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Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help?

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gigatexal
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2014/04/22 16:58:49 (permalink)
I've solved the acpi interrupt storm I used to get with a grub argument passing of noapic and acpi=off (well not a real solution, a real solution would probably be a kernel recompile) but if anyone had any experiences with SR2's and Xen and this interrupt storm, some pointers would be helpful thanks
 
 
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    gigatexal
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/23 22:50:58 (permalink)
    anyone?
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    gordan79
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/24 05:35:38 (permalink)
    Try booting the kernel with pcie_aspm=off
     

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    gigatexal
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/24 08:47:27 (permalink)
    Will do, thanks!
     
    @gordan79, I actually joined after seeing some posts from you about Virtualisation and the SR2. I googled and saw a thread here, and reading through your sig and that thread, I saw that you had gotten an OC'd SR-2 up and running just like I would like to eventually get mine.
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    gordan79
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/24 09:11:36 (permalink)
    Good luck, and be prepared for a whole world of pain and maintaining your own custom build of Xen. IOMMU on the SR-2 is badly broken due to the NF200 bridges.
     
    It's doable with a few bodges - my bodge results in 2.5GB of RAM going missing from each VM you run, so if you give a VM 8GB only 5.5GB will be usable. But with 96GB of RAM in the machine and two 16GB VMs I can just about live with that.
     
    The problem is that when you assign the VM more RAM than the bottom of the used PCI IOMEM range the data the VM writes to what it thinks is memory ends up being written to the PCI aperture, which both crashes the card using that memory and usually the host as well. If you are unlucky and it overwrites IOMEM belonging to a disk controller it will trash the contents of the disks, too. It is quite a dangerous and nasty hardware design bug of the NF200 bridges. My solution is to set up the guest memory with the memory hole in the guest being large enough to cover all of the physical PCI IOMEM range, and by luck more than anything, where Xen's Seabios and HVMLoader decide to map the GPU's IOMEM in the VM happens to not clash with any of the physical IOMEM ranges. It's a horrible bodge, but it works for me.
     
    You will then need some modified Nvidia cards; I recommend a GTX480 BIOS soft-modded strap to Quadro 6000, a GTX680 hard-modded to a Tesla K10 by removing one resistor off the back of the card, or a GTX780Ti hard-modded to a Quadro K6000 by soldering a 33K 1206 resistor across two of the EEPROM pins. Make sure you don't get a Gainward card, they can be problematic with VGA passthrough.
     
    To summarize - it can be made to work, but be prepared to put in a non-trivial amount of work into it. I'm happy to share details and patches so you won't have to do the hardest part of the bleeding edge trail blazing, but if you aren't comfortable with building your own packages and BIOS hex-editing safe yourself the trouble and get a different motherboard that is known to work properly in the kind of setup we are discussing here.

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    gigatexal
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/24 10:14:19 (permalink)
    Since I won't be doing any GPU passthrough I should be ok right? Is KVM any better than Xen when creating/hosting VMs? I'm not married to either Xen or KVM, as I'm just looking to run one or two VMs, the most important of which being a Windows Server 2012 R2 install running SQL server.
     
    Thanks for the heads up.
     
    My box is similar to yours, too.
     
    dual x5660s currently at 3.6ghz, will likely scale it back to 21x167 for 3.5ghz
    96GB of ddr3 1866
    6 240GB ssds in raid10 using ZFS on Ubuntu right now
     
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    gordan79
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/24 10:39:00 (permalink)
    Your system is indeed nearly identical to mine. I wouldn't bother clocking the CPUs down if you can keep them cool. The main stability bottleneck is bclk. I find mine get up to 90C under full load with 3 GPUs and 15 disks also running flat out (e.g. CudaMiner on GPUs with disks scrubbing, and miners on the CPUs). Your temperatured may differ.
     
    If you won't be using GPU passthrough you shouldn't have any problems at all. I use Xen because it is the only one with even a hope of running GPU passthrough on this motherboard. If that isn't a factor for your usage, use whatever is best supported and documented on your distro. Disable IOMMU and it should all work just fine. You could even use VMware Player 5.x (6.x 3D acceleration is broken) if you only plan to do casual gaming at <= 1080p.

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    gigatexal
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/24 10:43:49 (permalink)
    sweet, I'm pretty excited. I'll try out that grub option and see which works best, either kvm or xen.
     
    As for downclocking, I have it prime95 stable at 3.8 now but the temps rise such that the fans kick in and the box being in my bedroom (900D with 2 coolermaster 120mm aio w/c units in push/pull) I need it to be silent or close to it at medium load.
     
    thanks again for the tip
     
    A bit off topic, but still annoying, when did the distros go to a super convoluted approach to grub and the like? Grub.cfg is created by scripts upon scripts. It used to be a simple manual entry.
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    gordan79
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/24 11:00:12 (permalink)
    I only just noticed you plan to run a database load in a VM. You should be aware that you are likely to see a throughput drop at full saturation of about 40% from running virtualized. Probably not an issue if it's just a development/testing/play machine, though.
     
