about 20 minutes your eyes won't even notice.  A white paper should match your screen, maybe play with the monitor settings to get it closer.

    #22
    awalleyeguy
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/03 17:23:04 (permalink)
     Perhaps all the lights pointing up and such are so we can't see things in the sky the government doesn't want us to see.
    #23
    Timpster-GPU_Nvidia_660Ti
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/03 17:25:08 (permalink)
    Naw, the cities are working on it--the big cities that is.

    If you use a computer at night, check out f.lux
    Research: https://justgetflux.com/research.html
    Download: https://www.justgetflux.com/
    This reduces how blue (6500k) the screen is and looks better once you get used to it - the getting used to may take up to a week!
      Your screen will be "more orange" at night but it's for the best. In about 20 minutes your eyes won't even notice.  A white paper should match your screen, maybe play with the monitor settings to get it closer.

    #24
    BF3PRO
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/03 18:37:23 (permalink)
    Honestly if I want to cause light pollution I should be able to no one should be allowed to tell what someone can and cannot do on their property if they aren't paying the property tax or mortgage then again that is why I refuse to move into a neighborhood with an HOA...

    My Affiliate Code: OEESSSDNZV

     
    #25
    XrayMan
    Insert Custom Title Here
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/03 18:39:33 (permalink)
    BF3PRO
    Honestly if I want to cause light pollution I should be able to no one should be allowed to tell what someone can and cannot do on their property if they aren't paying the property tax or mortgage then again that is why I refuse to move into a neighborhood with an HOA...




    Own your own home ftw.           

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    #26
    JGLuxe
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/03 18:43:49 (permalink)
    I have 7W Bulbs outside that light up brighter than a 65W incandescent light.

    i9-12900ks @ | 128GB DDR4 | RTX 3090 FTW3 ULTRA
     
     
    #27
    bcavnaugh
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/03 18:51:07 (permalink)
    BF3PRO
    Honestly if I want to cause light pollution I should be able to no one should be allowed to tell what someone can and cannot do on their property if they aren't paying the property tax or mortgage then again that is why I refuse to move into a neighborhood with an HOA...


    So I have to ask then, dose that mean that you can shoot and kill passerby's that walk on the sidewalk?
    Or shoot down a plan that fly's over your property?
    This is that is what I would like to ask

    Associate Code: 9E88QK5L7811G3H


     
    #28
    BF3PRO
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/03 19:03:15 (permalink)
    bcavnaugh
    BF3PRO
    Honestly if I want to cause light pollution I should be able to no one should be allowed to tell what someone can and cannot do on their property if they aren't paying the property tax or mortgage then again that is why I refuse to move into a neighborhood with an HOA...


    So I have to ask then, dose that mean that you can shoot and kill passerby's that walk on the sidewalk?
    Or shoot down a plan that fly's over your property?
    This is that is what I would like to ask


        If someone is not on my property without my permission and does not read the signs and tries to cause damage to myself, family, or property I don't care... Sidewalks are public domain and I don't own the sky...  So that question is irrelevant if someone comes on my property and causes damage or should not be there I warn them to leave and post the property...  I've only had one squatter on my property and he will never be back (he was shot my father and I were investigated and he went to jail for attacking us)...  As long as I don't hurt another individual then why not do what I want?  Again if I cause harm to someone or their property then I expect to be shot and if someone causes harm to me or my property they should expect to be shot...

    My Affiliate Code: OEESSSDNZV

     
    #29
    bcavnaugh
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    Re: Light Pollution - losing sight of stars benefiting NOBODY. Kills wildlife wastes money 2014/08/03 20:00:47 (permalink)
    BF3PRO
    bcavnaugh
    BF3PRO
    Honestly if I want to cause light pollution I should be able to no one should be allowed to tell what someone can and cannot do on their property if they aren't paying the property tax or mortgage then again that is why I refuse to move into a neighborhood with an HOA...


    So I have to ask then, dose that mean that you can shoot and kill passerby's that walk on the sidewalk?
    Or shoot down a plan that fly's over your property?
    This is that is what I would like to ask


       If someone is not on my property without my permission and does not read the signs and tries to cause damage to myself, family, or property I don't care... Sidewalks are public domain and I don't own the sky...  So that question is irrelevant if someone comes on my property and causes damage or should not be there I warn them to leave and post the property...  I've only had one squatter on my property and he will never be back (he was shot my father and I were investigated and he went to jail for attacking us)...  As long as I don't hurt another individual then why not do what I want?  Again if I cause harm to someone or their property then I expect to be shot and if someone causes harm to me or my property they should expect to be shot...


    That is why did not ask.
    PS When are you going to upload some images of your Rig?

    uploads of 999x999 works best.
    post edited by bcavnaugh - 2014/08/03 20:03:51

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    #30
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