    Prime95 is useless at stability checking. Use OCCT and minerd, it will show up issues much more reliably.
     
    I am cursing most of the recent, pointless changes in distros, both in Grub2 and the switch to systemd. Complete waste of time for no meaningful benefit and a massive increase in complexity and decrease in transparency.

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    gigatexal
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/24 11:08:54 (permalink)
    gordan79
     
    I am cursing most of the recent, pointless changes in distros, both in Grub2 and the switch to systemd. Complete waste of time for no meaningful benefit and a massive increase in complexity and decrease in transparency.




    I agree completely.
     
    40% drop from virtualizing? That's steep. It's not a production system by any means. I thought the whole idea behind xen and kvm was that the paravirtualized idea was to get really close to baremetal as possible. 40% seems steep.
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    gordan79
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/24 11:31:44 (permalink)
    I did some testing, see here:
    http://www.altechnative.net/2012/08/04/virtual-performance-part-1-vmware/
     
    The hit on database loads will be worse because the disk I/O translation is expensive even when paravirtualized. You might avoid some of it if you pass through the SATA/SAS controller using PCI passthrough to the guest, but then you are back in the situation where you need working IOMMU, as per the GPU passthrough case described above. I run paravirtualized I/O drivers on HVM Windows guests, and the overhead is very much non-trivial.

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    gigatexal
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/24 11:54:55 (permalink)
    Interesting. My plan was to just give the Xen or KVM vm a nice SSD zfs filegroup to use.
     
    Pass it to the VM something along these lines:
     
    ...kvm windowshost drives=/datastore/vm/windows/200G.img or something (I know that's not the right syntax)
     
    I'll do some reading on that link you posted. All of this might be moot as I have 2 56GBit ConnectX-3 cards I might use if I use the SR2 as a non virtualized 2012R2 host and have a different box be the ZFS on Linux host instead linking them with the infiniband, which creates it's own issues with iSCSI and infiniband and RDMA and all that jazz.
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    gigatexal
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/24 13:04:48 (permalink)
    The thread at the end of your post was informative. I've never thought about it really but I used to run esxi and then just virtualize a single vm and always gave it a few cpus less than max, hah what a waste.
     
    Given the hassle I might just baremetal the sr2 and use the supermicro system for zfs
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    gordan79
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/24 13:56:14 (permalink)
    Depends on how much performance you need. If one machine is sufficient why use two? That's why I replaced two gaming rigs and a workstation with one big machine and virtualization.
     
    Also you might want to use a zvol rather than image file. ISCSI can also add overheads and be complex to tune to optimal settings, so better avoided if you can.

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    gigatexal
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/24 15:38:14 (permalink)
    Yes a Zvol would be better as I can set individual settings on it like compression and dedup.
     
    Regarding the two machines: That's what I'm debating. On one hand I hate the idea of leaving performance on the table in the name of consolidation. But it's not a production server so... And I can sell the supermicro box and have more cash for other things. But since this project really started to be a learning experience, perhaps wading through some infiniband / iSCSI issues might be a good learning process.
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    gordan79
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/25 00:21:21 (permalink)
    Virtualization would be a good learning experience, too.

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    gigatexal
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/25 09:51:45 (permalink)
    This is true, especially with the wealth of knowledge from people who have done it before.
     
    This is going to be a fun weekend.
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    Gratuitous
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/25 13:54:46 (permalink)
    This thread is very informative. I had been following your posts for a wile Gordan79 but was not aware of exactly what you were doing with your SR-2 projects till now. I see you have a blog. Any time to write up a detailed case study on what you have accomplished? My initial purchase a few years ago of an SR-2 based machine was to do what you guys are doing. Unfortunately having no previous experience with virtual machines and the initial problems I found with it, led me to put that use on the sidelines and I have been using the box as a 3d modeling production tool. I have ironed out so many bugs in my setup that it has been running very stable and successfully in that usage for almost 2 years now. I still don't find any single machine that will outperform my setup to this day within a reasonable cost.
     
    I would love to set this up as a remote desktop server at some point but don't want to spend all the time to go through all the headaches you have outlined. I specifically can't risk data loss or disk failure even though I do multi-tier backups. The research you did on modifying cards to allow passthrough is most impressive as the cost to get into one of those 'supported' solutions is ridiculous. I also love how ambiguous Citrix is on their website. basically they try as hard as they can to get a consultant out to tell you whether their solution will work instead of just explaining what the software actually does and doesn't do. Corporate BS. gotta love it.

    “I built a castle in the swamp and it sunk. I built a second castle and it sunk too. I built a third castle and it burned down and then sunk. But the fourth castle, Ahhhh! That one stood.”
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    gordan79
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/25 14:23:39 (permalink)
    The problem is that there are so many pitfalls with PCI pass through. That is the reason why there is only a handful of workstations certified to work with VGA passthrough.
     
    I've been meaning to write it all up for months, but I haven't gotten around to it. Partly because the Xen patch I had to write isn't even remotely production ready or suitable for public consumption. There are issues with it, for example, the memory that goes missing in domU.

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    Gratuitous
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/25 14:37:58 (permalink)
    I hear you. I did grab a second SR-2 for playing around with VM's but unfortunately I let all its smoke out and ran out of time and patience to buy a third. It was an impressive bit of smoke though:)

    “I built a castle in the swamp and it sunk. I built a second castle and it sunk too. I built a third castle and it burned down and then sunk. But the fourth castle, Ahhhh! That one stood.”
    —Monty Python and the Holy Grail
     
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    Gratuitous
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/25 14:46:02 (permalink)
    I did have a question for you though seeing as you have quite a bit of hardware knowledge. Is the option rom space contained within the eeprom for the bios? If so is it possible to get a larger eeprom and port the bios to the new chip?

    “I built a castle in the swamp and it sunk. I built a second castle and it sunk too. I built a third castle and it burned down and then sunk. But the fourth castle, Ahhhh! That one stood.”
    —Monty Python and the Holy Grail
     
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    gordan79
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/25 14:59:51 (permalink)
    Most of the extra ROMs are separate, e.g. the Marvell SATA BIOS. What exactly are you trying to achieve?
     
    Funnily enough I have two SR-2s as well. One I got new and had nothing but trouble. 2 RMAs thus far. Haven't had a chance to even test the last one they sent. I suspect EVGA will rue the day (if they don't already) they put a 10 year warranty on these. The other SR-2 I bought 2nd hand on eBay and it has never skipped a beat. If it wasn't for that one to cross check against for sanity check, I'd have given up months ago.

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    Gratuitous
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/25 15:09:40 (permalink)
    I didn't mean to derail the thread. I haven't actually thought about upgrading my setup in a wile because it actually does exactly what it is supposed to. Back in the day though it seemed to be a problem to get 4 - 4gig gpu's along with a raid controller to not run into option rom limitations. Jacob seemed to have eluded to the point that they ran out of bios space to fix this and a few of the other bios issues. I am FAR from having the patience to pursue learning how to rewrite bioses though and most of the people who were doing that sort of thing have long since moved on to newer platforms. I could be completely chasing the wrong animal but it seems that some of the incompatibility issues with raid cards and the newer pcie ssds could benefit from extra free option rom. probably the whole bios would need to be ported (I am guessing here ) from 32bit or 16 bit to 64 bit to take advantage though.

    “I built a castle in the swamp and it sunk. I built a second castle and it sunk too. I built a third castle and it burned down and then sunk. But the fourth castle, Ahhhh! That one stood.”
    —Monty Python and the Holy Grail
     
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    gordan79
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/26 00:19:14 (permalink)
    The problem is that you only get so much BIOS space in legacy mode. You need to go UEFI for more advanced things. If you are running out of BIOS space you can always disable some of the on-board BIOSes, e.g. network booting for NICs or eSATA.
     
    I don't think GPUs eat option ROM space because only the primary GPU actually POSTs, the rest are initialised by the driver.
     
    Also, don't underestimate the problem proneness of the NF200 bridges with various hardware. Most of the time BIOS isn't an issue. It's only a problem for boot related issues. Once the OS boots, drivers can initialise all the hardware even if BIOS didn't - subject to other hardware problems and workarounds (e.g. phantom devices with VT-d+NF200 with PCIX bridged SAS cards, driver issues with recent ATI cards, etc.).
    post edited by gordan79 - 2014/04/26 00:26:43

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    gigatexal
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/26 01:23:12 (permalink)
    pcie_aspm=off didn't work for booting xen but no biggie. I decided to try out kvm + virtio and for a total noob it's working great. Virt-manager is a slick gui. I'll come back to xen should kvm + virtio prove awful
    post edited by gigatexal - 2014/04/26 01:32:15
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    gordan79
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/26 05:27:46 (permalink)
    Note that pcie_asmp is a kernel command line switch, not a xen command line switch. You shouldn't need any special xen parameters.

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    gigatexal
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/26 09:24:46 (permalink)
    i added it to grub but it could have been a typo on my end. I'll circle back to it when my dinking around with kvm is done
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    gigatexal
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/27 22:47:11 (permalink)
    going to have to see if i can't get the acpi issues fixed, with acpi set to off I have no hyperthreading...not a deal breaker as 12- real threads is pretty good, and I might be benefitting from less context switching overhead...but still
     
    currently rocking noapic acpi=off, could try the aspm you mentioned Gordon, as well. Using noapic and acpi=ht results in a stall at boot and it just sits there with a black screen
    #28
    gordan79
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/27 23:24:02 (permalink)
    All I can say is that it works for me with 3.9.9 kernel and pciehp module removed/blacklisted. Unfortunately pciehp is no longer a module in later kernels, but that is what pcie_aspm=off is supposed to work around.

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    gigatexal
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    Re: Overclocked SR-2 Ubuntu 14.04 3.13 kernel, rebooting when booting to Xen Kernel, Help? 2014/04/28 09:31:01 (permalink)
    hmm
     
    I think I'll try passing pci_aspm=off, acpi=ht, noapic; or some combination of the three.
     
    My apologies for seemingly going in circles.
    #30
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